10-19 2015 TC Discussion, Planning, Indiegogo
- Thread starter Myrm
- Start date
MYT
Legend
Hey here's an idea. Let's make another rule - that you btag queue wsg specific. This will render ALL of your gear unusable. Nothing more equal than running around naked watching resto cats one shot everyone, Amirite?
MYT is almost definitely going to have three teams in this. I work incredibly hard to bring players back into this game / bracket for the cup - so do Diablo and countless others in the guild. That's what I meant - not just that I made a large donation (although I did put my money where my mouth is).
People want to ban ferals. They want to ban defias belts. They want to ban 36 health librams (apparently I'm going to go fish again because my only fishing hat has 36 health enchanted on it? You're crazy if you think I'll spend 1 second of my time fishing because some whiny kid wants their way (a collective jab at all whining ban ban ban, I'm not responding to individuals).
I saw the same thing at 29...ban BMs. Ban Ferals. Ban deadmans. Ban, ban, ban. MYT held a wargame 29 night, we didn't ban any of the above. We just played. Which is exactly the approach the twink cup needs to take. Banning Jutes and crystalline cuffs isn't about the slight advantage - it's about people whining to get their way and turning this tournament into an unadministerable nightmare all because, just like aliens may come and win this tournament from another universe, there may be a hypothetical whiny player we don't want anyways who rage quits because someone has 36 health more on their fishing cap than them.
Wait - are we going to make people spend a year every Sunday getting their cap too? Only fair right? How about spending 40 hours grinding furb rep instead of 1? Don't us old schoolers who took months to bis out characters get to whine and ruin it for everyone else too?
Either let's run around naked getting 1 shot shredded by Druids, or let's quit making rules and just play. And quit trying to manipulate Myrm. There is an incredibly vocal minority whining loudly in this thread for banning gear. Be a shame for them to get their way and make this tournament less fun and slap all bis twinks in the face because of that vocal minority.
MYT is almost definitely going to have three teams in this. I work incredibly hard to bring players back into this game / bracket for the cup - so do Diablo and countless others in the guild. That's what I meant - not just that I made a large donation (although I did put my money where my mouth is).
People want to ban ferals. They want to ban defias belts. They want to ban 36 health librams (apparently I'm going to go fish again because my only fishing hat has 36 health enchanted on it? You're crazy if you think I'll spend 1 second of my time fishing because some whiny kid wants their way (a collective jab at all whining ban ban ban, I'm not responding to individuals).
I saw the same thing at 29...ban BMs. Ban Ferals. Ban deadmans. Ban, ban, ban. MYT held a wargame 29 night, we didn't ban any of the above. We just played. Which is exactly the approach the twink cup needs to take. Banning Jutes and crystalline cuffs isn't about the slight advantage - it's about people whining to get their way and turning this tournament into an unadministerable nightmare all because, just like aliens may come and win this tournament from another universe, there may be a hypothetical whiny player we don't want anyways who rage quits because someone has 36 health more on their fishing cap than them.
Wait - are we going to make people spend a year every Sunday getting their cap too? Only fair right? How about spending 40 hours grinding furb rep instead of 1? Don't us old schoolers who took months to bis out characters get to whine and ruin it for everyone else too?
Either let's run around naked getting 1 shot shredded by Druids, or let's quit making rules and just play. And quit trying to manipulate Myrm. There is an incredibly vocal minority whining loudly in this thread for banning gear. Be a shame for them to get their way and make this tournament less fun and slap all bis twinks in the face because of that vocal minority.
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Donteventrii
OG
Now that's a wall-o-text encompassing a single logical fallacy, the slippery slope.
A GF gear ban is not possible in pug games. However, in the TC where you can establish and enforce rules, it is possible. Is the enforcement mechanism simple? Yes, it appears so. Please stop bringing the slippery slope to the table. It doesn't add anything to the debate, and I'm going to call you on it every time.
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
A GF gear ban is not possible in pug games. However, in the TC where you can establish and enforce rules, it is possible. Is the enforcement mechanism simple? Yes, it appears so. Please stop bringing the slippery slope to the table. It doesn't add anything to the debate, and I'm going to call you on it every time.
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
Allybeboba
Legend
It is the same old debate.
The "have-nots" crying about what the "haves" have.
We have seen in the Trial section. Then it in the 20-29 section.
Who would have ever thought it would have came here to the 19's...
Which bracket will be next? Maybe the 30-39? Or the 50 raiders? Who knows.
/cheers
The "have-nots" crying about what the "haves" have.
We have seen in the Trial section. Then it in the 20-29 section.
Who would have ever thought it would have came here to the 19's...
Which bracket will be next? Maybe the 30-39? Or the 50 raiders? Who knows.
/cheers
MYT
Legend
Lol you're going to call me on it every time?
In what world do you live in that just because you find a point invalid that means nobody should hear it? Similarly, what world is it where someone responding to my point with the same exact counter point (which I obviously don't subscribe to) serves as a deterrent to me making the point wherever and whenever I feel like it?
