EU+US Player from XP OFF asked for the separation

[Frogturtle]

idk the point of this thread anymore

Queues are longer, but not THAT long, the game quality is a lot higher, the community of players is more tight knit and competitive now. People who care about that stuff are queuing and getting into games at a regular pace

The only people who have a problem with this patch are lazy, unskilled and value effortless wins

On top of that, complaining about wait times just further emphasizes how horny some people are to constantly get into games and feed their weird and obscure addiction of one shotting level 10 keyboard turning idiots with 300 hp for fun, rather than waiting longer for actual good quality games. Isn’t there a bug atm with turning xp on and queuing where you can do that anyway?

I only feel bad for twinks in the less popular regions/brackets who actually got screwed over, but maybe it’s time to go where the most action is for the time being.

 

[Warglave]

I only feel bad for twinks in the less popular regions/brackets

I think like.... everything above 29.

 

[Frogturtle]

Those of you who are happy with the change, Realize hopefully that it didn’t take a bracket separation to try and organize war games. What’s happened, is that now twinks do not have the option to choose. Not everyone twinks to be completely bis and in fact I know a lot of them use purposefully weaker gear so they are not at a massive power advantage. There are very select few that I know of that are old twinks and completely willing to go the extra miles for 1 stat here and a better on proc there etc. Do you really think there are enough real twinks out there willing to farm day and night to be at the peak of performance for competition? I don’t, like I said, twinking is a dying breed and what legion and bfa has brought is not twinks, but a massive base of followers. This is all fine and such for the meta we had a week ago, but now you cannot expect those players to want to be what twinking truly was back in later dates. You will all be sadly mistaken when your ques go from bad to worse. I have been twinking my entire wow time, with my sub starting before achievements were a thing. I have seen the highs and lows of activity and the ones that keep asking others to try as hard as they try. That’s inconceivable, I in my own bracket tried it for years even with merged ques and it was near impossible since I like to set me own precedents and farm for weeks + to get what is truly bis. I hate to see it and hate to say it. But you guys should get ready for a drought you have never seen before in this twinking population. All I hope is that it doesn’t scare away the true players that do what we do.

I understand your frustration as a 70s player but you have to realize that gear and population arent huge factors at 19s. Even if you’re insanely GFd BiS full epics etc you still won’t win if you suck balls at the game, and even if you’re an amazing player AND geared your skill has more to do with you winning than your gear.

This happened in WOD. Xp off queues popped the fuck off and people played constantly. There are enough 19s today who care about good quality games to keep this going, and already we have seen players who gave up on BFA 19s coming back and having fun. Games are consistently better because of this and if they slow down then so be it, there are still enough dedicated players to prevent games from ever dying off

I appreciate players like yourself and invite you to try 19s if there’s not enough action in 70s.

 

[Jrmilk]

Quality of games are better.....I have not played in 19s for years and the games i've been in was completely one sided blow outs.
where the other team got farmed. Then they do what twinks always do when they lose which is stop Qing up.

 

[Mcgriddle]

The only people who have a problem with this patch are lazy, unskilled and value effortless wins

Or people like myself that have a full time job and a family. i'm not able to play weekends and peak times. i haven't been able to get a single game since the patch. i've ended my sub because of this. twinking was the only enjoyable part of the game left to me. and it gets stripped away without even a single mention in the patch notes. blizzard knows they have a significant portion of their player base that plays the game just for twinking. this move was such a huge slap in the face to the community and shows how bad their developers are at balancing and polishing a game. and how little they care about their players.

 

[Goesid]

Or people like myself that have a full time job and a family. i'm not able to play weekends and peak times. i haven't been able to get a single game since the patch. i've ended my sub because of this. twinking was the only enjoyable part of the game left to me. and it gets stripped away without even a single mention in the patch notes. blizzard knows they have a significant portion of their player base that plays the game just for twinking. this move was such a huge slap in the face to the community and shows how bad their developers are at balancing and polishing a game. and how little they care about their players.

