Question about f2p twinks / 20-24 twinks

[Lithogen]

Please get the thread back on topic. It's a rare occurrence that discussing this bracket doesn't erupt into a flame war and people nattering at each other.

 

[Mrcer]

ok so i have heard that twinking 24 is disrespectful to the f2p community and i was wondering if it rlly is or not. im sure f2p get mad when there are 24's with chants and stuff... but that made something pop into my head

when twinking was created, the purpose was to be overpowered, compared to all the other people that werent twink/low lvl's (before you got xp in BG's)

so for anyone who twinked back then, and is saying its wrong now, that means it was wrong back then too? or is it not wrong?

another thing is some ppl are lvl 20 twinking, but getting BoA's wich to me seems u mise well get chants and go 24 if your paying for wow.

8/10 ppl i see lvl 20 have BoA's and some of those have stuff you cant even get like the healing mace has +40 something spellpower.

so with all this said, is 24 twinking really unfair, or is it just the definition of what TWINK has always been?

Hopefully I will answer this the best I can.

ok so i have heard that twinking 24 is disrespectful to the f2p community and i was wondering if it rlly is or not. im sure f2p get mad when there are 24's with chants and stuff... but that made something pop into my head

Believe it or not, the main reason why we even created a F2P community is to have a fair chance in BGs against FoTM teams and 24s. While there is an obvious disadvantage in lvl 24 twinks vs F2Ps, You will rarely see more than 5 24s in a single team(even in AB). That is why you hear Aerie Peak does so many premades with F2Ps, so that we can still enjoy this wonderful bracket. In all honesty, when you fight teams like this, the only thing you can do is premade to win:

So I would say, it is not disrespectful to roll a 24. I would argue that is it more challenging to play as a F2P on Aerie Peak than to make a 24. But that should not discourage your adventures of twinking. Do whatever you want.

when twinking was created, the purpose was to be overpowered, compared to all the other people that werent twink/low lvl's (before you got xp in BG's)
so for anyone who twinked back then, and is saying its wrong now, that means it was wrong back then too? or is it not wrong?

It is not wrong to make a 24 Twink, it may be very very unnecessary to do a full 10/15 Man premades of 24s(which some lvl 24 twink guilds do) but not wrong.

another thing is some ppl are lvl 20 twinking, but getting BoA's wich to me seems u mise well get chants and go 24 if your paying for wow.

P2Ps are F2Ps who choose to use the same gear/prof/enchant restrictions as a F2P but can invite other players in order to premade. They enjoy the challenge of being a F2P rather than going to 24. I believe that was ur confusion as to why ppl would stop at 20 instead of 24.

8/10 ppl i see lvl 20 have BoA's and some of those have stuff you cant even get like the healing mace has +40 something spellpower.

The only BoAs that F2Ps do not have access to are the BoA Helms and BoA Cloaks because they require you to either have access to mailbox or to have enough gold to buy it themselves. They can buy the BoA Healing maces.

so with all this said, is 24 twinking really unfair, or is it just the definition of what TWINK has always been?

Twinking has always been about stopping your character at a lower level, and pimping his gear out to be an unstoppable character. Being a level 24 twink instead of a F2P twink does not necessarily make things unfair, just more challenging for anyone who is not a lvl 24 twink. If you decide to make a level 24 twink, you will probably never lose unless you fight a premade of F2Ps or other lvl 24 twinks. But if you play as a F2P Twink, you will find that every game will be challenging; especially as Horde.




Hopefully I answered all your questions/concerns correctly.

 

[Riotxo]

The discussion is pointless unless BiS is the focal point. Should be obvious why. Gearing my new priest has involved jumping the same hurdles as any horde character, and guess what, I sucked it up and got on with it. By doing that instead of whining about it, I already have my LFH and MM.

As for stat differences, see the post above that I just made. When everything is taken into account the gap is much smaller than you elude to. I'll also point out that while you argue that taking out an AGM reduces hp, you fail to mention that resilience will be gained. Might not replace effective health completely, but it's something you and others often overlook, rather conveniently.

So to sumerise, less QQ, more pew pew.

Wait. Your argument is that 6 resilience is equal to 12 stamina? Really? This tells me all I need to know about what your goal is in this argument (I'll give you a hint; it has something to do with how you glossed over my asking if you had any Horde characters).