Your position is clear and so is mine. You feel that a new player to the bracket currently flying solo carries as much weight on this topic as a GM of a guild that will enter three teams - with at least half those players who wouldn't bother with this bracket at the moment without the work of creating a welcoming environment for them and the full time job for many of us to administer that. I obviously feel that my view carries a bit more weight due to experience in the bracket, teams to be entered from guild, and putting my money where my mouth is (among other reasons). So again won't see eye to eye on that either. Not will you see me tagging Myrm demanding an answer on how he values opinions. That's for him to worry about, not me.
What I see in this thread is experienced 19 members, whether they have relevant gf of not, saying "allow it" for some combination of a) will he tricky to administer and b) IT WILL NOT CHANGE ANYTHING and c) allowing them is simply the obvious right choice for the community. And meanwhile people new to the community and/or not very good at 19's are arguing to create even more rules. Why? Because more rules are always the answer amongst the vocal minority in this bracket.
One last quick point then I tire of this topic - if we ban gf gear, done team will be inadvertently disqualified. It's an incredible challenge to get people to have xp turned on for wargames and not be afk when game pops. If you think everyone can keep track of making sure they check all toons/bags for literally hundreds of gf items then you have absolutely no real world experience at administering things. So yeah, rules have consequences. We ban this stuff, and a team that works hard for months will get DQ'ed because someone on their team equips some item that is likely not even bis but technically gf'd and they missed that it was number 275 on the liar and they owned it. And that team will be DQ'ed because a bunch of people ago probably won't even be on a team screamed the loudest and fought for a rule that doesn't even matter...except for the team that just got DQ'ed and the 13 people that literally never play a game in this bracket again as a result. And that's BS.
Pps - at this point I have no intention of using the spectator add on or allowing anyone to spectate my teams games. So I would have to forced at gunpoint to degrade my performance and risk a crash that costs by team the game all to allow another pointless rule to appease the whiny.
In what world do you live in that just because you find a point invalid that means nobody should hear it? Similarly, what world is it where someone responding to my point with the same exact counter point (which I obviously don't subscribe to) serves as a deterrent to me making the point wherever and whenever I feel like it?
Your position is clear and so is mine. You feel that a new player to the bracket currently flying solo carries as much weight on this topic as a GM of a guild that will enter three teams - with at least half those players who wouldn't bother with this bracket at the moment without the work of creating a welcoming environment for them and the full time job for many of us to administer that. I obviously feel that my view carries a bit more weight due to experience in the bracket, teams to be entered from guild, and putting my money where my mouth is (among other reasons). So again won't see eye to eye on that either. Not will you see me tagging Myrm demanding an answer on how he values opinions. That's for him to worry about, not me.
What I see in this thread is experienced 19 members, whether they have relevant gf of not, saying "allow it" for some combination of a) will he tricky to administer and b) IT WILL NOT CHANGE ANYTHING and c) allowing them is simply the obvious right choice for the community. And meanwhile people new to the community and/or not very good at 19's are arguing to create even more rules. Why? Because more rules are always the answer amongst the vocal minority in this bracket.
One last quick point then I tire of this topic - if we ban gf gear, done team will be inadvertently disqualified. It's an incredible challenge to get people to have xp turned on for wargames and not be afk when game pops. If you think everyone can keep track of making sure they check all toons/bags for literally hundreds of gf items then you have absolutely no real world experience at administering things. So yeah, rules have consequences. We ban this stuff, and a team that works hard for months will get DQ'ed because someone on their team equips some item that is likely not even bis but technically gf'd and they missed that it was number 275 on the liar and they owned it. And that team will be DQ'ed because a bunch of people ago probably won't even be on a team screamed the loudest and fought for a rule that doesn't even matter...except for the team that just got DQ'ed and the 13 people that literally never play a game in this bracket again as a result. And that's BS.
Pps - at this point I have no intention of using the spectator add on or allowing anyone to spectate my teams games. So I would have to forced at gunpoint to degrade my performance and risk a crash that costs by team the game all to allow another pointless rule to appease the whiny.
Dramatized
Legend
why stop at banning gf'd gear tho? why not transfer the twink cup to be held at gurubashi arena; all participants create lvl 1s and get summoned there so gear won't be a factor at all?
badmit
Legend
If we ban gf'd gear/enchants with the intent of balancing for new 19s, do we also ban double argas or any other specific gear pieces available to only one faction because the cost associated with faction changing might deter new players? Would certain pieces of gf'd gear be disallowed despite some remaining in the market (ex. defias boots, woodworking, etc.) Where would we finally draw the line?
Donteventrii
OG
The slippery slope just won't die! I did chuckle at the notion that a twink won't know what gear they might be using. They know exactly what piece of gear they are going to use.
But I'm glad we finally got to the meat of your issue with no method of enforcement - not allowing spectating. Isn't a stream a major component of tournaments?
