Trump Vs. Clinton, who will win?

[Solipsist]

What were you doing in an abortion clinic in the first place? As far as I know, they are generally not institutions that just allow visitors to come in for a tour of the facility. Not only did you make it into the clinic, but you apparently were able to get out of the waiting room and into one of the rooms where the procedures are carried out. You were also somehow there the moment a fetus was pulled out from a patient and tossed into a bucket?

Come on now. You preach about the importance of logic-based and factually-supported arguments, although you rarely provide either. Here are some stats if you are actually interested:
http://www.stats.govt.nz/browse_for_stats/health/abortion/AbortionStatistics_HOTPYeDec15.aspx
http://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/data_stats/

Just in case you can't be bothered to read either of those (first one is NZ specific <3):
-63% of abortions performed were a woman's first.
-55% were performed before 10 weeks
-2014 had the lowest number of total procedures in 20 years, with 2015 being within a dozen of that number

Anyways, strong arguments could be made for either side of any argument but that has not been the case in this thread. Just a lot of rhetoric and name-calling.

Lol I love how you just theorized some random bullshit and then you talk to me on facts. I was doing an intern, which I regret.
Your theorizing skills didn't pick that up.

The fúck argument are you even making? Do you agree with abortion or not? Don't link some random statistics and give no argument.

>All you did was give some random theorized situation from fairy land.
>You then link statistics which you haven't given any arguments or position for.
>Then you say people use alot of rhetoric(Pretty much like your entire post).

Holy fúck and I thought Conq was dumb.

 

[Zelpher]

9 year olds play this game....and people spewing hate and anger like you must be very accomplished in life.

Barking curse words isn't a nice thing to do.

What he said you dumbass fuck.

 

[Allybeboba]

Come on now. You preach about the importance of logic-based and factually-supported arguments, although you rarely provide either. Here are some stats if you are actually interested:
http://www.stats.govt.nz/browse_for_stats/health/abortion/AbortionStatistics_HOTPYeDec15.aspx
http://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/data_stats/

Just in case you can't be bothered to read either of those (first one is NZ specific <3):
-63% of abortions performed were a woman's first.
-55% were performed before 10 weeks
-2014 had the lowest number of total procedures in 20 years, with 2015 being within a dozen of that number

Anyways, strong arguments could be made for either side of any argument but that has not been the case in this thread. Just a lot of rhetoric and name-calling.

Facts and statistics! That is what I like to see. Much of which we do not see on this forum. As you stated, most of the time it is rhetoric and name calling. When called out people continue with their name calling because they have no answers. That is why I am the "most hated". I call people out.

Now to address the stats you presented.
If 63% it was their first, this means that 37% have had more than one. This could shore up a person's debate point that females do use abortion as a form of birth control.

The 55% fact... This leaves 45%(nearly half mind you) that get them in what is quite near or in what is the second trimester. Not a very valid debate point for "Pro-choicers" if someone were to ask me.

Without actually knowing the overall trends in New Zealand it is quite difficult to conclude why 2013 had an uptick in abortions or why 2014 and 2015 have been trending down. It would deserve further study to have an educated hypothesis.

Enjoy the weekend everyone!!

 

[Solipsist]

Facts and statistics! That is what I like to see. Much of which we do not see on this forum. As you stated, most of the time it is rhetoric and name calling. When called out people continue with their name calling because they have no answers. That is why I am the "most hated". I call people out.

Now to address the stats you presented.
If 63% it was their first, this means that 37% have had more than one. This could shore up a person's debate point that females do use abortion as a form of birth control.

The 55% fact... This leaves 45%(nearly half mind you) that get them in what is quite near or in what is the second trimester. Not a very valid debate point for "Pro-choicers" if someone were to ask me.

Without actually knowing the overall trends in New Zealand it is quite difficult to conclude why 2013 had an uptick in abortions or why 2014 and 2015 have been trending down. It would deserve further study to have an educated hypothesis.

Enjoy the weekend everyone!!

