TLA Best wep for rets in 3.2?

I really know nothing about paladins in this bracket. All the good ones I have seen seem to use BaR. But, if the class is changing to the point where TLA is viable, then why not enchant it with a BC enchant? It is a level 35 item, I would think that 70ap or mongoose or 20 strength might be good? Or is there something I am missing?
 
godddddddd not this again....



ok guys here goes:



TLA BAD. BAD BAD BAD. TLA MAKE BAD DPS. NO USE TLA. TLA GIVE MANY FAIL.



3.8 SPEED WEAPON GOOD. MAKE MANY KILL. BOA AND CORPSEMAKER AXE BOTH MAKE GOOD DPS. BIG NUMBER KILL ENEMY. WUG WUG BAD GUYS DIE.
 
Lloydganks said:
godddddddd not this again....



ok guys here goes:



TLA BAD. BAD BAD BAD. TLA MAKE BAD DPS. NO USE TLA. TLA GIVE MANY FAIL.



3.8 SPEED WEAPON GOOD. MAKE MANY KILL. BOA AND CORPSEMAKER AXE BOTH MAKE GOOD DPS. BIG NUMBER KILL ENEMY. WUG WUG BAD GUYS DIE.



This ^
 
Screamforme said:
I really know nothing about paladins in this bracket. All the good ones I have seen seem to use BaR. But, if the class is changing to the point where TLA is viable, then why not enchant it with a BC enchant? It is a level 35 item, I would think that 70ap or mongoose or 20 strength might be good? Or is there something I am missing?



your missing that level req overrides ilevel, TLA is an absolute shit weapon.
 
Lloydganks said:
TLA BAD. BAD BAD BAD. TLA MAKE BAD DPS. NO USE TLA. TLA GIVE MANY FAIL.



3.8 SPEED WEAPON GOOD. MAKE MANY KILL. BOA AND CORPSEMAKER AXE BOTH MAKE GOOD DPS. BIG NUMBER KILL ENEMY. WUG WUG BAD GUYS DIE.



With SoC being changed to provide higher dps and less burst, and judgement damage lowered, there is absolutely no advantage to using a slower weapon in this bracket.



Higher DPS from TLA. Faster removal of priests Inner Fire. higher chance to cause pushback twice on spells. A warlock cant get a fear off between swing sithout at least having one pushback... etc.



Or, translated for you:



TLA NOT BAD. TLA TOP DPS WEAPON IN BRACKET. SPEED DOESNT MATTER (SOMETIMES). BIG NUMBERS DONT MATTER TO GOOD TWINKS.
 
darzk said:
With SoC being changed to provide higher dps and less burst, and judgement damage lowered, there is absolutely no advantage to using a slower weapon in this bracket.



Higher DPS from TLA. Faster removal of priests Inner Fire. higher chance to cause pushback twice on spells. A warlock cant get a fear off between swing sithout at least having one pushback... etc.



Or, translated for you:



TLA NOT BAD. TLA TOP DPS WEAPON IN BRACKET. SPEED DOESNT MATTER (SOMETIMES). BIG NUMBERS DONT MATTER TO GOOD TWINKS.

In this analysis I would first like to make points on certain parts of your remarks.

"there is absolutely no advantage to using a slower weapon in this bracket."

"TLA NOT BAD."

"SPEED DOESNT MATTER (SOMETIMES)."

"BIG NUMBERS DONT MATTER TO GOOD TWINKS."

Of course many who have played in 29 for a lengthy time would see the obvious mistakes within each of these quotes. One you may glance over is the missing apostrophe between the N and T in DONT making the all caps look even worse.



To break it down in a short sentence for 3.2 slower weapons mean bigger numbers and a better chance of crusader.



Higher top end damage leads to cases of critical hits being larger and causing more damage. Critical hits gives a 100% bonus to regular hits.

BAR and Corpsemaker both have 132 top end damage. 132 * 2 = 264

TLA has a top end damage of 106. 106 * 2 = 212

For each critical hit you are missing out on 52 damage if you go with TLA. This does not include some other things you have to factor in like strength and critical strike rating given by the weapon.

BAR

Corpsemaker

TLA

With there being few chances of picking up resilience at level 29 critical hits are a big part of twinkx.



The chance of crusader proc'ing is shown below.

Chance on hit (%) = weapon speed * 1.82

BAR and Corpsemaker are both 3.8 speed which is a 6.916% chance on hit.

TLA has a speed of 2.7 which gives a 4.914% chance on hit.

An extra 100 strength will give you 200 more attack power. Considering that an average level 29 paladin has around 400 attack power this means that a crusader proc will increase a paladins attack power to 150%.



Hopefully these numbers provided will finally close the case of why BAR and Corpsemaker are so much of a better choice for paladins and warriors than TLA.
 
Hopefully these numbers provided will finally close the case of why BAR and Corpsemaker are so much of a better choice for paladins and warriors than TLA.



it won't. people are just fucking terrible at this game and really, really stupid. no matter how much evidence is presented for a case, there will always be people dumb enough to argue to the contrary.
 