I even showed you numbers. You are eluding to a "lack of gap" that you have yet to prove. Everyone knows Alliance has a gear advantage. You are literally the ONLY person on this forum that argues otherwise.

Moreover, we can't just talk about BiS toons because most people who do BG's are not BiS. Hence, once again, why Horde ends up losing a majority of PuGs.

 

[Geerraa]

Alpha, love your passion for the game. I truly do, BUT I have to point out one major difference here. The exploit that Mackie used made it impossible for some classes to attack him and even get to him. THAT, to me, is a real exploit. To me, Scoobydrood only uses a "designflaw" in the battleground, yet all classes can still get to him and attack.
But this is just my oppinion...

 

[Scoobydrood]

I was not going to reply after what Lithogen said but this is getting out of control .

First the reason why i didn't eleborate it was because i wanted to see a reaction from you wich worked perfectly.

Genius you manipulated me into a reaction: replying to your post .

when you accuse someone please elaborate why you think this was shopped

I manipulated you into elaborating , gosh we are awesome

Seccondly it looks like it has pixely blurr over there and cause of that it looks like it was placed inbetween of the chat. It feels like it doesn't belong in there. Now that i stretched this picture it has it all over the whole chat, not just the part i point to wich seemed the clearest.

I might have judged you to soon with this, my apologies

So basically if I understood, my screenshot was not shopped , well thats cleared, thank you.

You can see it to when he says "ok then don't answer it" that he didn't got any reply and then said something cause he was annoyed

I understand why may have seemed that way but I should have posted another screenshot , just a few moments earlier I saw the whisper on scooby and replied :

[/URL][/IMG]
So I did not ignore your friend , maybe he was in a hurry replied and logged I have no idea , but note :

' Those are not exploits '

' Why do you think they will make WSG worse '

Now I truly believed that at the time , and that was one of the reasons I actually made this post afterwards to get rid of any doubts :

I'm quite certain they are not ' exploits ' but is it frowned upon to navigate the top of the Alliance/Horde tunnels in this bracket?

You have to understand when making my FC I looked for any tips /guides, I found Darkchewies guide druid FC in twinkinfo section where I learnt all the jumps : http://twinkinfo.com/user-submitted-guides/25012-darkchewie-s-druid-flag-carrying-guide.html

Never occurred to me that 3:38 was an exploit not even sure now if it is cassified as an exploit, especially when it was in guide section from respected player, but I'm really glad you pointed that out as I condone using exploits, after looking into it when you confirmed my doubts it does seem that GM have recently asked players to stop using it , here exert from post blog :

Yet… it’s been in there since WSG launched six years ago, and it’s something that tactics and strategies have adapted around. It’s one of the quirks of the terrain, just like the rocky patches around the zerk huts or kiting melee around the tree stumps while firing at them. Your opponents will use it against you, so you better know how to do it in response. It’s been reported many times on the forums as a bug, but has never been fixed. So folks do the jump.

The warnings, bans, and DCs are likely precursors to an actual fix of the fence. (I so want to see Orc Peons out there repairing the fence when this gets fixed. For real.) The GMs know it’s a problem, they’re watching out for it now, word is getting out that it’s no longer okay for this jump.

, so cheers Qball !


Now your post made me smile Alpha, a somewhat drunk but good hearted barbarian raising his fist in anger, cursing the Gods for misfortune of bad weather came to mind .

Edited to delete quotes from deleted post. - Silin

You seem to have pent up anger towards 24s, and I have no clue who mackie and his/her exploit are, I dislike when a person is trigger happy flamer, judging and insulting person from just a couple posts.

Compare your average F2P twink sitting on 900 hp ,to F2P twink who has really invested time and geared up to BiS etc , the barrier between them is just ' invested time into grinding gear ' does that make the F2P pimped out twink a ' lousy-pathetic ass ' face roller' ? Now the barrier between F2P pimped out twink and P2P is simple , monthly fee, you could even equate money to time as goblin adage goes ' Time is money friend ' , now a lot of F2P are willing to break through first barrier but not the second , we all part of same bracket some willing to push further than others so it is wrong dislike someone just because they did not set their limit were you did. Final point you shoudn't mix being skilled with either level or gear.