I don't resort to name calling for no reason. I'm not just calling these guys 'toilet shitface'' and throwing it out there for no reason. I have already explained this before but i'll explain again what I mean when i'm using these terms:

Coward: Someone who refuses to debate and censors through demonizing and censoring. E.g Conq

Mangina/Cuck/Fäggot: An Emsucalted man who can't stand behind what he says, very passive and who uses emotion instead of reason for their arguments. E.g Conq

I can't be assed saying the whole sentence hence why I just use the one word. ''Name calling'' is completely justified when there is reason behind the word.

 

[telle]

Lol I love how you just theorized some random bullshit and then you talk to me on facts. I was doing an intern, which I regret.
Your theorizing skills didn't pick that up.

The fúck argument are you even making? Do you agree with abortion or not? Don't link some random statistics and give no argument.

>All you did was give some random theorized situation from fairy land.
>You then link statistics which you haven't given any arguments or position for.
>Then you say people use alot of rhetoric(Pretty much like your entire post).

Holy fúck and I thought Conq was dumb.

If you don't specify or cite sources it leaves the door open for assumptions and speculation. Maybe if you had mentioned that you worked in an abortion clinic we could have just skipped over that detail. Instead, you were vague and I was left to speculate on how you were able to be witness to the behind-the-scenes operations of such an institution.

Not even sure how someone with such strong convictions against this issue decides it's a suitable place of work for themselves. In your reply you mention that you regret it. Okay. Was it the dumping of 20+ week fetuses into buckets that made you see the light, find jesus, or whatnot? If you had bothered to look over any of those statistics I linked, on a topic you're willing to argue quite fiercely, you may have noticed just how rarely that actually happens. In most Western countries, an abortion performed at the level of maturation that you claim to have personally witnessed multiple times occurs only in approximately 1% of cases.

You claimed: "I've been into a clinic where abortions happened and its ducking disgusting. 6+ month old fetus's thrown into buckets like they are just dirt." Your statement makes it seem as though this situation, which is statistically rare, is actually commonplace and that is misleading. That is why I linked the stats; because that part of your argument is mere hyperbole and I'm calling bullshit. Not sure how long you worked there, but let me reiterate: 1% of all procedures. RNG.

This ties into the second problem I see with your argument. You state: "women who are careless and just abort because of a lack of accountability and inconsideration to prevent pregnancy, should be punished". Who determines this? Are countries with legal abortion supposed to send all women seeking the procedure through the judicial system? Would there have to be an investigation as to whether or not her or her partner used a condom or other contraceptive however many weeks or months ago conception occurred? Seems to me, that could be a lengthy process resulting in later stage abortions increasing in frequency, leading to even more fucking disgusting-ness, as you put it.

My stance on the issue is this: keep your laws off of women's bodies. Prohibiting or restricting accessibility to a procedure that, even you claim, is sometimes just only endangers women. Drugs are prohibited, but there's still plenty of people getting high. Prostitution is illegal, and people are still paying to get their rocks off. Making abortion illegal or tediously restrictive will only lead to an increased number of procedures carried out by non-medical professionals in unsterile locations, including women trying to perform it by themselves.

 

[telle]

Facts and statistics! That is what I like to see. Much of which we do not see on this forum. As you stated, most of the time it is rhetoric and name calling. When called out people continue with their name calling because they have no answers. That is why I am the "most hated". I call people out.

Now to address the stats you presented.
If 63% it was their first, this means that 37% have had more than one. This could shore up a person's debate point that females do use abortion as a form of birth control.

The 55% fact... This leaves 45%(nearly half mind you) that get them in what is quite near or in what is the second trimester. Not a very valid debate point for "Pro-choicers" if someone were to ask me.

Without actually knowing the overall trends in New Zealand it is quite difficult to conclude why 2013 had an uptick in abortions or why 2014 and 2015 have been trending down. It would deserve further study to have an educated hypothesis.

Enjoy the weekend everyone!!

Enlightening. Thanks for sharing, Ally.

 

[Solipsist]

If you don't specify or cite sources it leaves the door open for assumptions and speculation. Maybe if you had mentioned that you worked in an abortion clinic we could have just skipped over that detail. Instead, you were vague and I was left to speculate on how you were able to be witness to the behind-the-scenes operations of such an institution.

