Mocha's 19 Rogue Guide

There are a few issues imo.

I would prefer Gloomshroud armor instead BoA.

Rings: Seal of Argas and Ello's ring. Meavy Stendel's wedding band? +7 crit (i prefer 6agility)

One shadowfang for procs is not bad at all.

And subtely does not do good dmg using swords.

Rings: Seal of Argas and Ello's ring. Meavy Stendel's wedding band? +7 crit (i prefer 6agility)

One shadowfang for procs is not bad at all.

And subtely does not do good dmg using swords.

Stacking agility and/or ap will increase ambush damage and weapon attacks. However, a rogues #1 damaging ability by far is EF. With that being said I stack stamina and crit to increase EF's chances of critting as EF is not affected by agility and/or AP which renders agility and/or AP nearly useless. With my set I can eat ambushes and still have well over 2k hp. EF is all the damage any rogue needs in my opinion.

When EF does more damage than all of a rogues attacks combined, it makes sense to increase your top damaging ability and not increase other sources of damage which are minute in comparison.


As for Sub vs Combat:

Sub is the way to go for me because:
1) You can dot up several targets which result in many, many ef procs.
2) Hemo has less energy than Sinister Strike which results in more attacks, more dots, more EF procs.
 
That's not how RPPM works, sorry.

I understand the difference between PPM and RPPM.




When playing a rogue which has no gap closer besides a swiftness potion, your time on target is very limited. Your only way of increasing your time on target whilst not having any gap closers is to utilize Damage Over Time spells to theoretically give you greater Time on Target. This is whilst not even being in melee range of your target.
 
This is completely misguided. There are races for both factions that are significantly better than others.

UD is probably one of the worst options for 19 as there are very few Warlocks.

For horde: Orc/Belf > Goblin > Panda > Troll > UD

Alliance: Nelf/Worgen > Dwarf/Gnome > Human

You also have no fathom of Jump Boxes.

Races and genders across races have different jump boxes which can create a significant advantage or disadvantage which is particular to your personal preferences and/or play style.
 
Added math section:



Some math on why I feel as though my set is the way to go:




haste is more than twice as effective at increasing EF damage than crit.

This above statement is incorrect.


Lets say you stacked +58 haste which is quite generous for a rogue as I can't see why you would stack over 53 haste. For arguments sake lets say you stacked 58 haste.


58 haste = 22% haste


Out of 156 trials, an average EF noncrit is 109 and an average crit is 184.


To have a haste rating of roughly 22% would increase your rppm to 12 ppms up from EFs normal 10 ppms.

To get a haste rating of 58, your crit would be 17%. Out of 12 EF procs per minute, 17 percent of those would be crits and 83% would be noncrits. That would equal 2 crits and 10 noncrits.

10x109 = 1090
2x184 = 368

1090+368 = 1458 ef damage per minute stacking haste and having 17% crit


Now for rogue not stacking haste with a crit % of 30 % and ef procs of 10 per minute.

Simply this would be 3 crits and 7 noncrits.

7x109 = 763
3x184 = 552

763 + 552 = 1315 ef damage for a rogue with 30% crit

...Okay so stacking haste would give you more EF damage per minute.... let's continue:


The energy gain of 1 haste is just short of 0.04 but we're going to round to 0.04

so

58x .0.04 = 2.32 bonus energy per second for stacking haste


Now 1458 - 1315 = 143 bonus EF damage per minute for stacking haste instead of crit. (which is by no means anywhere near twice as effective) and you're losing 13 crit % for the gain of 143 damage + 2.32 energy per second


Conclusion

So by me stacking stamina and crit, (to your surprise) I am actually looking at more than just EF damage and I had created a point where I can maximize EF damage while being in, and out of melee range... whilst still maximizing in melee range combat and survivability. Now to relate this to the entire AP vs stam + crit thing:

134 ap = 38.29 dps
117 ap = 33.43 dps

2717 hp - 2052 hp
= 665 hp


So a 4.86 dps loss for 665 HP? I'll take it any day.


 
obviously different builds for different situations/players. i play with maximum ap and 14% versatility most of the time but i also have a crit/stam build as well as an FC set that puts me around 2900 hp (very jealous of Gfed rogues here) i just find that i prefer the larger opener over the survivability
 
obviously different builds for different situations/players. i play with maximum ap and 14% versatility most of the time but i also have a crit/stam build as well as an FC set that puts me around 2900 hp (very jealous of Gfed rogues here) i just find that i prefer the larger opener over the survivability

Exactly. My rogue guide will never be a how to on being the best cookie cutter rogue.


