US Migli's 2v2 invitational official thread

migli

migli

Veteran
Alright folks, welcome.

The tournament will be held on Sunday the 7th. I expect people so login at around 7 EST so we can get things started well and quick. The best situation would be to have 16 teams of 2 (so 32 players in total) to have the optimal tournament bracket.

*RULES*

1. No class stacking
2. Double hybrid is banned (none of that spriest/ret/boomy bs)
3. No hybrid/healers since off heals are already broken (im thinking about restoration affinity)
4. Double stealth is not banned (only viable double stealth is double rogue imo and its banned, therefore you can run resto/rogue if u want)
5. Tanks are allowed but not with a healer (dps/tank=OK healer/tank=NO)
6. Its wargames so none of those tinkers and consumables are usable so ye, use whatever you want in terms of on use including manual of clouds/trinkets who cares.


If with these rules I don't get enough sign-ups, i can slightly modify them since I want
people to actually show-up and have fun. If the even goes well, I can tweak them by banning specific comps because I don't think all double hybrid is broken and every comp has its own counters, for future tournaments.

*HOW TO SIGN UP*

Discord link : https://discord.gg/Jytkm9d

1. Go in the chat sign-ups.
2. Check for which team you will be. You should be able to check the previous sign-up and add one to the number, this requires few brain cells so you will be fine (if there are no messages then you are team 1). Then you type you and your partner character NAMES,SERVERS,FACTION, CLASSES AND SPECS -->IN ONE MESSAGE + REAL ID OF YOUR TEAM CAPTAIN!!!!
3. For tournament night, you will have your own channel for your team available during games.
4. Unfortunately, I will limit the players to one class only FOR THIS TOURNAMENT. I might change it later on for future ones.
5. Brackets will be generated randomly so snipping a counter wont be possible.
6. Have fun and be there on Sunday :)

This is a test to include variety in our games nights. I personally prefer arenas rather than BG's, so yeah

*OTHER STUFF*

I will take one admin/mod if any of you are interested in helping me/organizing stuff. Its optional, I don't think i'll need a bunch of help, but if you don't want to play and actually lay back in spectator mode with me I am totally fine with that :)

See you later on

Migli
 
migli said:
Alright folks, welcome.

The tournament will be held on Sunday the 7th. I expect people so login at around 7 EST so we can get things started well and quick. The best situation would be to have 16 teams of 2 (so 32 players in total) to have the optimal tournament bracket.

*RULES*

1. No class stacking
2. Double hybrid is banned (none of that spriest/ret/boomy bs)
3. No hybrid/healers since off heals are already broken (im thinking about restoration affinity)
4. Double stealth is not banned (only viable double stealth is double rogue imo and its banned, therefore you can run resto/rogue if u want)
5. Tanks are allowed but not with a healer (dps/tank=OK healer/tank=NO)
6. Its wargames so none of those tinkers and consumables are usable so ye, use whatever you want in terms of on use including manual of clouds/trinkets who cares.Migli
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I’ll start off with this is already a disappointment seeing how you’re not opting for a 3v3 tournament that would be more balanced and practical than a 2v2 tournament. Which would require players to step up their mechanical ability and situational awareness of play by play making.


Secondly I just made an spriest a week ago (and I’ll tell you leveling is gruelling), I’m the least motivated person in this game to grind let alone I don’t feel obligated enough to make another toon to comply with this vacuous tournament.


You’re essentially making this tournament double melee / rogue mage / melee healer tournament oriented only, which is RIDICULOUS. For my specific position / situation if I were to partake in this my only option would be to run melee (non hybrid), spriest which would instantaneously get countered by double melee. They sit on me and stop me from casting ever = no pressure and boom it’s one sided af.


Yes hybrid/healer would be overwhelming to fight. Yes hybrid/hybrid would be slightly difficult to fight against, but hybrid/hybrid is FAR from unrealistic to ban. This tournament would be won immediately with anyone win a brain running —> rogue/mage, rogue/druid, and/or rogue/priest.