Not even sure how someone with such strong convictions against this issue decides it's a suitable place of work for themselves. In your reply you mention that you regret it. Okay. Was it the dumping of 20+ week fetuses into buckets that made you see the light, find jesus, or whatnot? If you had bothered to look over any of those statistics I linked, on a topic you're willing to argue quite fiercely, you may have noticed just how rarely that actually happens. In most Western countries, an abortion performed at the level of maturation that you claim to have personally witnessed multiple times occurs only in approximately 1% of cases.

You claimed: "I've been into a clinic where abortions happened and its ducking disgusting. 6+ month old fetus's thrown into buckets like they are just dirt." Y our statement makes it seem as though this situation, which is statistically rare, is actually commonplace and that is misleading. That is why I linked the stats; because that part of your argument is mere hyperbole and I'm calling bullshit. Not sure how long you worked there, but let me reiterate: 1% of all procedures. RNG.

This ties into the second problem I see with your argument. You state: "women who are careless and just abort because of a lack of accountability and inconsideration to prevent pregnancy, should be punished". Who determines this? Are countries with legal abortion supposed to send all women seeking the procedure through the judicial system? Would there have to be an investigation as to whether or not her or her partner used a condom or other contraceptive however many weeks or months ago conception occurred? Seems to me, that could be a lengthy process resulting in later stage abortions increasing in frequency, leading to even more ducking disgusting-ness, as you put it.

My stance on the issue is this: keep your laws off of women's bodies. Prohibiting or restricting accessibility to a procedure that, even you claim, is sometimes just only endangers women. Drugs are prohibited, but there's still plenty of people getting high. Prostitution is illegal, and people are still paying to get their rocks off. Making abortion illegal or tediously restrictive will only lead to an increased number procedures carried out by non-medical professionals in unsterile locations, including women trying to perform it by themselves.

Not specify? You didn't specify shit. You theorize some random situation which is oblivious to my whole fucking point. You then quote statistics and give no argument or position for. Why don't you just ask me instead of giving some bullshit fairy land experience you think I had.

One of my family members friends offered me some experience years ago and I accepted, this is when I didn't even care about or understand the issue. I saw two 6+ fetus's in my time and it disgusted me. The fact that you now think your a genius because you quote some stupid fucking statistics is absurd. I have had first hand experience. But I guess your stupid 1% statistic now counters my experience since I've just decided to make this whole story up for laughs and giggles.

The fact is in this society we have an attitude to never hold women accountable for their actions and to make them the victim all the time. It's politically correct to blame men for the issues in the world. When the issue of conceiving comes up its always the mans fault and he is 100% accountable. The women is not accountable or even half accountable. It's always ''It's the man responsibility and he should be responsible when he sleeps with women and use condoms appropriately''. The women is never called in to be accountable. Also for example Men are 100% responsible for the domestic violence scene when there are nearly 50% cases on each side. They are responsible for the rape crisis when women bait and manipulate men with their bodies abusing their natural visual attraction. Women are not held accountable like men, which is is strange since they want to be treated and have the same rights as men. You can't have your cake and eat it to.

You are a white knight who wants to protect women from facing justifiable responsibility. So if women should have complete control of their bodies, does that mean they can just pull out a knife and start stabbing their baby inside their belly? The fact men don't even have control is absurd. It is their child as much as the women's. Notice how men still have to pay child alimony even if they don't want the child.

I am concerned with women having next to no punishment in being so careless with human life. Women who don't use contraception and abort should be punished , whether that be with fines, service or jail. You should allow extreme circumstances like if a women has been raped or some bizarre ones, like I just saw that some women got pregnant from swimming in a public pool, I know lol, some how that happened. In dealing with contraception Doctors can look at your estrogen levels through a blood test and see if you are on birth control pills.

 

[AlisterCrow]

They are responsible for the rape crisis when women bait and manipulate men with their bodies abusing their natural visual attraction. Women are not held accountable like men, which is is strange since they want to be treated and have the same rights as men. You can't have you cake and eat it to.

I don't know if you realize how glorious this is, but it's pretty much the greatest thing I've ever read. I'm collecting dumbass quotes and I'll cherish this one forever.