Thats stupid. Alot of what you just wrote is stupid.

 

[Phrontistery]

reminder that if you're unhappy with the separation you're a huge noober

 

[LulzSecz]

Queues are longer, but not THAT long

This sounds like confirmation bias to me. Queues are considerably longer outside of peak times, basically to the point that it is impossible to queue in certain brackets outside of peak time simply because the game cannot field enough players. Even 19 queues are >1hr for a lot of the day, and this will most likely get worse.

the game quality is a lot higher, the community of players is more tight knit and competitive now. People who care about that stuff are queuing and getting into games at a regular pace

This has always been possible through the wargame feature. The lack of NA plebmades in BfA falls on the decline in community participation. Just look at how successful they were in Legion, which was an otherwise bad xpac for twinking.

The only people who have a problem with this patch are lazy, unskilled and value effortless wins

This is a straw man argument. Wins were not always effortless before the merger; in fact, there were often good games to be played. As for people being lazy and unskilled, I'm not sure how you got that impression. Some of them probably are but not all.

On top of that, complaining about wait times just further emphasizes how horny some people are to constantly get into games and feed their weird and obscure addiction of one shotting level 10 keyboard turning idiots with 300 hp for fun, rather than waiting longer for actual good quality games. Isn’t there a bug atm with turning xp on and queuing where you can do that anyway?

More straw manning here.

I only feel bad for twinks in the less popular regions/brackets who actually got screwed over, but maybe it’s time to go where the most action is for the time being.

At least you acknowledge that this patch has fucked over the majority of brackets and certain regions (i.e. a large portion of the twinking community). That's all we're really saying, and it's the reason we're unhappy. Simply abandoning twinks we've had for over 10 years isn't easy or desirable. As for people in less popular regions/time-zones, it often isn't possible to play around work and other commitments.

 

[Livingforce]

Easy fix:

Blizzard creates the option to que xp off, Xp on battlegrounds. Pleases the casual twinks to play in their favourite bracket while keeping the competitive twinks doing their thang.

 

[Goohd]

Easy fix:

Blizzard creates the option to que xp off, Xp on battlegrounds. Pleases both casual and competitive twinks.

We LITERALLY have that option as 20 veteran twinks. Depending on my mood/patience I will que with xp off players or xpon.
YES - its that simple.
I'm NOT here to promote, we have enough activity. I'm just giving you guys some insights in case you weren't aware.

ON TOPIC : I understand the sentimental value twinks have for their other brackets. It takes a great deal of strength to become the greater person and reroll to 19s (yes im behind the train of 19s) for the reason of both activity and competition.
To those people, I can only have genuine deep respect.

a less formal answer - get fucked kids. twinking above 19/20 is a meme anyways lmao seriously.

 

[The Saint]

reminder that if you're unhappy with the separation you're a huge noober

PSA:

Reminder that I have played with and against every notable twink EU/US and with 90% there's no difference
[doublepost=1552733425,1552732583][/doublepost]

Those of you who are happy with the change, Realize hopefully that it didn’t take a bracket separation to try and organize war games. What’s happened, is that now twinks do not have the option to choose. Not everyone twinks to be completely bis and in fact I know a lot of them use purposefully weaker gear so they are not at a massive power advantage. There are very select few that I know of that are old twinks and completely willing to go the extra miles for 1 stat here and a better on proc there etc. Do you really think there are enough real twinks out there willing to farm day and night to be at the peak of performance for competition? I don’t, like I said, twinking is a dying breed and what legion and bfa has brought is not twinks, but a massive base of followers. This is all fine and such for the meta we had a week ago, but now you cannot expect those players to want to be what twinking truly was back in later dates. You will all be sadly mistaken when your ques go from bad to worse. I have been twinking my entire wow time, with my sub starting before achievements were a thing. I have seen the highs and lows of activity and the ones that keep asking others to try as hard as they try. That’s inconceivable, I in my own bracket tried it for years even with merged ques and it was near impossible since I like to set me own precedents and farm for weeks + to get what is truly bis. I hate to see it and hate to say it. But you guys should get ready for a drought you have never seen before in this twinking population. All I hope is that it doesn’t scare away the true players that do what we do.

