Show your 24s.

[Skanktmonius]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but half of this thread seems to be debate over whether or not level 24s will ruin the bracket. The sentiment from those arguing that 24s WILL ruin the bracket is that people should not roll 24s because they are too OP and will ruin everything. However, the entire twink community was founded on the idea of creating character that is as powerful as possible within a given bracket with the best possible gear in order to have a huge advantage over the competition and essentially faceroll everyone. A good group of the twink community farmed WSG graveyards for hours on end years ago. What was fair or balanced about any of that?



And now you're asking the very same people to resist the urge to create the most powerful character possible, i.e. a level 24? Do you not see the futility of such a request?

 

[Nohealsforju]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but half of this thread seems to be debate over whether or not level 24s will ruin the bracket. The sentiment from those arguing that 24s WILL ruin the bracket is that people should not roll 24s because they are too OP and will ruin everything. However, the entire twink community was founded on the idea of creating character that is as powerful as possible within a given bracket with the best possible gear in order to have a huge advantage over the competition and essentially faceroll everyone. A good group of the twink community farmed WSG graveyards for hours on end years ago. What was fair or balanced about any of that?



And now you're asking the very same people to resist the urge to create the most powerful character possible, i.e. a level 24? Do you not see the futility of such a request?

This makes way to much sense you must be banned.



Edit: Also wanted to share this... Any one who can get http://www.wowhead.com/item=9449 should use it for the ability (talking to Ret pallys, Arms Warriors, Feral Druids). Look at the Effect:

Now i have used the effect in Bgs i basically auto attack people to death.

(In b4 nice keybinds bro)

 

[Bone]

This makes way to much sense you must be banned.



Edit: Also wanted to share this... Any one who can get Manual Crowd Pummeler - Item - World of Warcraft should use it for the ability (talking to Ret pallys, Arms Warriors, Feral Druids). Look at the Effect:

Now i have used the effect in Bgs i basically auto attack people to death.

(In b4 nice keybinds bro)

If you pop it on a holy pally your flash heals are like instant.



I think it would be most OP for druids though considering they are the only energy users that can wield it. 500 haste would be like infinite energy and quick ticking dots for them.



OH NOT THE SECRET IS OUT

 

[Wittyscrub]

I might even just level a 24 for that mace

 

[Frosty]

Cause im a wishful tinker with the worst intentions, this will be the last chance you get to drop my name.

 

[Nohealsforju]

If you pop it on a holy pally your flash heals are like instant.



I think it would be most OP for druids though considering they are the only energy users that can wield it. 500 haste would be like infinite energy and quick ticking dots for them.



OH NOT THE SECRET IS OUT

Flash heals are about a .534 cast Exos are .545, Auto attack speed 1.3. Ya the mace is good for that Proc but again it is a 1 hour CD. So i only use it when i am on EFC or in super clutch situations but during the day i may use it on GY farming bads they deserve it.

 

[Goomphy]

If you want an non-existent bracket make a 24...but if you want a bracket that just might make it and you'll enjoy many WSG to come make a 20. Agree 100% with this guy after 2k hks in the bracket. 24s will ruin it for everyone. And I personally advocate that all 24s be KOS and 24s on your team be completely ignored.



-Ink

I stood back and took a good hard look at what you're saying. You have some very good points and good concerns, but I think the attitude is perhaps going a bit south from where it should be. Perhaps you're doing as much to damage the bracket as the people rolling 24s. You're asking that 24s be killed on sight and that they be completely ignored. Why? To make them quit? Do you justify treating people in this manner because you think you'll save the bracket? Step back from the game for a minute and just be a human being. Is it right to try to make people quit doing what they like because they don't do it your way? Is it right to ignore people you know nothing about because they don't share your views? Twinkinfo offers the community a good place to go to share information and to find others who share their interests. It's not justifiable to be disrespectful, however, when you're not getting your way. The attitude seems to be one... We'll have it our way, and if we don't get it, we'll make everyone not going along with us so miserable they'll walk away. What kind of attitude is that? It stinks! It's also not working when practiced.