I understand this is 59s and not max level but come on ! The tournament is already flawed and for it already not being 3v3 it’s without a doubt evident that you have little to nothing for arena experience. This screams biased, and you haven’t subjected yourself to proper player feedback and arena equilibrium.
 
Yowza said:

I’ll start off with this is already a disappointment seeing how you’re not opting for a 3v3 tournament that would be more balanced and practical than a 2v2 tournament. Which would require players to step up their mechanical ability and situational awareness of play by play making.


Secondly I just made an spriest a week ago (and I’ll tell you leveling is gruelling), I’m the least motivated person in this game to grind let alone I don’t feel obligated enough to make another toon to comply with this vacuous tournament.


You’re essentially making this tournament double melee / rogue mage / melee healer tournament oriented only, which is RIDICULOUS. For my specific position / situation if I were to partake in this my only option would be to run melee (non hybrid), spriest which would instantaneously get countered by double melee. They sit on me and stop me from casting ever = no pressure and boom it’s one sided af.


Yes hybrid/healer would be overwhelming to fight. Yes hybrid/hybrid would be slightly difficult to fight against, but hybrid/hybrid is FAR from unrealistic to ban. This tournament would be won immediately with anyone win a brain running —> rogue/mage, rogue/druid, and/or rogue/priest.


I understand this is 59s and not max level but come on ! The tournament is already flawed and for it already not being 3v3 it’s without a doubt evident that you have little to nothing for arena experience. This screams biased, and you haven’t subjected yourself to proper player feedback and arena equilibrium.
Click to expand...
I’m failing to see bias tbh. He’s trying to keep it balenced for a 2v2 which is hard in a twink bracket, as he said he’s open to suggestions and free to change if need be
 
Yowza said:

I’ll start off with this is already a disappointment seeing how you’re not opting for a 3v3 tournament that would be more balanced and practical than a 2v2 tournament. Which would require players to step up their mechanical ability and situational awareness of play by play making.


Secondly I just made an spriest a week ago (and I’ll tell you leveling is gruelling), I’m the least motivated person in this game to grind let alone I don’t feel obligated enough to make another toon to comply with this vacuous tournament.


You’re essentially making this tournament double melee / rogue mage / melee healer tournament oriented only, which is RIDICULOUS. For my specific position / situation if I were to partake in this my only option would be to run melee (non hybrid), spriest which would instantaneously get countered by double melee. They sit on me and stop me from casting ever = no pressure and boom it’s one sided af.


Yes hybrid/healer would be overwhelming to fight. Yes hybrid/hybrid would be slightly difficult to fight against, but hybrid/hybrid is FAR from unrealistic to ban. This tournament would be won immediately with anyone win a brain running —> rogue/mage, rogue/druid, and/or rogue/priest.


I understand this is 59s and not max level but come on ! The tournament is already flawed and for it already not being 3v3 it’s without a doubt evident that you have little to nothing for arena experience. This screams biased, and you haven’t subjected yourself to proper player feedback and arena equilibrium.
Click to expand...


Alright so i'll start off by saying that as a former 2700 player when I used to play and compete at end-game, I don't know what do you actually expect as a tournament host. Sorry I didn't get the 32 points I needed to get my rank 1 title.