Now, I'm not going to point out exactly why it's stupid. That's not me demonizing you and dismissing you; that's me making fun of you because you're an idiot.

 

[Solipsist]

I don't know if you realize how glorious this is, but it's pretty much the greatest thing I've ever read. I'm collecting dumbass quotes and I'll cherish this one forever.

Now, I'm not going to point out exactly why it's stupid. That's not me demonizing you and dismissing you; that's me making fun of you because you're an idiot.

In order to make fun of me you would need to expose my logic which you haven't done. You are dismissing me, you are just too dumb to realize. Get a brain and challenge me, otherwise fück off you coward.

 

[AlisterCrow]

In order to make fun of me you would need to expose my logic which you haven't done. You are dismissing me, you are just too dumb to realize. Get a brain and challenge me, otherwise fück off you coward.

No, no. I'll be sticking around. I've already showed this to quite a few people. This is great. Keep it up buddy.

 

[Solipsist]

No, no. I'll be sticking around. I've already showed this to quite a few people. This is great. Keep it up buddy.

Well i'm glad to have written the best thing you've read in your tiny brain. Men are mainly attracted to women through visual stimulation. Maybe you are attracted to squirrels so that might be a bit hard for you to understand. Keep showing it around so you can educate more dumb manginas plz.

 

[Druiddroid]

"women are responsible for the rape crisis" LOL

a bit too much victimization of men there buddy

 

[AlisterCrow]

Well i'm glad to have written the best thing you've read in your tiny brain. Men are mainly attracted to women through visual stimulation. Maybe you are attracted to squirrels so that might be a bit hard for you to understand. Keep showing it around so you can educate more dumb manginas plz.

I'll keep showing it around. Not for educational purposes, but for comic relief. My gorgeous, polyamarous, feminist, stripper buddy should get a kick out of it for sure.

 

[Solipsist]

"women are responsible for the rape crisis" LOL

a bit too much victimization of men there buddy

I don't mean they are fully responsible but they do take large account. Single mothers raise the vast majority of rapists and criminals behind bars. Women today also demonize male sexuality instead of acknowledging the large urge and need men have for sex. Why do you think men jack off 3 times a day? Why do men go to strip clubs? The male sex drive is far higher then the female sex drive. This has to do with visual stimulation. Why do you think women nearly half naked selling products do so well? Businessmen understand the urge from the male sex drive and take advantage of it. Women do bait and manipulate with their bodies and then shame men for a natural urge. Women wearing sexually provocative clothing do entice men. Men need to have their sexual needs met and when we live in a ''look and don't touch culture'' it creates a whole host of problems. Women should be held accountable for what they wear.

I mean look at the difference in male and female sexuality:

 

[Resto]

Haven't read much, took the time to read a few long novels. Just want to throw this out there since we're talking politics (Which I love/hate talking about). If any of you in here support (and legit support, not just being a troll) woman's rights, whatever tf Hilary is promoting, then you're retarded af. Woman have the SAME damn rights as men do, they're just too fucking lazy to get off their ass and do something about it. People are so hooked on the past and don't focus on the present.

Another thing .. If ANY of you watch the media, meaning the news, social media, etc. and get your facts from there? Leave the thread and stop commenting. The fact you believe and want to watch the media to soak in facts is amazing to me. Do some research

Not directed towards anyone specifically, just in general. Now that I've gotten my toes wet in the post, let the naysayers come through -.\

 

[LennywBT]

Duck all o'them. MEEEEE!

 

[Druiddroid]

I don't mean they are fully responsible but they do take large account. Single mothers raise the vast majority of rapists and criminals behind bars. Women today also demonize male sexuality instead of acknowledging the large urge and need men have for sex. Why do you think men jack off 3 times a day? Why do men go to strip clubs? The male sex drive is far higher then the female sex drive. This has to do with visual stimulation. Why do you think women nearly half naked selling products do so well? Businessmen understand the urge from the male sex drive and take advantage of it. Women do bait and manipulate with their bodies and then shame men for a natural urge. Women wearing sexually provocative clothing do entice men. Men need to have their sexual needs met and when we live in a ''look and don't touch culture'' it creates a whole host of problems. Women should be held accountable for what they wear.