I've noticed in some BGs where people who perpetuate this less than desirable attitude, that they'll gang up on and kill other 24s on sight USING some 24s. They're not ignoring them, they're communicating with them and asking for them to help. It's just a vicious circle. On the faction I play in, I've noticed nobody is nasty to the 24s on their team. I'm sure it's the same on the opposite faction as well. I've seen the same attitude towards "banned" items or "banned" builds. I've even had hateful whispers from people, in the 29 bracket, that if I didn't do this, they would ignore me and I would get no heals. Really...



This is a game. It's not going anywhere and neither is the bracket. F2P is free and unlike other brackets that have come and gone, this one has a constant supply of new people pouring into it. You're not in control of this, and you're not going to be. Perhaps it's time to simply enjoy one another and play the game. What's going on here is just stupid. I'd really like to see Twinkinfo get back to theorycrafting and solid information instead of the spreading of contempt.



Here's one other angle I'll bring up and then I'll shut up. "24s be KOS and 24s on your team be completely ignored".... I'll translate it to... "The people who aren't paying should do everything to make the paying customers stop playing." WoW is losing subscribers. I dare say that this attitude has contributed to it, if even in a small way. Time to get along and play nice kids. It's a game, not a place to solve our personal vendettas by treating others like poo.



/getoffsoapbox



Be well.

 

[allahkazam]

It's more like if you want a nonexistant bracket then alliance needs to keep holding the flag to farm and farm the GY as often as possible, because horde side i get instant pops at all hours of the day. It's no secret that alliance has more twinks and horde has more 400 hp new to the game players. It's ok to blame 24s though. Me and Saxx just got out of a game where the alliance was camping. The people I queue with play to win and don't camp or farm or do awful things not related to winning but when alliance camps the GY and holds the flag to win it's pushing it. You not only piss off actual good players who have 24s and are thinking about making 20s but you punish actual new players to the game. You need both sides to queue to get games, and if you push the f2p 20 horde players so far down that they don't want to queue, your shitty brigade of human hunters/rogues/priests/paladins are going to collect dust.



So yeah, killing 24s on sight might solve one problem while COMPLETELY ignoring another. Be my guest to kill my 24 on sight. I'll make sure a 20 on AP never gets another AGM as long as my sub is up. Play fair and win with class and you may have a bracket worth playing/saving.

 

[IpayIwin]

It's more like if you want a nonexistant bracket then alliance needs to keep holding the flag to farm and farm the GY as often as possible, because horde side i get instant pops at all hours of the day. It's no secret that alliance has more twinks and horde has more 400 hp new to the game players. It's ok to blame 24s though. Me and Saxx just got out of a game where the alliance was camping. The people I queue with play to win and don't camp or farm or do awful things not related to winning but when alliance camps the GY and holds the flag to win it's pushing it. You not only piss off actual good players who have 24s and are thinking about making 20s but you punish actual new players to the game. You need both sides to queue to get games, and if you push the f2p 20 horde players so far down that they don't want to queue, your shitty brigade of human hunters/rogues/priests/paladins are going to collect dust.



So yeah, killing 24s on sight might solve one problem while COMPLETELY ignoring another. Be my guest to kill my 24 on sight. I'll make sure a 20 on AP never gets another AGM as long as my sub is up. Play fair and win with class and you may have a bracket worth playing/saving.

This ^



lol10char

 

[Inkobah]

It's more like if you want a nonexistant bracket then alliance needs to keep holding the flag to farm and farm the GY as often as possible, because horde side i get instant pops at all hours of the day. It's no secret that alliance has more twinks and horde has more 400 hp new to the game players. It's ok to blame 24s though. Me and Saxx just got out of a game where the alliance was camping. The people I queue with play to win and don't camp or farm or do awful things not related to winning but when alliance camps the GY and holds the flag to win it's pushing it. You not only piss off actual good players who have 24s and are thinking about making 20s but you punish actual new players to the game. You need both sides to queue to get games, and if you push the f2p 20 horde players so far down that they don't want to queue, your shitty brigade of human hunters/rogues/priests/paladins are going to collect dust.



So yeah, killing 24s on sight might solve one problem while COMPLETELY ignoring another. Be my guest to kill my 24 on sight. I'll make sure a 20 on AP never gets another AGM as long as my sub is up. Play fair and win with class and you may have a bracket worth playing/saving.