How many do you think would change battle groups like we did back in wrath? How many do you think would run 4 accounts (2EU and 2 US)? Most of them can't be bothered to grind satchel loot before they queue..

 

[Blackberryy]

PSA:

Reminder that I have played with and against every notable twink EU/US and with 90% there's no difference
[doublepost=1552733425,1552732583][/doublepost]

How many do you think would change battle groups like we did back in wrath? How many do you think would run 4 accounts (2EU and 2 US)? Most of them can't be bothered to grind satchel loot before they queue..

0, that’s why I made my post. The game does not harbor the same player base it once did

 

[HitndRun]

But I stand by my statement in that post.
Our community is big enough to get games going without a bracket merge.
Do I believe games would be as common as they once were? Of course not. That was never in my case.

I didnt pull numbers out my ass. I used credible data pools from the in-game Bracket communities. The only reason twinking will die out is if WE LET IT. I understand that nobody wants to step up and try to organize things, but that is what it'll take.
There is no reason as to why we shouldn't be able to pull 6+/6+ twinks together in the majority of our brackets during peak hours to get some competitive WSG going on. There truly isnt.

Not everyone in the community made twinks just to compete in 1-3 wargames on a good, organized night.
Games as common as they were? Speaking in the 50-59 bracket, unless we are organizing a wargame, you won't get a bg queue to pop. I've sat in them for up to 4 hours with nothing through peak hours, it literally takes organizing both sides, otherwise it won't happen.

"there truely isn't a reason we shouldn't be able to pull 6/6.."
We are 100% capable during peak hours. The thing is, we shouldn't HAVE to organize 6v6s just to play the twinks we put in time to make and enjoy.

I'm not even mad at the changes made in the game. I don't agree with them, and I'm bored after this patch because 19-29s don't satisfy urges using 3 buttons, but I don't necessarily mind taking a break. The entire reason I decided to post was because it was arrogant of you to try and voice your opinion as if you spoke for the entire XPoff community.

 

[The Saint]

0, that’s why I made my post. The game does not harbor the same player base it once did

No it doesn't. But t to be fair, there's no chance I'm going to camp a rare for 30-40 kills that spawns every hour or more to play an hours worth of games a week.

Be it vet or noob I'm not the only one that's going to look it like that. Even some of the guys who like the change are going to eventually think why bother.

 

[Neon]

I think that now the mainstream thinks that twinking is dead now because of the split there won't be as much new blood, could be a good or bad thing.

 

[Warglave]

there won't be as much new blood, could be a good or bad thing.

It means the assholes you have now are the same assholes you'll have forever.

 

[Kirise]

Mother of God, some of you bring out the cranky grandpa twink in me.

Look, "both sides" are correct about XP segregation issues. Yes, we should step up and organize in any given bracket if we want games. Yes, we should be able to play this game the way we want to play, and not have Blizzard hamstring our efforts to participate and pay for their game. Yes, gear does not equal skill, nor vice versa. All of these are valid points, and some of you keep trying to juxtapose them when they actually don't contradict each other.

The reality is, Blizzard once again separated queues because it was the quickest way to serve the greater good of the PvP section of the playerbase. Until Blizzard actually deploys better matchmaking such that it makes sense to desegregate queues and/or balances BGs with worthwhile bots, BG segregation is where we are and Blizzard is no idiot in doing this.

Yes, twinking will lose 90% of its community (again), but the loss of those thousand or so players (and have no doubt, it's not more than a couple thousand) is nothing compared to the several thousand that Blizzard will retain thanks to a better BG leveling experience (such as it is). Moreover, those several thousands are nothing compared to the hundreds of thousands who level outside of BGs, because make no mistake, the majority of WoW players do not PvP, let alone PvP below 110.