I mean look at the difference in male and female sexuality:

LOL

 

[telle]

@Solipsist

Wow. You're an angry little fella. There are just so many inaccuracies in nearly everything you claim. In a regular rebuttal, I might take the time to go through each of your points, but it would fall on deaf ears so I won't waste my time. You claim to be all for freedom of speech, differing opinions, etc etc but none of this is apparent at all when you argue. You have principles that you do not adhere to. You whine about "the left" demonizing the right through the use of terms like bigot, racist, sexist and so on. Yet you take every and any opportunity to do the same. White knight, sjw, PC, cuck, mangina. If you don't see the hypocrisy in this, any further discourse with you is futile.

I will however throw one term into the mix, which certainly describes the views you hold: misogyny. If you think this is an unfair use of the word, please just re-read some of the non-sense just spewed out. If you want to continue being an angry single dude, jacking off three times a day, and only being able to view a naked woman in the flesh at a strip club, please carry on. But a little word of advice, women hate women-hating morons and generally have no interest in having a conversation, let alone fucking them.

 

[Solipsist]

@Solipsist

Wow. You're an angry little fella. There are just so many inaccuracies in nearly everything you claim. In a regular rebuttal, I might take the time to go through each of your points, but it would fall on deaf ears so I won't waste my time. You claim to be all for freedom of speech, differing opinions, etc etc but none of this is apparent at all when you argue. You have principles that you do not adhere to. You whine about "the left" demonizing the right through the use of terms like bigot, racist, sexist and so on. Yet you take every and any opportunity to do the same. White knight, sjw, PC, cuck, mangina. If you don't see the hypocrisy in this, any further discourse with you is futile.

I will however throw one term into the mix, which certainly describes the views you hold: misogyny. If you think this is an unfair use of the word, please just re-read some of the non-sense just spewed out. If you want to continue being an angry single dude, jacking off three times a day, and only being able to view a naked woman in the flesh at a strip club, please carry on. But a little word of advice, women hate women-hating morons and generally have no interest in having a conversation, let alone ducking them.

Obviously you lack a brain but the left just says words like ''sexist'' or ''racist'' to shut down the conversation. I am open to debate and EXPLAIN when I use terms like ''fággot'' or ''cuck'' which you didn't even read. I don't use these terms for no reason. Go back and read my reply to Ally.

Women are not held accountable to the same degree that men are. That is not misogyny, that is a fact. I spew out the truth which is often offensive to others.

Jesus Christ. You have no idea how women work lol. For some reason women are attracted to angry asshole misogynist men like me.
You are probably a virgin theorizing on what women want. I have actual experience with women and know what they do and do not respond to. I am the asshole ''bad boy'' they will fúck not a nice passive white knight like you. Stick to porn m8.

 

[AlisterCrow]

Jesus Christ. You have no idea how women work lol. For some reason women are attracted to angry asshole misogynist men like me.
You are probably a virgin theorizing on what women want. I have actual experience with women and know what they do and do not respond to. I am the asshole ''bad boy'' they will fúck not a nice passive white knight like you. Stick to porn m8.

Sounds like someone's been watching too many "how to pick up" videos and jacking off 3 times a day. I too have "actual experience with women" and the dumb ones are attracted to the assholes........that probably explains why you think women shouldn't be in charge of anything (based off of your signature).....you only attract the morons. That or you're banging high-school girls.....I'd say the three times daily thing is more likely though.

Women are not held accountable to the same degree that men are. That is not misogyny, that is a fact. I spew out the truth which is often offensive to others.

That's right Timmy. Women aren't held accountable for when they are raped. Timmy, this may be hard to hear, but most of us don't turn into a mindless, sex-crazed retard every time we get a boner and go off raping some gal. Now, Timmy the next thing I'm going to say might come as a bit of a shock too, but you're gonna have to put your big-boy pants on and just accept it. Here it is: women are sexually aroused from visual stimulant too.......I know, I know, it's hard to hear, but dudes have been walking around topless for decades upon decades and sometimes the ladies get all moist n shit when they see some nice arms and a nice chest fully exposed. Too bad women aren't allowed to walk around topless though.......too many dudes that might just stop what they're doing and rape her.