You're right and you're wrong at the same time. You're right that Alliance farming hurts things...you're right that KOS on 24s hurts things...but you're wrong in the whole reasoning in rolling 24s to begin with. Do you not see that this whole thing is a downward spiral? Think about the logic here:



19 F2P kill our bracket > Let's create 24s to pay F2P players back > Alliance Chars GY farm us > Horde Players don't want to queue > You threaten to camp 20s in the arena on AP > ??? > ???? > Bracket is ruined



Basically the douche baggery has to stop, one person at a time...so we can have a nice little bracket.



-Ink

 

[allahkazam]

You're right and you're wrong at the same time. You're right that Alliance farming hurts things...you're right that KOS on 24s hurts things...but you're wrong in the whole reasoning in rolling 24s to begin with. Do you not see that this whole thing is a downward spiral? Think about the logic here:



19 F2P kill our bracket > Let's create 24s to pay F2P players back > Alliance Chars GY farm us > Horde Players don't want to queue > You threaten to camp 20s in the arena on AP > ??? > ???? > Bracket is ruined



Basically the douche baggery has to stop, one person at a time...so we can have a nice little bracket.



-Ink

i'm more than willing to play by the rules and help people as much as I can wherever and however that may be. I'm not willing to roll over and only play a 20 while free to play players are stubbornly thinking they are right for playing a 19 with no enchants. The 20-24 bracket is yours. Free players fuel those queues. At 19, it's an established and active bracket with a large player base already. The same gear/enchant disparity between 24s and 20s exists with free to play 19s and paid 19s. It's the exact same. The only difference is the chance to hit. And yet people spout off about how they can be valuable and more people should be doing it. Couple that with being GY farmed even while playing a 24 hunter because the rest of my team I wouldn't even let pug RFC with me and you get why it's hard for me to care.

 

[Inkobah]

i'm more than willing to play by the rules and help people as much as I can wherever and however that may be. I'm not willing to roll over and only play a 20 while free to play players are stubbornly thinking they are right for playing a 19 with no enchants. The 20-24 bracket is yours. Free players fuel those queues. At 19, it's an established and active bracket with a large player base already. The same gear/enchant disparity between 24s and 20s exists with free to play 19s and paid 19s. It's the exact same. The only difference is the chance to hit. And yet people spout off about how they can be valuable and more people should be doing it. Couple that with being GY farmed even while playing a 24 hunter because the rest of my team I wouldn't even let pug RFC with me and you get why it's hard for me to care.

This is classic self-deception (where you elevate your needs/wants/desires higher than others and you justify it). You gotta keep in mind that a small portion of those playing F2P in any bracket come here and are even aware that there is an issue w/ what you've described with 19s. But we can help that slowly...you just gotta educate people a bit. Like I've said multiple times: you don't solve 1 problem by creating another problem. That may be how the government works but guess how that's working out? You justifying your crapping on 1 bracket because someone crapped on yours is just sad really. Can you not see an issue with that line of logic? Or are you so self-deceived that you can't see it?



I mean think about it this way, someone steals your car...does that mean you go and steal someone else's car? No (but if your answer is yes, good luck telling the cops that as they won't be like "Oh we understand now...you're off the hook!"). Or if a good friend stabs you in the back...does that mean you go and stab other friends in the back? You see where I'm going with this? Same thing applies here, you don't crap on 1 bracket bc someone else did it to the one you prefer. You just try to fix the problem with you own bracket...not create problems in a new one.



On the positive note, many of the issues that people are complaining about with 20s I hope to help fix. I'm about to purchase a lvl 25 Horde guild on Lightninghoof so those with P2P accounts can roll 20s on Horde side and they can counter-act the Eyepatch complaints by getting the BoA Helm. If you're interested let me know. I'll post a recruitment thread once I officially secure the guild.



-Ink

 

[allahkazam]

I'm making a 20 that will adhere to f2p limitations though. I'm more than willing to help any p2p 20 on servers where I have gold or higher levels. It's not even a vindictive thing. It's a frustration that people who aren't even paying for the game every month are crapping on the 19 bracket and don't seem to really care and then they have the nerve to be outraged that 19s are doing the same to them. I'm talking about what I see here. By the same token people should be discouraged from rolling 24s, they should be discouraged from rolling free to play 19s unless they plan on upgrading their account.



