Should something like this be allowed in the Twink Cup/PuG's?
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Mocha
Legendary
My personal opinion is that this jump has a difficulty of about 7/10 for an ally melee while under pressure if I were to rate it. It's not impossible to reach an EFC who's up there. Should FCs constantly be using it? No... However, you're still in range of any RDPS and with stacks you're going to be 1 shot by any real ranged DPS so this jump is really only useful for a few minutes before stacks reach a significant height.
In my opinion, 9/10 times if the person doing this jump lives longer than the other FC who's able to kite without stacks / LOS, chances are this jump will not change the outcome of the game in the slightest. The Ally FC should technically be LOSing the Horde offense and if he dies before 4-5 stacks (at which point, this Horde jump is more damaging than it is beneficial) then imo the jump has 0 advantage as it seems the Ally team is doomed to fail to begin with.
How many games do you see a horde offense even enter the ally base before 4-5 stacks? Very rarely do horde really organize any sizable offensive threat. This jump puts you at a huge disadvantage against ranged DPS so he's literally either going to be chopped by melee while losing ranged, or freecasted by ranged while being hard to reach by melee.
Personally this jump has more significant disadvantages than it has advantages which is why nobody ever uses it. I could see it being "broken" on a team with 0 ranged DPS, but if your team has 0 ranged DPS you're doomed to fail long before FCing comes into the equation.
Imo this jump really just shuts up feral druids and rogues... which let's get real.... are pretty cheap to begin with if you ask me.
I was in a game where this was being done and we were heavily underpowered on defense. We had 1 resto shammy and me as a ret pally helping to heal on D. Perhaps we had 1 monk or something but let's get real here, I did not think that we'd make it through a single assault. I remember switching to heartsong BAR so I could spam heal our shammy who's hp was dancing between 5%-20% for about 25 seconds. Had I not gotten off a hoj and had I not had heartsong, I would have been oom right before the heal that lasted the shammy through the ally assault. Our FC could have been in range and the only difference would have been that the damage would have been distributed throughout more players instead of just being done to our healer. If the ally couldn't kill a resto shammy with a retpally healer, I doubt anything serious would have happened to our 4k HP tank had he been more accessible. Just my opinion though.
I don't think this is something that should happen every game, however, in pugs I think it's quite fine if a FC wants to become a sitting duck to any ranged DPS. This doesn't apply to the twink cup IMO because nobody would be idiotic enough to use this in a serious premade against an organized team. If there were a LOS feature to this jump to ranged DPS, then this jump would be insanely cheap. However, there isn't so I don't see it as anything terribly game changing. Premades aren't an O / D strat any more... it's a glorified mid scrum with FCs as close to the cap whilst being in range of heals as possible. Unless something huge with the current meta is going to change the premade strat, I don't see any situation in a premade where this would be used but that's just me.
In my opinion, 9/10 times if the person doing this jump lives longer than the other FC who's able to kite without stacks / LOS, chances are this jump will not change the outcome of the game in the slightest. The Ally FC should technically be LOSing the Horde offense and if he dies before 4-5 stacks (at which point, this Horde jump is more damaging than it is beneficial) then imo the jump has 0 advantage as it seems the Ally team is doomed to fail to begin with.
How many games do you see a horde offense even enter the ally base before 4-5 stacks? Very rarely do horde really organize any sizable offensive threat. This jump puts you at a huge disadvantage against ranged DPS so he's literally either going to be chopped by melee while losing ranged, or freecasted by ranged while being hard to reach by melee.
Personally this jump has more significant disadvantages than it has advantages which is why nobody ever uses it. I could see it being "broken" on a team with 0 ranged DPS, but if your team has 0 ranged DPS you're doomed to fail long before FCing comes into the equation.
Imo this jump really just shuts up feral druids and rogues... which let's get real.... are pretty cheap to begin with if you ask me.
I was in a game where this was being done and we were heavily underpowered on defense. We had 1 resto shammy and me as a ret pally helping to heal on D. Perhaps we had 1 monk or something but let's get real here, I did not think that we'd make it through a single assault. I remember switching to heartsong BAR so I could spam heal our shammy who's hp was dancing between 5%-20% for about 25 seconds. Had I not gotten off a hoj and had I not had heartsong, I would have been oom right before the heal that lasted the shammy through the ally assault. Our FC could have been in range and the only difference would have been that the damage would have been distributed throughout more players instead of just being done to our healer. If the ally couldn't kill a resto shammy with a retpally healer, I doubt anything serious would have happened to our 4k HP tank had he been more accessible. Just my opinion though.
I don't think this is something that should happen every game, however, in pugs I think it's quite fine if a FC wants to become a sitting duck to any ranged DPS. This doesn't apply to the twink cup IMO because nobody would be idiotic enough to use this in a serious premade against an organized team. If there were a LOS feature to this jump to ranged DPS, then this jump would be insanely cheap. However, there isn't so I don't see it as anything terribly game changing. Premades aren't an O / D strat any more... it's a glorified mid scrum with FCs as close to the cap whilst being in range of heals as possible. Unless something huge with the current meta is going to change the premade strat, I don't see any situation in a premade where this would be used but that's just me.
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Muskie
OG
Look at the post right above you. Tell me its hard.
Muskie
OG
2.5/10 be fair some people in the bracket from EU and NZ, ping makes everything harder
No. I consider it a jump, not an exploit.