My paladin --> https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/us/sargeras/glorea


Second, I would have preferred a 3v3 tournament but to keep a practical tournament bracket, i opted for 2v2 as it was the way to accept more players because a 3v3 tournament would have required too many players and trust me, 3v3 games are a nightmare because of the power of hybrids and their off healing and the lack of some key abilities in some classes' kit to complete their cc chain and was the type of games that I've practiced and experienced the most at 50-59 (didn't really queue a lot of 3v3). How about you? I've played around 100-150 games of 50-59 2v2s and found that players died outside of cooldowns, which is extremely different than end-game currently. You claim that a rogue/mage with players with brain would steamroll teams, which is true, but in a twink bracket, it isn't. They would need to be extremely high rated players with good arena experience and have the experience of having played in SEASONS that had HIGH BURST (Wrath is the best example) When players died outside of cooldowns. This is why I banned double hybrid. The fact that they can mitigate the off-cd burst with a lot of off -heals and that cross-cc is really hard to land (i think of spriest that lack stun) etc etc, i feel like double hybrid would have been the way to go. A mage/rogue at 120 make one mistake and their win rate drops to 25%. A mage/rogue at 59 make 1 stupid mistake and they automatically lose because of the burst outside of cooldowns. There are so many comps, not to mention sub/spriest that you didn't, claiming double melee would stomp you when clearly not considering the peel from the rogue forcing stupid trinkets into a win. Not everybody here is 2500 and the fact that we can reduce the gap between player skills by limitating the OP compositions, I feel like its the right track. Compositions are endless, not to mention that feral druids are extremely OP in 2v2 if played right, especially with something like a fire mage, which you probably didn't even think of. 2v2 at 59 is nice because a satisfying cc chain on a healer will lead to a kill outside of cooldowns, which wouldn't in 3v3, because of the lack of some classes cc to cross cc the hybrid. All classes have a decent kit at 59 and most compositions will have their counters and good matchups and this is why rng will come to play when making brackets. I appreciate the feedback and feel like trying to claim my little experience is arenas is the easy way to bash the rules, and that without even knowing it. You just said you rolled spriest, literally the best class if paired with a good partner, I don't really know why you act dissapointed. Q with a good surv/mm and youll be good. Possibilities are endless.

To be fair, 3v3 in 59s is not the quality of games you think you will get. Playing rogue/mage against healer/X is literally 10 times harder than playing walking dead or jungle, even god comp. I feel like you are the type of guy that wants the security of off-heals or even a healer when getting trained. Thats where real pvp experience comes into play and I think that 50-59 is the right place to show off what you are really capable of doing with a smaller kit and without broken traits from max level. Other than pressing 1 and 2 in 19s games.

Hopefully I'll see you Sunday, peace
 
migli said:
Alright so i'll start off by saying that as a former 2700 player when I used to play and compete at end-game, I don't know what do you actually expect as a tournament host. Sorry I didn't get the 32 points I needed to get my rank 1 title.

My paladin --> https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/us/sargeras/glorea


Second, I would have preferred a 3v3 tournament but to keep a practical tournament bracket, i opted for 2v2 as it was the way to accept more players because a 3v3 tournament would have required too many players and trust me, 3v3 games are a nightmare because of the power of hybrids and their off healing and the lack of some key abilities in some classes' kit to complete their cc chain and was the type of games that I've practiced and experienced the most at 50-59 (didn't really queue a lot of 3v3). How about you? I've played around 100-150 games of 50-59 2v2s and found that players died outside of cooldowns, which is extremely different than end-game currently. You claim that a rogue/mage with players with brain would steamroll teams, which is true, but in a twink bracket, it isn't. They would need to be extremely high rated players with good arena experience and have the experience of having played in SEASONS that had HIGH BURST (Wrath is the best example) When players died outside of cooldowns. This is why I banned double hybrid. The fact that they can mitigate the off-cd burst with a lot of off -heals and that cross-cc is really hard to land (i think of spriest that lack stun) etc etc, i feel like double hybrid would have been the way to go. A mage/rogue at 120 make one mistake and their win rate drops to 25%. A mage/rogue at 59 make 1 stupid mistake and they automatically lose because of the burst outside of cooldowns. There are so many comps, not to mention sub/spriest that you didn't, claiming double melee would stomp you when clearly not considering the peel from the rogue forcing stupid trinkets into a win. Not everybody here is 2500 and the fact that we can reduce the gap between player skills by limitating the OP compositions, I feel like its the right track. Compositions are endless, not to mention that feral druids are extremely OP in 2v2 if played right, especially with something like a fire mage, which you probably didn't even think of. 2v2 at 59 is nice because a satisfying cc chain on a healer will lead to a kill outside of cooldowns, which wouldn't in 3v3, because of the lack of some classes cc to cross cc the hybrid. All classes have a decent kit at 59 and most compositions will have their counters and good matchups and this is why rng will come to play when making brackets. I appreciate the feedback and feel like trying to claim my little experience is arenas is the easy way to bash the rules, and that without even knowing it. You just said you rolled spriest, literally the best class if paired with a good partner, I don't really know why you act dissapointed. Q with a good surv/mm and youll be good. Possibilities are endless.