Yes, it sucks that twinking will lose people either unable or unwilling to put more time into this game than previously required. But if you want a better game, then advocate for what will help twinks and nontwinks alike. Crapping on Blizzard for taking our ball away or (worse yet) crapping on other twinks because they don't "play the right bracket" or don't "step up" reeks of self-entitlement and ignorance of the historically deep effort many brackets invested in their well-being, and hurts the very causes the complainers presume to support.

To be clear, it's early in the days of this second segregation, and a lot of players feel angry over their loss. I understand that and I empathize. We invest in our twinks in ways few other games allow for. As someone who's been around this bend before, I ask that you try not to take it out on your fellow players and see the bigger picture of what's going on. We'll make better decisions if we do.

 

[jwl]

The entire reason I decided to post was because it was arrogant of you to try and voice your opinion as if you spoke for the entire XPoff community.

My post was MY perspective. I dont know why people thing I portrayed myself as a spokesperson of sorts, I acknowledge that my opinion was an unpopular one and used the phrase "my perspective" countless times. Its ignorant of you to think otherwise. I have every right to view myself as a relevant figure in our community and I have every right to voice my thoughts.
You and the majority of other players need to learn to comprehend words and let them sink in before you feel the need to speak upon things. (this goes for everything too; not just this subject)

I understand that not everyone twinks for the same reasons I do. Once again, I've acknowledge that & I appreciate the few people who held a civil, cordial argument with me on the alternate thread. But I am more than entitled to have my own opinions and you're the one taking them out of context here. Was the thread titled "A message from the xpoff community" or "PVP from a twink players perspective & my solution to fixing it"? I am allowed to have my own unpopular opinions. I knew before I started writing that twink players wouldn't agree. With that said, how do you conclude that I thought this would be in everyone's favor? Dont be another person who twist my statements or shoves words down my throat. Comprehend things as you wish, but unless you actually familiarize yourself with my thoughts, do not speak upon them in contrast.
My thread served its purpose accordingly. I did not consider your schedule or willingness to participate in competitive games because I could care less. I shared my contrasting (if you are aware of what that term is: CONTRASTING*) perspective on the bracket merge topic. Before you feel the need to claim that I spoke for everyone, please reconsider what points I actually made. (hint: contrasting opinion)

 

[Frogturtle]

This sounds like confirmation bias to me. Queues are considerably longer outside of peak times, basically to the point that it is impossible to queue in certain brackets outside of peak time simply because the game cannot field enough players. Even 19 queues are >1hr for a lot of the day, and this will most likely get worse.


This has always been possible through the wargame feature. The lack of NA plebmades in BfA falls on the decline in community participation. Just look at how successful they were in Legion, which was an otherwise bad xpac for twinking.


This is a straw man argument. Wins were not always effortless before the merger; in fact, there were often good games to be played. As for people being lazy and unskilled, I'm not sure how you got that impression. Some of them probably are but not all.


More straw manning here.


At least you acknowledge that this patch has fucked over the majority of brackets and certain regions (i.e. a large portion of the twinking community). That's all we're really saying, and it's the reason we're unhappy. Simply abandoning twinks we've had for over 10 years isn't easy or desirable. As for people in less popular regions/time-zones, it often isn't possible to play around work and other commitments.

queues are perfectly tolerable, evidenced by the fact that people are continuing to queue despite increased times

war games did not solve the problem in the way that twink-only pugs solve the problem. war games took an insane amount of effort to form in comparison which turned a lot of people *who now have returned to play and queue pugs* away from the game anyway. ease of access to twink vs twink games is a huge reason why veterans are playing again

people are lazy and unskilled because they stopped playing as soon as queue time increased and games became harder to win, like literally people you'd constantly see in bracket have basically disappeared because they lost interest (as a result of generally being lazy and unskilled)

if you want to continue this convo please spare me the arrogant vocabulary it's literally insufferable and not really necessary in this context

 

[Warglave]

I dont know why people thing I portrayed myself as a spokesperson of sorts

End of the second paragraph in that very thread....

I consider myself a very credible & relevant voice for the XPOFF community.