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No. It appears to me you replied to my post while completely missing my point, and now you're trying to explain it by saying we have different views of making sense.



Making sense to someone is a completely subjective matter. Obviously the rightwing conservatives will think Obamacare is nothing but waste of tax money, while the left liberals consider the closure of congress as utterly unnecessary.

Here is where the subective part kicks in. Someone who you fundamentally can't understand could subjectively be viewed as not making sense. However, that is not an obejctive view that is shared with everyone that has ever walked the earth.

Jva saying Ridwane doesn't make sense to him, is him expressing his subjective view on what Ridwane is saying. For instance Ridwane could be contradicting himself.

I'm also not sure what'd make you think Obama understands Beohmer; is there some sort of ethic rule that requires you to, when you can't agree with someone, atleast understand their reasoning?

I think your definition of making sense is to be practical or advisable, while my definition of making sense is to be coherent or intelligible.

"I think we should abolish the monarchy." Am I being coherent and intelligible? Yes. You clearly understand my point. But is it practical and/or advisable? That's up to your subjective view.

Do you think Obama is completely immune to Boehmer's way of reasoning? He obviously understands it, but has a different view on how to handle things in the most effective way possible. While Boehmer wants to give up more X in order to get more Y, Obama disagrees and prioritises X.

If someone contradicts themselves, they are factually not paricularly coherent.
 
I think your definition of making sense is to be practical or advisable, while my definition of making sense is to be coherent or intelligible.

"I think we should abolish the monarchy." Am I being coherent and intelligible? Yes. You clearly understand my point. But is it practical and/or advisable? That's up to your subjective view.

You're grasping for straws. If you wanna turn this argument into twisting words, sure, two can play that game. Admitting you have a different definition of "not making sense" than I do, is admitting you misinterpreted my first reply to Mocha.

I know you're not dumb, Hurrx, but you're really not returning any of my arguments - you dismiss them by saying we have different definitions.

IDo you think Obama is completely immune to Boehmer's way of reasoning? He obviously understands it, but has a different view on how to handle things in the most effective way possible. While Boehmer wants to give up more X in order to get more Y, Obama disagrees and prioritises X.

My answer still stands, you just repeated what you previously wrote. I could demolish your argument by replacing Obama's name with Hitler. Do you still think Boehner understood Hitler's reasoning? Was it acceptable?
 
You're grasping for straws. If you wanna turn this argument into twisting words, sure, two can play that game. Admitting you have a different definition of "not making sense" than I do, is admitting you misinterpreted my first reply to Mocha.

I know you're not dumb, Hurrx, but you're really not returning any of my arguments - you dismiss them by saying we have different definitions.



My answer still stands, you just repeated what you previously wrote. I could demolish your argument by replacing Obama's name with Hitler. Do you still think Boehner understood Hitler's reasoning? Was it acceptable?

What do you think political debates are for? Making the opposition laugh at the sense you don't make? Please, you're smarter than this. Politicians assume that the ones they are trying to convince to vote for their party understand but don't agree with the party's political concerns.

You haven't demolished my argument. You can't compare a totalitarian dictator, that didn't get his power democratically, with Obama. Hitler wouldn't get to the position Obama is right now, because he isn't supported by the people, nor is the economical situation in the US close to as bad as the crisis in Germany pre-WWII. The United States of America is a democracy, not a dictature.

If I misinterpreted your reply to Mocha, it was because I thought you meant being coherent and not necessarily practical when you said making sense. You're saying I'm repeating myself, and you still don't understand what I'm trying to say? Did you bet against yourself in this argument?

I'm not dismissing your arguments. I'm being rational by making sure our definition of making sense is the same. Otherwise any continuation of this argument would be futile.
 
What do you think political debates are for? Making the opposition laugh at the sense you don't make? Please, you're smarter than this. Politicians assume that the ones they are trying to convince to vote for their party understand but don't agree with the party's political concerns.