NickeQuick said:
In this analysis I would first like to make points on certain parts of your remarks.

"there is absolutely no advantage to using a slower weapon in this bracket."

"TLA NOT BAD."

"SPEED DOESNT MATTER (SOMETIMES)."

"BIG NUMBERS DONT MATTER TO GOOD TWINKS."

Of course many who have played in 29 for a lengthy time would see the obvious mistakes within each of these quotes. One you may glance over is the missing apostrophe between the N and T in DONT making the all caps look even worse.

Let's try to keep it civil. My spelling has nothing to do with my arguments.



"there is absolutely no advantage to using a slower weapon in this bracket." - In many situations, that is. From my previous post:
The only advantage of a slow weapon is higher damage/swing. Dmg/swing is only relevant when jousting (or in situations like jousting, such as fighting a mage). In other situations all that matters is DPS; of which the TLA has more.



"TLA NOT BAD." - This is my argument. Should it not be in my post?

"SPEED DOESNT MATTER (SOMETIMES)." - Again, this is the point I'm trying to make.

"BIG NUMBERS DONT MATTER TO GOOD TWINKS." - Who cares about how hard you hit? Do you do more or less damage over the period of a fight than someone with your exact setup and skills, but with a different weapon? Dmg/swing only situationally matters - If you're playing a twink to see "BIG NUMBERS" then I dont give a *** about trying to help you.



NickeQuick said:
To break it down in a short sentence for 3.2 slower weapons mean bigger numbers and a better chance of crusader.

In fact, this is completely incorrect. Crusader is a PPM for a reason - you will see one proc per minute on average no matter the speed of the weapon you are using. Yes you will have a higher chance to proc PER SWING with a CM, but you will have more chances to have it proc (more hits) in the same time with a TLA. With no instant attacks available in the bracket, proc % per swing does not matter.

NickeQuick said:
Higher top end damage leads to cases of critical hits being larger and causing more damage. Critical hits gives a 100% bonus to regular hits.
And this has what to do with anything? I would agree the BoA axe is BiS, but many people don't have access to BoA's.



NickeQuick said:
BAR and Corpsemaker both have 132 top end damage. 132 * 2 = 264

TLA has a top end damage of 106. 106 * 2 = 212

For each critical hit you are missing out on 52 damage if you go with TLA. This does not include some other things you have to factor in like strength and critical strike rating given by the weapon.

And this is completely irrelevant. Yes TLA hits for more, but it hits more often, and over time will do more damage.

The stats on TLA are better than CM.

NickeQuick said:
The chance of crusader proc'ing is shown below.

Chance on hit (%) = weapon speed * 1.82

BAR and Corpsemaker are both 3.8 speed which is a 6.916% chance on hit.

TLA has a speed of 2.7 which gives a 4.914% chance on hit.

An extra 100 strength will give you 200 more attack power. Considering that an average level 29 paladin has around 400 attack power this means that a crusader proc will increase a paladins attack power to 150%.

Again, irrelevant. You have NO instant attacks at ALL in the bracket, chance to proc per swing makes no difference, as all weapons will see the same proc rate over a period of time.



NickeQuick said:
Hopefully these numbers provided will finally close the case of why BAR and Corpsemaker are so much of a better choice for paladins and warriors than TLA.



Hopefully I managed to clear up all the misinformation in the post I've been quoting, and people can make thier own decision.



TLA = More DPS

CM = More Dmg/Swing



Some situations CM is better (rogues, Hunters, Mages) and in other sitations TLA is the better option.



Oh, also, TLA would give less chance to two shot that level 21 mage running around naked. But if you really care about your effectiviness of killing people with <~1500 hp, you arent the kind of twink these forums are intended to help.
 
I'm a fan of slow weapons, but TLA got one rather huge benefit, imo:



When Crusader procs you'll have 5 swings with TLA, but only 3 (almost 4) with CM/BAR, while having +100 str.



That ought to be factored in if some mathdude does the math again ^_^
 
holy shit, you people are so ridiculously retarded.



the guy who wrote the wall of text needs to just delete all his characters and quit the game. i can't believe people still don't have this shit figured out after this game has been out for like 6 years.



stop.



posting.



about.



TLA.



being better than.



corpsemaker.



it's not. the verdict has been out. it's been out for years. it's virtually unanimous, save for the random retards like this guy.



just stop. posting. about it.
 
Thanks for that wonderfully inept arguement as to the benefits of CM over TLA.



This is the kind of thing these forums are for - discussion on twinking.



the verdict has been out. it's been out for years. it's virtually unanimous, save for the random retards like this guy.



Because some random people said something for long enough years ago doesnt make it true now.



If youd like to prove CM is better than TLA, please, go ahead. So far, the arguemants stand:



In favor of TLA:

Faster Speed;

More inturrupts, more swings while Crusader is up, Faster removal of Inner Fire/shaman shields, Faster Totem killing.

Better Stats;

3 str more and ~4 dps more than CM



In favor of CM:

More dmg/swing, better than TLA for kiting/jousting fights.