Now I did consider going F2P when I discovered these forums , had 21 mage at the time , locked his xp and spammed BG's for a day , what I noticed as we entered the evening was that there was a strong influx of 24s on horde side , and premades, which ended up in graveyard camping etc , so I asked in BG if this was often the case in this bracket , my responses were pretty much along those lines that horde have a lot of 24s and seem to be dominating in the evening , so I thought playing Alliance flag carrier would definitely be a challenge and it has , also in process giving alliance team better shot in the evenings, making games more enjoyable. I really love when we get alliance group to dish out some good teamwork together and I thrive in it , so you see I am not quite what you painted me out to be.

Now hope this clears this unfortunate turn of postage , I am not the kind to hold grudges hope to get to play more games with Qball , alpha & company, get to know you , have good time. Cya on field folks

 

[Alphasky]

LOL, i like you !

 

[Honey Badger]

I feel like I just read entire book . I'm loving the Bromance

 

[Bubbletub]

If anyone has access to it, it's fair game. Crying about it makes you look like a poor player.

I think alpha went all barbarian when he thought scooby was using mackie's exploit.

I love when thread takes a turn for the better , what roller coaster ride ahah so welcome Scoobydrood , have fun while your here

 

[Taeran]

Twinking is about getting the best gear for your level, enchanting it with the best enchants possible. Some say that twinking is unfair, but when has anything in a video game (or in life really) ever been fair? Even at 85 some classes just walk all over others with little resistance and that's certainly unfair, considering that they're the same level and Blizz is always trying to bring things in line.

All in all, it's just an ugly situation that's the result of Blizzard's all consuming greed. The only thing that can be done is for people to accept things as is and either pay for WoW, hope a new game comes out, or hope that Blizz will see the obvious stink of it all and do something.

Greedy? They're a company.

Are you challenging capitalism? There's nothing wrong with that, but don't condemn a company because they're trying to make money; that's the purpose of a company.

However, while as a f2p 24s can become frustrating, f2p players shouldn't complain because they're getting the game for free and Blizzard shouldn't take them into consideration when making changes.

On a f2p standpoint, wait for MoP: you'll be the top of the bracket.

Edit: For the record, I did read the first page and post without reading the rest.

 

[verh]

Greedy? They're a company.

Are you challenging capitalism? There's nothing wrong with that, but don't condemn a company because they're trying to make money; that's the purpose of a company.

However, while as a f2p 24s can become frustrating, f2p players shouldn't complain because they're getting the game for free and Blizzard shouldn't take them into consideration when making changes.

On a f2p standpoint, wait for MoP: you'll be the top of the bracket.

Edit: For the record, I did read the first page and post without reading the rest.

Blizzard is changing the brackets again? Oh my.

 

[Jdoring]

Says an ally hunter....



You have:
+50 hp (even with the orc having Mining and +1 sta on bracers)
+22ap
+2% crit

And you're hit capped, the orc needs 7% hit cap if he doesnt want to miss against Nelfs

Kudos to the guy who thinks you can hit cap against a night elf... You can't. So don't bother

 

[Silinrul]

I've enjoyed watching an actual constructive debate in this thread, but again keep it on track. One more derailment and I will be forced to end the conversation.

Thread Cleaned

 

[Kilda]

I was on the receiving end of Flipzmytoast hate rage just recently.. In fact, even my decision to roll alliance for more even games didn't deter his anger. He says that when im playing horde it's unfair getting globalled, and then when I play with him on Alliance, it leaves him with nothing to do.

His rant was primarily about what sort of person I must be to roll a hunter at 24. (You know, the sad, lonely, pathetic type). This is coming from someone who has dual AGM on his F2P twink surv hunter... Talk about pot calling the kettle black.

Anyway so I took a break - - I don't wanna feel like I'm griefing anybody.. I rolled hunter originally to help carry a losing team, the #1 support class of the bracket. You will NEVER see me GY camping, negative emoting, or condoning that scrub-like behaviour. I'll be capping, returning and blowing the shit out of anything which gets in my way.

I hope to play some games with Scooby. I love players who are 100% objective focussed (no homo). Countless times i've joined games vs GY camping heroes Sabris and his healbitch Clinic. Nothing better than handing their asses back to them.

As for terrain exploiting... I saw that druid vid you posted, and I agree with some of the moves being clever use of the map. But if you are moving to somewhere which renders who untouchable, then that's just not fair.

In my opinion, the rules of exploiting are fairly clear. If you cheat in a game, then you deserve to lose respect from other players.