My guide is how to play like Mocha, what Mocha does, why I play the way I do and how if you appreciate my play style, you can take the things you like from me and add them to your arsenal and create your own play style.
 
Exactly. My rogue guide will never be a how to on being the best cookie cutter rogue.


My guide is how to play like Mocha, what Mocha does, why I play the way I do and how if you appreciate my play style, you can take the things you like from me and add them to your arsenal and create your own play style.

i think that if you add the different gear sets like the 50% crit build and the full ap build in there and put a little bit about each gear style being for different types of players and say what each set is good at that might help people a lot more when making gearing decisions
 
i think that if you add the different gear sets like the 50% crit build and the full ap build in there and put a little bit about each gear style being for different types of players and say what each set is good at that might help people a lot more when making gearing decisions

Mocha, this would be really appreciated :D
 
Glorious stats still gives +1 while peerless stats gives +2. Should also add the leatherworking leg enchant. Human racials are outdated.


Good catch on the glorious vs peerless. I have many twinks with both and they both say +2 but until you mentioned it I had not noticed that glorious only gave 1 despite it reading incorrectly.


Racials section still needs to be updated. Will do soon.
 
Added substantial content to the Gameplay section. I will update other sections in the near future.




Warsong Gulch Tips And Tricks EPIC:
I have created a huge monstrosity of WSG tips that I use subconsciously and daily. This is a lengthy post, but I assure you there is plenty of information that players of all levels can get out of it. As I've mentioned, it is of substantial length, so don't over do it. Read a little bit at a time or whatever works for you.



Dark Jade Focusing Lens:
Not enough people are using these Focusing Lenses. They will shoot a beam directly through any terrain and /or obstacles and follow your target. Use this on EFC if you are standing near the end of your tunnel and you are unsure as to where he is exiting your base from. However, be warned as this will remove you from stealth and will also alert EFC as to your position and that you are on to him. This lens is best used to determine which way EFC is exiting from your base.



RangeDisplay:
This is a prime addon you need to get. It will show a range bracket for your target, your mouseover, and your focus. What this means is, you target EFC via Battleground Targets addon and immediately, it will tell you how far away you are from your target. For example it may say you are 20-25 yards from your target and then it may say your target is 25-30 yards away shortly after. If the distance is rapidly increasing, then you know you are not going going in his direction or that simply you are not nearly as fast as him. This addon is crucial for telling where EFC is. If you are within 60 yards, you can use your Focusing Lens.



Basic WSG Strategy
For the start of the game, you have 2 options. Either sit in your FR at the start or go down tunnel and try to assist with the mid fight. Chances are you'll be nearly useless in the mid fight as it is very well catered to ranged DPS, so your priority is sapping high profile targets on the opposing team which will hopefully result in your team gaining the upper hand. What I often do, is go out, sap the targets and then as soon as I have done my job, I'm already hunting down EFC and headed back to our flag room if I cannot cut him off at the start of the game. If the opposing team does not have a FC going for your flag, your job is now to hang around your healers and attempt to bust any rogues or ferals looking to take out your healers. If the opposing team has no FC, no rogues and no ferals, you can then see about aiding your team in focusing a healer or two, but don't get carried away. All you need to do is drop a few healers before your offense will naturally push the opposing team back. After you've dropped your targets, start heading back to your flag room to look for an incoming FC.


Your sole purpose is to return flags and aid in their returning. What this means is, you will not always be the one ambushing EFC and getting the return. Sometimes you need to be the guy laying down a sap on the healer and missing out on the return credit. As long as your team gets it, it's a win. Regardless, from the second an enemy flag carrier touches your flag to the second he is dead, your job is to be GLUED to him. Wherever he is, you should be and wherever he goes, you need to report in BG chat where he is. If 2 opposing rogues are playing correctly, neither rogue should ever see each other during a match as he will always be on your FC and you will always be on his FC. Your paths really shouldn't cross much at all.