Since straight DPS fights occur just as often as kiting, theres no reason NOT to use a TLA when you arent Jousting/being kited.



Saying "it's not. the verdict has been out" in no way makes CM better than TLA. Please contribute to the topic if you continue to post in this thread.
 
actually, it does.



TLA is a completely terrible weapon for every class that can use it at 29. read that sentence. now read it again about 300 times. done? read it 500 more times.



it's just that easy. i just said it, and it's 100% true. amazing how that works. maybe i'm some kind of truthsayer genius? along with the 99% of the rest of the 29 twinks who agree with me? or maybe you're just a retarded-ass noob who can't understand an unbelievably simple concept in an unbelievably simple game.
 
i don't normally do any theorycrafting, my math may be wrong since its late here and i know this is the 29 thread, but i did decide to look at a comparison between Lumbering Ogre Axe/Mograine's Might based on the new change to SoC since i have these weaps for my 39 retnub. basically LoA is 3.9spd and MM is 2.8, with the change to SoC making it a constant 36% weap dmg per swing, this does appear to make the faster weapon a better choice. on avg with LoA you would be hitting for around 132 and 109 with MM. 36% of each is 48/LoA and 39/MM for a total of approx 180/148 respectively.



if we use these numbers and look at it over a 30 sec fight, LoA is is giving 7.7 swings/30 while MM is giving 10.7 so we get LoA 1386 dmg/30 and MM at 1583 dmg/30. LoA ends up being 46.2 dps and MM 52.7.



since most fights do last longer than 5 seconds, the faster weapon does now seem better for pallies with the SoC change. i totally agree with the slower weapon for burst when SoC was based on AP and was a proc chance. have to see how burst-ie things are come patch day.
 
Maybe you should just try to get a clue to be honest.

Tell me how Darzk is supposed to be wrong. He's explaining his opinion towards TLA clearly and until you can tell me how CM is supposed to be better when fighting a warrior for example, I'll believe Darzk. And please tell me how 99% of 29 twinks would agree with someone as 'mature' as you. Hey, this battle is lost. Darzk has valid arguments, all you do is keep talking how right you are without even trying to prove anything. There's no reason anyone should believe you.



(I think I know what's coming now... 'OMAGEH I DUN GIF SH!T BOUT YOU IDC WHAT U TINK U NO MATTER TO ME U RETARD. AINT NO FKCIN BATTLE. I AM LLOYDFCKINGGANKZZ AND I SPEAK TRUUUUF')
 
Burst is always > sustained dps.



CM > TLA



I hope I cleared things up for everyone.
 
Lloydganks said:
actually, it does.



TLA is a completely terrible weapon for every class that can use it at 29. read that sentence. now read it again about 300 times. done? read it 500 more times.



it's just that easy. i just said it, and it's 100% true. amazing how that works. maybe i'm some kind of truthsayer genius? along with the 99% of the rest of the 29 twinks who agree with me? or maybe you're just a retarded-ass noob who can't understand an unbelievably simple concept in an unbelievably simple game.



I think you may be missing the point of the discussion--that the Paladin class is changing in the next patch--and this *MIGHT* make TLA better (for pallys only)--that is what they are trying to assertain.
 
twentynine said:
Burst is always > sustained dps.



See, this is my whole point. This isn't true, and has never been true. Certainly there are situations where burst is the primary factor, and certainly Paladins have some pretty good burst potential. However, with burst being lowered YET AGAIN with this next patch, DPS becomes more and more beneficial over burst. For certain fights.



And, again, the next patch will see a lessening in the importance of burst because you will ONLY be fighting other twinks, so the average health pool of your opponents will be increasing.
 
darzk said:
See, this is my whole point. This isn't true, and has never been true. Certainly there are situations where burst is the primary factor, and certainly Paladins have some pretty good burst potential. However, with burst being lowered YET AGAIN with this next patch, DPS becomes more and more beneficial over burst. For certain fights.



And, again, the next patch will see a lessening in the importance of burst because you will ONLY be fighting other twinks, so the average health pool of your opponents will be increasing.



NO. just NO. burst has ALWAYS been the ONLY thing that matters in pvp when it comes to doing damage. THE. ONLY. THING.



burst is NOT being lowered next patch for ret paladins at 29. what in the diddly are you talking about? have you been on the PTR on your 29 ret pally....? let me answer the question for you: you haven't, or else you wouldn't be posting this garbage. good riddance.



"lessening in the importance of burst because you will be fighting other twinks with larger health pools"....???????? here's where i know you're trolling for sure, because this statement is stupider than trying to breathe underwater. why the diddly do you think burst is so important in the first place....? that's right, because you need the unpredictable burst damage to be able to take down players' larger health pools. jeeeesus, welcome to 1st-grade level logical reasoning.



good lord, where are you even coming up with this complete and utter bullshit???? you have to be trolling. every single thing you have posted has been completely 100% wrong - that spells T-R-O-L-L to me.



edit: reporting your post for trolling because everything you say is so damn stupid and counterproductive.
 

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