Edit:- Hey all, couldn't post here for weeks! Back now. This thread is great... some really great points being made from both sides.. Don't derail

 

[Rhaellia]

I've never had a 24 treat me even remotely decently and if you know me, you know I'm not a mean person. After being trolled countless times I'm quite bitter about the whole thing these days. Now I assume automatically any and all 24s are jerks because most of the time, they are. This is not to say my F2P teammates aren't, just to say that any 24 that has ever said something in a BG or to me personally has been either ego-driven or troll-based.

I refuse to heal any 24s, whether I'm playing alliance or horde, I try extra hard to get the last flag so I don't sit there for 15mins in our flag room while those 'honorable defenders' farm those pesky evil alliance/or horde depending on which side you're on of course ;D

24s can't be trusted imo to play fairly or honorably, however, neither can many F2Ps. Leaving me somewhere in the middle.

In regards to respect, if you want respect from us, start acting respectable. Drop the 'you get what you pay for", "I laugh while you cry", "we carry you" attitudes and then ask for forgiveness and I might find it in my poor-F2P-scrub-heart to forgive you. And only then will I be able to respect any of you 24s. Until then, expect to not get healed by me.

Love, your favorite F2P scrub, Rhaellia :3

PS: I think my post is fairly reasonable and rather calm, so if it gets deleted I'd be rather disappointed :'(

 

[kratos]

Usually I try to stay clear of these kinds of threads, but seeing as it has escalated to a certain degree I figure I'll give my two cents.
To start off with, yes the majority of 24's are backpedaling, poorly geared, scrubs who give all of us a bad name every time they enter a wsg with the idea that they are gracing their team with the pathetic excuse of a twink they que in with.
It's because the 24's are composed primarily of people like this that F2P's and really anyone else who reads these threads look down on 24's, which is why the few 24's who know what they are doing, don't spend the game GY farming and actually play objectively need to understand this.
The bads out number the few good people, so yes people are going to look down on twinking at 24 because of the kinds of players that it mostly consists of.
No number of useless threads are going to change this, if you're worried that playing a 24 twink is going to make you seem disrespectful, prove them wrong by going in, unbinding your darn S key and playing the way you should be, and standing out from the mindless GY farming clickers.

 

[Kilda]

I'm guessing from your spelling that you play on US servers Rhaellia?

I must say that a majority of the 24's who appear in my BG's also have this 'superior player' mentality..

But as for me and my 24 buddies.. It's all about winning tactically; out-skilling the other team.

On EU servers, Horde dominate the 24 scene, which is why I rolled Alliance. Games are much more competitive, and less of those 'dishonourable' 24's' (I'd rather be against em than with em ;-) )

 

[MarzRider]

I must say that a majority of the 24's who appear in my BG's also have this 'superior player' mentality..

On EU servers, Horde dominate the 24 scene, which is why I rolled Alliance. Games are much more competitive, and less of those 'dishonourable' 24's' (I'd rather be against em than with em ;-) )

Too bad the dominative 24's on Horde nearly all have 1100hp.....

 

[Metro]

OP, it's not disrespectful, plus as you can read in this thread all 24's suck anyway so it's a even playing field.

 

[Kearbear]

I've never had a 24 treat me even remotely decently

Really ? D:

That's unfortunate. I've played with several that I would consider decent, even friends that I enjoy seeing in games whether on my team or not. There will always be those games where you find yourself facing a several competent 24s, and having a good player on your team to counter that is always a pleasure

 

[Bubbletub]

Compare your average F2P twink sitting on 900 hp ,to F2P twink who has really invested time and geared up to BiS etc , the barrier between them is just ' invested time into grinding gear ' does that make the F2P pimped out twink a ' lousy-pathetic ass ' face roller' ? Now the barrier between F2P pimped out twink and P2P is simple , monthly fee, you could even equate money to time as goblin adage goes ' Time is money friend ' , now a lot of F2P are willing to break through first barrier but not the second , we all part of same bracket some willing to push further than others so it is wrong dislike someone just because they did not set their limit were you did. Final point you shoudn't mix being skilled with either level or gear.

This , and I would like to add that attitude should not be attributed to level or gear or painting all F2P or P2P from attitude of few you have come across.

Too bad the dominative 24's on Horde nearly all have 1100hp.....

I no have clue when you actually play on EU servers , but in the evening when most 24s start logging I rarely come to play along horde who is not twinked out , swimming along 2k unbuffed hp and pimped other stats.