You are so recklessly wrong. The reason you are in two opposing parties from the very beginning is because you don't understand the other person's poltical belief - and that's the part where he doesn't make sense to you nor your reasoning. And even if you were to have a slight fragment of understanding for the other person's argument, would that disqualify you from thinking he doesn't make sense according to your ideological conviction?

Me, being right-oriented according to the Swedish political scale, can't understand Vänsterpartiets wish to remove homework and grades from school. No matter how hard I try, how long I think, or how many people I'd talk to, I still would see no reasoning behind it. It totally wouldn't make sense to me. Or, maybe I'm not allowed by you to admit to having no understanding for them or their propositions?

You haven't demolished my argument. You can't compare a totalitarian dictator, that didn't get his power democratically, with Obama. Hitler wouldn't get to the position Obama is right now, because he isn't supported by the people, nor is the economical situation in the US close to as bad as the crisis in Germany pre-WWII. The United States of America is a democracy, not a dictature.

I can, because according to you people who have opposing beliefs always have understanding for the other person's arguments. Whether he is a dictator or not, or if Germany was at a bad economical state has nothing to do with the point I'm getting at. To make it easy for you, I can switch the persons, geographical area and year:

[Insert random opposition party leader in Germany 1938] vs. the one and only Hitler. Hitler says he wants to exterminate all jews because they are the scum of the earth. [Random opposition part leader in Germany 1938] finds no reasoning as to why Hitler would commit such an inhumane act towards an ethnic group.

Does your principles still stand? If you still think the oppositoning leaders had understanding for Hitler's actions? If the answer remains yes I think you should take a look at yourself really. =)

If I misinterpreted your reply to Mocha, it was because I thought you meant being coherent and not necessarily practical when you said making sense. You're saying I'm repeating myself, and you still don't understand what I'm trying to say? Did you bet against yourself in this argument?

I'm not dismissing your arguments. I'm being rational by making sure our definition of making sense is the same. Otherwise any continuation of this argument would be futile.

I think I expressed myself rather clearly and made much little room for misunderstandings. However, I'm glad you came to your senses and admitted it.
 
I'm not picking side or anything but Jva were clearly not referring to the grammar itself. Someone with perfect grammar doesn't necesarilly have to make a great amount of sense.

I don't think Obama thinks that John Boehner makes much sense at all right now; though I'm sure John uses his grammar absolutely flawlessly.

Of course Saint is bringing racist remarks into this discussion (as usual) but what can you expect from him really?

link me one racist remark i've made in this thread and i'll pm mocha, and ask for a perma ban myself.

also, you've made plenty of remarks about "jaja's" your self. i'm sure every one in this thread remembers your former signature. or should we mention your fondness to fraud?

link me what i asked for or don't even bother replying. i've no interest in talking with criminals in the making, cheers. XXX
 
You are so recklessly wrong. The reason you are in two opposing parties from the very beginning is because you don't understand the other person's poltical belief - and that's the part where he doesn't make sense to you nor your reasoning. And even if you were to have a slight fragment of understanding for the other person's argument, would that disqualify you from thinking he doesn't make sense according to your ideological conviction?

Me, being right-oriented according to the Swedish political scale, can't understand Vänsterpartiets wish to remove homework and grades from school. No matter how hard I try, how long I think, or how many people I'd talk to, I still would see no reasoning behind it. It totally wouldn't make sense to me. Or, maybe I'm not allowed by you to admit to having no understanding for them or their propositions?



I can, because according to you people who have opposing beliefs always have understanding for the other person's arguments. Whether he is a dictator or not, or if Germany was at a bad economical state has nothing to do with the point I'm getting at. To make it easy for you, I can switch the persons, geographical area and year:

[Insert random opposition party leader in Germany 1938] vs. the one and only Hitler. Hitler says he wants to exterminate all jews because they are the scum of the earth. [Random opposition part leader in Germany 1938] finds no reasoning as to why Hitler would commit such an inhumane act towards an ethnic group.

Does your principles still stand? If you still think the oppositoning leaders had understanding for Hitler's actions? If the answer remains yes I think you should take a look at yourself really. =)



I think I expressed myself rather clearly and made much little room for misunderstandings. However, I'm glad you came to your senses and admitted it.