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
But I'm glad we finally got to the meat of your issue with no method of enforcement - not allowing spectating. Isn't a stream a major component of tournaments?
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
PPPopper
Legend
Can we just ban women from the tournament too cause all your post are dumb and annoying just like every side bit. Who cares bout gf gear skill, teamwork, balls etc > gear. Stfu and play. No women aloud! Less you coo but this bit aint down. You been marked woman. Lolol
MYT
Legend
Now you know when PP starts forum posting from vacation in the Bahamas or some crazy place like that, then sh!t is getting ridiculous!
PPPopper
Legend
LEAVE NASTIIII ALONE!!! Burnt up today ready to get some games in and roll these annoying shit players that keep going on and on bout stupid shit just to have them most likely not even play in the tourney or just to get the big floppy donkey dik in the first round and bounce early. I mean it be cool to get an easy first round where i can just /emote on scrubs but id rather have a decent warm up game before any big guns
Faerondil
Legend
Male Belfs prancing around in their undies down guru? Now that's a Twink Cup!
MYT
Legend
The logic and hypotheticals in the thread have, as is typical of TI 19 threads, everything ass backwards. Let's summarize:
Discussion of the difficulty of administering / determining rules: erroneously labeled a slippery slope fallacy and dismissed
Fact that a team will be DQed due to an accident : point ignored/dismissed. They must suffer "for the greater good comrade". And the fact that people can't turn their damn XP on much less check all their toons bags for a list of 300 items to get rid of is ignored.
Fact that there are no game changing items: ridiculed, in spite of being true and widely accepted by actual players in the bracket.
Fact that people don't want to be force to use add ons: ignored
Meanwhile, we bend over backwards to accommodate this hypothetical person considering 19's who will rage quit if someone else is allowed to use that 36 health libram on their fishing hat because darnit they can't get it. Ignoring the fact that "whinybiatch" as his toon would undoubtably be named doesn't exist in any universe but bizzaro land, let's pretend he does. Would a single person care that we lost that person that would rage quit next time the entire community doesn't change to accommodate their demands? No, nobody would care.
But in the meantime let's keep making arguments like race car drivers need to drive the same exact car for a true test of skill....and ignore the fact that on all of racing do racers drive the exact same car. Which is why racing is awesome, rather than two guys in a backyard going for the championship as "equals" in a dead sport.
Discussion of the difficulty of administering / determining rules: erroneously labeled a slippery slope fallacy and dismissed
Fact that a team will be DQed due to an accident : point ignored/dismissed. They must suffer "for the greater good comrade". And the fact that people can't turn their damn XP on much less check all their toons bags for a list of 300 items to get rid of is ignored.
Fact that there are no game changing items: ridiculed, in spite of being true and widely accepted by actual players in the bracket.
Fact that people don't want to be force to use add ons: ignored
Meanwhile, we bend over backwards to accommodate this hypothetical person considering 19's who will rage quit if someone else is allowed to use that 36 health libram on their fishing hat because darnit they can't get it. Ignoring the fact that "whinybiatch" as his toon would undoubtably be named doesn't exist in any universe but bizzaro land, let's pretend he does. Would a single person care that we lost that person that would rage quit next time the entire community doesn't change to accommodate their demands? No, nobody would care.
But in the meantime let's keep making arguments like race car drivers need to drive the same exact car for a true test of skill....and ignore the fact that on all of racing do racers drive the exact same car. Which is why racing is awesome, rather than two guys in a backyard going for the championship as "equals" in a dead sport.
Donteventrii
OG
Facts are not such just because you say they are. Most of that was opinion; some was outright fiction.
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
Donteventrii
OG
Also, perhaps [MENTION=16519]Laurenti[/MENTION] can elaborate on how spectator mode works. I was under the impression it allowed for a 3rd party to tag along without needing add-ons or otherwise intruding on the in-game performance of anyone playing.
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
Tapatalked from a PACMAN 4.4 Note II
Allybeboba
Legend
Did someone say male Bloodelfs dancing in their undies?
http://www.twinkinfo.com/forums/f12/twink-bodybuilding-cup-65151/
MYT
Legend
Only part of what I said that was fiction is the hypothetical person that won't play 19's unless we ban defias belts and 36 health head librams - and your side of the argument is the one that wrote that fiction, not me. All other concerns are valid, real concerns. So pardon me and like minded people less interested in causing entire teams to quit bracket because they get DQ'ed than on appeasing imaginary guy and his demands to play in the bracket. Fact is, the guy isn't gonna touch that prize money even if we run around naked so let's let the imaginary guy go on his way and those of us in the bracket will continue to play the game the way we currently do - with fewer rules, not more rules. Without DQing teams. Etc
Last year there was an RBG team that was DDosing everyone. They didn't get DQed, but we're going to DQ a legit team because someone equips their defias belt? LOL - no thanks.
Last year there was an RBG team that was DDosing everyone. They didn't get DQed, but we're going to DQ a legit team because someone equips their defias belt? LOL - no thanks.