To be fair, 3v3 in 59s is not the quality of games you think you will get. Playing rogue/mage against healer/X is literally 10 times harder than playing walking dead or jungle, even god comp. I feel like you are the type of guy that wants the security of off-heals or even a healer when getting trained. Thats where real pvp experience comes into play and I think that 50-59 is the right place to show off what you are really capable of doing with a smaller kit and without broken traits from max level. Other than pressing 1 and 2 in 19s games.

Hopefully I'll see you Sunday, peace
Click to expand...

Alright I’m going to dissect everything you have to say. “Starting off” with your paladin and arena exp. You received your 2.7 achieve in 2015 which was in wod, you’re talking to a man who has been r1 every season in that expansion. You got high end duelist, you might have been even “32 points” off your first gladiator, you’re far from r1 caliber. Hell I have more r1s than you’ve probably ever had girlfriends. 2.7 is overrated, I would have achieved numerous 3k achieves if they were accessible. NEXT.

You’re already expecting a large turnout for 2v2s (16 teams) and you say a 3v3 tournament would “require more players” lmao shoot for the moon I guess. With half of those 2s numbers for 3s id be more than content.

59s has inherently always been the most sophisticated and advanced bracket in regards to ‘kits’ for twinking. You’re crying about hybrid off-heals which have always been a fundamental part of the arena, if you don’t like it try cross cc’ing (i.e. get better). This entire game has been a continuous downfall, both 59s and end game are both notorious for killing people without consistent use of cds.

Mage rogue has the highest skill cap and if played efficiently can beat everything, quit trying to justify otherwise, because you look like an ignoramus. And no just because if you were to make one mistake as mage rogue at end game will not always cost the game, it’s called resetting and waiting on dr’s / using polymorph effectively to run and then setup. Quit going off about random examples acting like you know jack, when really you know shit.

“Not everyone here is 2500 and the fact we can reduce the gap between player skills by limiting the OP compositions”. Yikes man so you’d prefer to care bear the community as suppose to enhancing their skill and growing their game knowledge.

Even though I’m a fanatic over rot classes in twinking, my first intent wasn’t to roll spriest it’s just what I had ‘undeleted’ that was level 55 still back from mop. Don’t assume what I did or didn’t think of, because when you assume you make an ass out of yourself.

“I feel like you’re the type of guy that wants the security of off-heals or even a healer when getting trained.” There’s not a single class that I can’t play in a twink bracket at a max level. But here you go assuming yet again ..

“Thats where real pvp experience comes into play” in a lower skilled environment 2s over 3s ? by setting restrictions because you’re empty headed on how the game actually works. Between these subjective rules, and now opinions you have formed not only put me off but I’m certain others as well. Keep it up, you’re only stooping your own tourney more and more.
 
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Yowza said:
Alright I’m going to dissect everything you have to say. “Starting off” with your paladin and arena exp. You received your 2.7 achieve in 2015 which was in wod, you’re talking to a man who has been r1 every season in that expansion. You got high end duelist, you might have been even “32 points” off your first gladiator, you’re far from r1 caliber. Hell I have more r1s than you’ve probably ever had girlfriends. 2.7 is overrated, I would have achieved numerous 3k achieves if they were accessible. NEXT.