Is it somehow hard to understand that different political parties have different ways of pursuing a perfect society? Vänsterpartiet, like you mentioned, have their reasons. For instance, they think grades pressure the studens and affect their results negatively. Thus, they learn less, and our future society will be lead by less intelligent people. That's their theory. If you don't understand it, you would obviously not make a good politician. Try to argue against democracy by saying you don't understand the concept of it. "Democracy doesn't make sense to me. That's why it's wrong." Are you actually serious? VP presented their goals with well thought out arguments, probably based on statistics. The liberal parties try to counter this argument with their own.

Boehner would understand that Hitler thought the way he did. He would probably not agree with it, but he would understand the argument and argue against it in political debates. Boehner wouldn't want Hitler's wishes to come true, and thus he would try to get the people with him. How? By presenting them with facts enough to realise that Boehner's way of reaching an Utopia is better than a holocaust.

You should read up on German history. Hitler and his men got their power in 1933 and got rid of all the opposition. They didn't allow any other parties. They didn't even get their power democratically, the highest amount of votes they got was 37%. They started a persecution of the socialists and communists and made a deal with the ruling bourgeoisie to get rid of the communistic and socialistic parties from the parliament. Thus, they could limit the attention the left-wing politicians would get.

History class over.

I'll say it again. Just because you understand an argument doesn't necessarily mean you agree with it.

un·der·stand - To perceive and comprehend the nature and significance of; grasp.

Since we should be done derailing by now, why won't you send me a message on skype or PM me here on twinkinfo if there's any follow-up questions.
 
Is it somehow hard to understand that different political parties have different ways of pursuing a perfect society? Vänsterpartiet, like you mentioned, have their reasons. For instance, they think grades pressure the studens and affect their results negatively. Thus, they learn less, and our future society will be lead by less intelligent people. That's their theory. If you don't understand it, you would obviously not make a good politician. Try to argue against democracy by saying you don't understand the concept of it. "Democracy doesn't make sense to me. That's why it's wrong." Are you actually serious? VP presented their goals with well thought out arguments, probably based on statistics. The liberal parties try to counter this argument with their own.

Boehner would understand that Hitler thought the way he did. He would probably not agree with it, but he would understand the argument and argue against it in political debates. Boehner wouldn't want Hitler's wishes to come true, and thus he would try to get the people with him. How? By presenting them with facts enough to realise that Boehner's way of reaching an Utopia is better than a holocaust.

You should read up on German history. Hitler and his men got their power in 1933 and got rid of all the opposition. They didn't allow any other parties. They didn't even get their power democratically, the highest amount of votes they got was 37%. They started a persecution of the socialists and communists and made a deal with the ruling bourgeoisie to get rid of the communistic and socialistic parties from the parliament. Thus, they could limit the attention the left-wing politicians would get.

History class over.

I'll say it again. Just because you understand an argument doesn't necessarily mean you agree with it.

un·der·stand - To perceive and comprehend the nature and significance of; grasp.

Since we should be done derailing by now, why won't you send me a message on skype or PM me here on twinkinfo if there's any follow-up questions.
HA hurrx try hard.
 
that included attempting to win off topic's on an internet forums about politics.

Evolution at its best,

I too would be ashamed if I had evolved from something as intelligent as monkeys into someone who complains about others arguing themselves towards a conclusion.
 
I too would be ashamed if I had evolved from something as intelligent as monkeys into someone who complains about others arguing themselves towards a conclusion.

Yeah but if something is being discussed in a thread that is about a differing topic than all arguments and logical thought processes become void due to it not being in the proper thread.

Cmon guys really....

#Logik
 
I don't see the problem, except a hypocrite that insults me out of the blue and then tries to make a joke out of my reply not being neutral.

there isnt a problem QT im just highlighting the amount of energy put to discuss such a topic in a a niche bracket of wow.


too me seems unproductive, but keep arguing about details in point making on TI. keep up the good work.
 
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