And yeah playing my 24 hunter doesn't solve any problems but it makes me feel better to let some GY farming scrubs know that there is always a bigger fish in the pond.

 

[roudy]

i even understand the anger at the 19's, i have a warrior at 19 i dont que with becuase my gear isnt finished legs/gloves, i dont even understand how anyone can have fun/think there competitive at 19 without BiS enchants and gear. much like when we get random people in 39's with sub 2k hp and no chants who decided to turn there xp off for fun. i have a new warrior at 20 and he will hopefully be geared in time for this weekends ab call to arms but i do have one item that isnt f2p friendly i may be using >.<

 

[Skanktmonius]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but half of this thread seems to be debate over whether or not level 24s will ruin the bracket. The sentiment from those arguing that 24s WILL ruin the bracket is that people should not roll 24s because they are too OP and will ruin everything. However, the entire twink community was founded on the idea of creating character that is as powerful as possible within a given bracket with the best possible gear in order to have a huge advantage over the competition and essentially faceroll everyone. A good group of the twink community farmed WSG graveyards for hours on end years ago. What was fair or balanced about any of that?



And now you're asking the very same people to resist the urge to create the most powerful character possible, i.e. a level 24? Do you not see the futility of such a request?

Quoting myself. My point is valid.

 

[Nohealsforju]

This makes way to much sense you must be banned.

re-quoting myself to further solidify Skant's post.

 

[Skanktmonius]

LOL Noheals, I just realized that given the recent trends of this thread, everyone might as well start quoting themselves as no one has really said anything new...since my first post of course ~_^



That's probably how most threads could go nowadays. A point has begun being argued, and after the first 6 posts or so people can just begin quoting themselves from that point on. Last word wins?

 

[Goomphy]

What I know is there's hate being spread here. It might not be on purpose, but it's definitely happening. I was just in a battleground (WSG) with Igork and Origin (but with a funny "i" before the "n"). They all but threw the battleground and did nothing but insult and call the 24s as many nasty things as they could think, while quoting the people here. They refused to heal flag carriers, and participate much in anything. I understand the desire to have a good balanced battleground, but what's happening with the "screw you 24s" attitude that is well founded at twinkinfo.com, we have a destructive force at work that's doing more to ruin the community than imbalance could ever hope to achieve. It's time to stop the hate. Let's act like human beings. Enough is enough. By the methods suggested here by administration, it's the administration and its followers that has become the largest threat and destructive force to the bracket. A nasty but obvious truth. Time to own up to our mistakes and fix it.

 

[Nohealsforju]

24s can be defeated by 20s if they knew how to play instead of rage at us say "you have 4 levels on us more gear and abilities" imo people should just deal with the fact we are here and we are que- i mean we aren't going anywhere. I love the 20-24 bracket as since it is a lot more balanced than the 19 bracket. Of course hunters need to be controlled. Again i had a warsong today there was only 1 hunter on horde i was on alliance. The game was overall fun no BS burst except from myself since i am a rogue i was killed multiple times though. Alliance did win 2-1. Horde kind of fell apart even though they got the 1st cap.

 

[mookjr]

one of the issues with most of the arguments here are that there are several kinds of f2p players.

1. 19s that are trying to be spiteful. They intentionally join xp off bgs just to mess with the bracket (p2p can do this too)

2. 19s that are 'just trying it out' and are probably even more undergeared than type1 (these can be p2p players as well)

3. 19s that are skilled, but have a gear dis-advantage (game breaking for pre-mades, but rarely an issue for pugs)

4. 20s that have reached their trial cap, regardless of skill or gear level

5. 20s that have reached the end of their leveling and are skilled, but have a gear and hit dis-advantage (vs 24s)

6. 20s that are p2p that have imposed a set of rules on themselves to limit gear disparities with f2p

7. 24s



Anyone that is arguing that the bracket is going to be dominated by type 5 and 6 to create a healthy, competitive battle ground feels dilussional to me. The skill gap is more likely going to be type 4 vs 6, which means it just takes you longer to own them.



That's like saying that every random pug first person shooter you played would be a good game because everyone has the same gear....a bunch of 20s in the same guild trying to pretend they are trial accounts are going to roll the real trial customers left and right.