You’re already expecting a large turnout for 2v2s (16 teams) and you say a 3v3 tournament would “require more players” lmao shoot for the moon I guess. With half of those 2s numbers for 3s id be more than content.

59s has inherently always been the most sophisticated and advanced bracket in regards to ‘kits’ for twinking. You’re crying about hybrid off-heals which have always been a fundamental part of the arena, if you don’t like it try cross cc’ing (i.e. get better). This entire game has been a continuous downfall, both 59s and end game are both notorious for killing people without consistent use of cds.

Mage rogue has the highest skill cap and if played efficiently can beat everything, quit trying to justify otherwise, because you look like an ignoramus. And no just because if you were to make one mistake as mage rogue at end game will not always cost the game, it’s called resetting and waiting on dr’s / using polymorph effectively to run and then setup. Quit going off about random examples acting like you know jack, when really you know shit.

“Not everyone here is 2500 and the fact we can reduce the gap between player skills by limiting the OP compositions”. Yikes man so you’d prefer to care bear the community as suppose to enhancing their skill and growing their game knowledge.

Even though I’m a fanatic over rot classes in twinking, my first intent wasn’t to roll spriest it’s just what I had ‘undeleted’ that was level 55 still back from mop. Don’t assume what I did or didn’t think of, because when you assume you make an ass out of yourself.

“I feel like you’re the type of guy that wants the security of off-heals or even a healer when getting trained.” There’s not a single class that I can’t play in a twink bracket at a max level. But here you go assuming yet again ..

“Thats where real pvp experience comes into play” in a lower skilled environment 2s over 3s ? by setting restrictions because you’re empty headed on how the game actually works. Between these subjective rules, and now opinions you have formed not only put me off but I’m certain others as well. Keep it up, you’re only stooping your own tourney more and more.
Click to expand...

Oh god i’ll stop arguing with someone who thinks all he says is right. That’s why i love Jwl, love his sense of humour. The sad thing is that you are a real version that deeply is in love with your opinions and close minded. Good to know for future posts. If you are not happy, mightaswell leave or why not make your own tourny with the r1 initiative and dedication that you have.
We are experiencing stuff and sorry for having the balls of trying something different than bg’s and balancing it with my knowledge of the game/bracket. Aggressive unsuccesful r1 streamer. Gotcha! And yeah for the girlfriend attack, I only have one since they don’t cheat on me:)

PS: This is not biology, quit dissecting
 
Restoration + Rogue is allowed?

You do know how overpowered an Rdruid will be, correct?
2v2s are fast-paced as it is, Sap>Cyclone>Blind or any variation should guarantee a trinket and leave a window open for re-sap, root, etc.. It'd be broken. There is no reason to involve healers in 2v2s. If this is a successful event, we can later do 3v3s where healers are necessary.

@Yowza we are starting with 2v2s to test the waters. Of course we'd prefer 3v3s, but there is a certain level of interest that needs to be met, and this event is an opportunity to grasp those numbers.
I could also argue with every point you tried to make, but it'd just be easier to inform you that neither of us are hosting the event. I dont agree with all of the rules either, but crying about them wont result in change.
 
Man I work this whole weekend... I hope everyone has a blast with this and it's successful. Would be awesome if one or more people could stream their teams perspectives so I could watch at a later date :D
 
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Will definitely play. 32 sign ups might be reaching a bit as thats close to the peak of numbers we've had online, but even if we get 8 or 16 it'll be fun.
 
migli said:
resto doesn't react that well to burst/pressure
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restoration can pillar hump, LOS cooldowns, thorns, frenzied regeneration/barkskin, vortex...there are plenty of ways for restoration druids to react to pressure. May as well allow all healers to participate if you're going to allow one
 
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[doublepost=1554393014,1554392945][/doublepost]Signing my rogue up tomorrow, gotta find a partner.
 
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