With that in mind, you need to be aware of EFC's position at all times and his potential support. As soon as EFC is entering your base whatever you are in the middle of doing is now irrelevant. You are now to completely drop whatever you are doing, and do whatever you can to prevent EFC from leaving your base at all costs. You won't always be able to kill him, so perhaps chain sapping him is what you need to do. You also must tell your team where EFC is headed so your team can cut him off. The goal is to never let EFC cross mid. You don't want a game to get to the offense and defensive point and building stacks. You want to return the flag as soon as possible. However, sometimes this is not always possible, and perhaps you need to wait for 6 stacks to drop EFC. If this is the case, you need to be ready to open at 5 stacks and your offense needs to be in position as the 6th stack hits. You cannot waste time as the first team to assault EFC is almost always the victorious team.





Cross Sapping:
Cross sapping is one of the most game changing things a rogue can do. Cross sapping is when a rogue saps particularly troublesome opposition DPS in mid to allow your FC to cross mid successfully. Good targets for this would be Hunters looking to conc your FC, Druids mid casting roots on your FC, Mages looking to nova or otherwise snare your FC etc. It's removing your FCs biggest threat from mid which will help him cross.


Locking Down Healers:
How do you take down an EFC with over 4k HP and 5 DPS around him? You cut off his healers while your offense focuses down targets. You have 2 extremely useful abilities when it comes to taking healers out of the play. Sap, and Kick. What you should do, is find a healing caster who is the most effective healer on the opposing team. This is going to be your kick target. What you are then going to do, is find the second most effective healer on the opposing team. Your goal is to kick the most effective healer while having the second most effective healer sapped, while your support is focusing down their top desired target.


Based on the positioning, you may be able to sap secondary, open with an ambush on the EFC and then focus kick the primary healer. If the EFC is not close to the primary healer, your best bet is to simply sap secondary and then open on the primary healer while kicking immediately after opening in attempt to open and kick his mid heal.


If you are going against a team with only a Priest and a Shaman on D (as opposed to double priest, or double shaman, or double MW etc), throw out the most effective / least effective rule of thumb (within reason) and check this out. If you were to sap the Priest, the second he is free of CC, he will cast an instant absorb to mitigate burst which is extremely effective. Now if you sapped a Shaman instead, the instant he is free of CC, he is going to begin casting healing surge. If he casts Riptide instead, he has just wasted a global on a very ineffective heal and chances are his FC will be dead by the time he does get a Healing Surge off. With this in mind, your kick target will be priest and your sap target will be Shaman as a shaman is even more delayed in responding to burst than a priest. Every time you try this maneuver, you should expect your sapped target to trinket so be ready with a BE silence or a resap if he does not pick up combat.




Monitor Your Cool Downs and Consumables!
Cool downs and consumables create a higher level of gameplay. If you use your cool downs effectively you will have a higher rate of survival and success. Know what consumables you can use and when to use them. Do not go all out on consumables just to get dropped when you exit your graveyard. Be smart and conservative about using your consumables until the game is on the line. When fate of the game relies on one play, that is the play where you go all out on your cool downs and your consumables. Most of the time there is no need to waste your AGM on a random person. Unless that one person would be in the progress of leaving your flagroom with your flag and after a long battle you just need that extra cool down to ensure the returning of the flag promptly.
 
Hi, Mocha!
I would like to thank you for this completed guide, that covers all the questions about twinking a rogue.
I liked the most #BiS for different playstyles, #Consumables and #WSG Strategy.
You did a very good job. Thank you very much! :)
 
Excellent guide! May I also throw in a possible item? Red whelp gloves? No bonus stats but combined with it's chance to proc it could contribute some DPS since all you are primarily relying on is elemental force enchant procs.
 
Hi Mocha

Thanks a lot for this guide it was really helpful. Just came back after a long break dusting of an old grandfathered rogue and tried a couple of crazy things (sub multistike rogue and crit assa) before ending on pretty much your BiS list combat spec and versality stacking. Only diff is going full defias 5/5 and missing 1 seal of argas as I won't faction change twice for 2ap.

Cheers and keep up the good work
 

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