Muskie
OG
IMO, if its something like this, it should be allowed, because if a team is able to get out of mid and set up some sort of D around a jump like this i can only see it being good for the meta.
Mocha
Legendary
As an ally melee avoiding defensive snares I'd give it a 7/10.
Honey Badger
OG
Just as Muskie stated , If your team :
1) let EFC get across mid
2) let the other team set up D around
3) Has a team full of melee (where other team strat was to build range around this D)
1,2, & 3 is all your fault for not being ready.
It's your team's lead responsibility for putting together such poor comp with restrictives on your O , just because your O can't reach the Efc doesn't mean another teams Offense comp this set up couldn't crush this Defensive Strat . Letting an Efc build stacks like sitting duck is bad. This jump should be allowed.
The the only Crime here is someone may have let you see their Teams Defensive Strat before the Twinky Cup. Since Twinky Cup is not tomorrow get your teams Offense prepped better on superiors Mid Strat and if someone uses this strat be ready for it. The only people complaining is maybe a team complied of melee on their Ofense or Unskillful Range or piss poor target caller.
1) let EFC get across mid
2) let the other team set up D around
3) Has a team full of melee (where other team strat was to build range around this D)
1,2, & 3 is all your fault for not being ready.
It's your team's lead responsibility for putting together such poor comp with restrictives on your O , just because your O can't reach the Efc doesn't mean another teams Offense comp this set up couldn't crush this Defensive Strat . Letting an Efc build stacks like sitting duck is bad. This jump should be allowed.
The the only Crime here is someone may have let you see their Teams Defensive Strat before the Twinky Cup. Since Twinky Cup is not tomorrow get your teams Offense prepped better on superiors Mid Strat and if someone uses this strat be ready for it. The only people complaining is maybe a team complied of melee on their Ofense or Unskillful Range or piss poor target caller.
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Allybeboba
Legend
Allybeboba
Legend
As many have responded, like Mocha and Honeybadger. If your team was a well balanced team, had a nice compliment of both melee AND range there would be no issue. The real issue is the EFC should have never had the time to get there in the first place.
If it happens again, just come up with an alternate strategy. There are many that I can think of just right off the top of my head.
/cheers.
If it happens again, just come up with an alternate strategy. There are many that I can think of just right off the top of my head.
/cheers.
RANDYLAYHEE
Legend
LOL this isn't even a hard jump it shouldn't be considered a hack in any way its just like the fence jump at horde ramp if u wanna ban this jump u will have to ban them all but I think the fence and this jump r apart of twinking and fcing. In my eyes this is the same as horde fence jump. if ur against this then ur against fence jump and all other lil jumps everyone uses on a daily basis.
RANDYLAYHEE
Legend
plus the twink cup wont be like random wsg if u think this jump can be pulled off easy during the twink cup with some hard hitting twinks riding your a ss I don't know if it will save u. 
lol.
lol.
Jetlife
Legend
wall jumping is a simple thing but being able to master consistantly doing it takes alot of practice and perfectly replicating your shit when doing it without more than a second or 2 of a break between jumps.. imo its not an easy thing so the people who are good got there from dedication at practicing jumps/the specific jumps theyre doing... so id allow it
but its mainly cuz balanced comp is gonna kill the guy anyway... then if his teammate dont know jumps as well, theyre fucked and the flag returns in the worst way possible.... with the delay from nobody clicking and gives other team time to make sure they are on cap/have defense secured or are moving toward the positions theyre trying to go
i wouldnt care if it was banned or got removed like made to not work anymore in a patch, cuz im not good at it. i use to be tho in my hayday when being good at it let u b able to wall jump to cool hidden shit, stuff they removed in the cataclysm/flying mounts in azeroth patch
but its mainly cuz balanced comp is gonna kill the guy anyway... then if his teammate dont know jumps as well, theyre fucked and the flag returns in the worst way possible.... with the delay from nobody clicking and gives other team time to make sure they are on cap/have defense secured or are moving toward the positions theyre trying to go
i wouldnt care if it was banned or got removed like made to not work anymore in a patch, cuz im not good at it. i use to be tho in my hayday when being good at it let u b able to wall jump to cool hidden shit, stuff they removed in the cataclysm/flying mounts in azeroth patch
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Allybeboba
Legend
Just remember...
Some have noted...
Button pushin' is a sport... kek
/cheers
Some have noted...
Button pushin' is a sport... kek
/cheers
OP
OP
Daddy
Legend
This whole argument of "it is east to get up there" is getting old fast, you say it is easy to get up there, ya, but what about for these newcomers to the 19 bracket that I can barely rely on to return a flag when the fc is on roof, let alone a jump like that, the truth is, about 25-35% of the bracket knows how to do simple ToT and fence jumps, something like this, that you rarely ever see, isn't going to be something that people will or even will want to learn. I'm not arguing that it isn't easy. But I'm merely arguing that people should be above stuff like this, and realize that they are part of that small fraction of players in this bracket that can do jumps, which is ok, if it involved getting somewhere that is originally accessible without doing a jump, but something like this, there is only one way up, learn the jump and try not to be rooted/slowed/sapped on your way to the efc.
This is an exploitation of a "jump" on the horde ramp to roof that takes you out of harms way from melee. Period. I am aware of other glitches and exploited spots in wsg, but that is irrelevant to the matter at hand.
Aintabanka
Legend
Hold your tongue tinkes, infractions getting handed out.
Shouldn't be banned, next poll.
Shouldn't be banned, next poll.
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