lvl29 Twink in BG?

[Shadevoid]

The people drawn to 29s arent drawn to competitive games.

Assumption - probably true though, but still.
My only problem with your point that it is all about "feelings". I understand that you got a shitty card (bracket itself) and you wanna polish it since Blizzs refuse to; and create some artificial PvP environment that provides certain competitive experiece. (Put here any joke about competitive PvP in WoW multiplied by state of the twinks in the eyes of other players and devs)
Great idea, best wishes. Just do not tell to majority aka swimmers in random bg pools how and what they "should" to do and which part of their action does not supported by Astartes Codex.

 

[Goesid]

Assumption - probably true though, but still.
My only problem with your point that it is all about "feelings". I understand that you got a shitty card (bracket itself) and you wanna polish it since Blizzs refuse to; and create some artificial PvP environment that provides certain competitive experiece. (Put here any joke about competitive PvP in WoW multiplied by state of the twinks in the eyes of other players and devs)
Great idea, best wishes. Just do not tell to majority aka swimmers in random bg pools how and what they "should" to do and which part of their action does not supported by Astartes Codex.

Its the bracket we got. You came out defending a guy who said 29s should be invited to wargames, my point was simply that 29s would never play wargames were they were on equal foot to others. Those that can play or want to play reroll, leveled up or quit.

Just because the pool isnt great doesnt mean you have to pee into it to make it worse.

 

[Shadevoid]

Just because the pool isnt great doesnt mean you have to pee into it to make it worse.

That's the point man - it's a f*cking orange juice.

 

[Goesid]

That's the point man - it's a f*cking orange juice.

Sounds like someone is really trying to justify his exploiting.

 

[Neon]

70's levelling 29s to debuff into 20's bracket is "toxic crutching behavior", I think these people are just as scumbag and need as much of a crutch as regular 29s who debuff into 20's bracket. 29s have played in a few wargames and the funny thing is the team with the 29s on them didn't win lmfao, but yeah 29s should fuck off and coordinate their own bracket.

 

[Counsel]

a burrito is a sleeping bag for ground beef.

-mitch hedberg

 

[dirtypaws]

What is the TLDR on this thread? Capped 20’s who are used to beating on levellers get salty when they get stomped by a 29 with reduced xp?

 

[Chops]

What is the TLDR on this thread? Capped 20’s who are used to beating on levellers get salty when they get stomped by a 29 with reduced xp?

more like "exploiters get salty when you call them exploiters, try to defend scumbag exploiting behavior by saying its not exploiting"

really just wish folks would follow that fatgoblin guys lead and be like "yea, its exploiting. fuck you" because then at least theyre being honest about it.

 

[Blackberryy]

This thread has run its course

The nazi mods won’t lock the thread since they are the main derailers atm.

 

[Shadevoid]

Sounds like someone is really trying to justify his exploiting.

Like I mentioned early: 1) there is no need to justify exploiting at that case (added last part to prevent some radical examples with cheating and texture bugs), do it if you feel like it, what's a big deal;
2) well, i genuinelly believe "ghost run" exploit much more tricky at game-logic aspect than that nonsense which is at peak just a reason for some reports to see that Devs don't care even if they forgot to strip some buffs/debuffs at entering bgs.

Like really, let's say few players will full gearing 29 twink as a "consumables" for a pop-off bg serie - I would definitely love to see that.
Cmon, most of you played when 29 was a thing - i'm myself played as a 20 at that time so don't tell me stories about unspeakably spooky power gap that will cripple our healthy bracket.
Let some chaos in. Or at least acknowledge the idea.

 

[Goesid]

Like I mentioned early: 1) there is no need to justify exploiting at that case (added last part to prevent some radical examples with cheating and texture bugs), do it if you feel like it, what's a big deal;
2) well, i genuinelly believe "ghost run" exploit much more tricky at game-logic aspect than that nonsense which is at peak just a reason for some reports to see that Devs don't care even if they forgot to strip some buffs/debuffs at entering bgs.

Like really, let's say few players will full gearing 29 twink as a "consumables" for a pop-off bg serie - I would definitely love to see that.
Cmon, most of you played when 29 was a thing - i'm myself played as a 20 at that time so don't tell me stories about unspeakably spooky power gap that will cripple our healthy bracket.
Let some chaos in. Or at least acknowledge the idea.

If they are actually leveling then sure go nuts, but these people are only leveling if they do a misstake.

 

[Conzil]

Have people not read the End User License Agreement or something? It states pretty clearly if these kinds of things are okay or not.
It states under section C (License Limitations) that any use of exploits or use of in-game bugs that provide an advantage counts as cheating.

So the only two relevant questions to determine if this is against the End User Agreement are the following.
Did Blizzard intend for the xp buff to be used this way?
Are you gaining an advantage by using it this way?

If they did not intent for it to be used that way and you are gaining an advantage, it's pretty clearly against the End User Agreement.

I highlighted the important parts since some have problem reading.

 

[Legitheals]

How do we know whether they were left unchange intentionally or not? "clearly it's a mistake" is an opinion? We are not the debugger so nobody here can come to that conclusion.. Speculation maybe, but speculation works both ways.. This kind of debate will be never ending as it will be a "you say he says".. But the fact remains, it's left unchange.. So using them is legit UNTIL blizz decides to change them.. It's gf'd so it's not an exploit.. It's not an exploit because they were gotten at a time when it can be gotten legally.. no under lvl30 can get into the dungeons to get them now, IF a player who is lvl29 or lower can manage to get those gems NOW, then that is called an exploit.

Personally I think they left it intentionally (the 5/6 gems).. Of cos that is just my opinion, there are reasons why I think they left it that way

The problem I'm seeing is that everyone's definitions are subjective and there is overlap in what people see to be exploiting in the grey areas. Here someone is suggesting that Blizzard intentionally left BC gems to be stronger than WotLK gems with the same stats.

No, only if you have to abuse game mechanics to do so. For example northerend engi in BfA, scummy but not an exploit. Trade window glitch shoulder enchant, exploit but not scummy. Trade window glitched frag belt, scummy exploit.

This post just furthers the point that it's subjective. I see trade window glitches as the same.

The way I see it, anything that takes advantage of unintended game mechanics OR item scaling issues is to some degree exploiting. Even if you're not taking advantage of 'game mechanics' like the case with exp-off glitching and entering BC heroics on a level 20, it is still taking advantage of an unintended system. I haven't done these things personally (and don't like exp glitching or the debuff), and I'd be happy to have items that should be for level 43 as a level 20, but at least I'd acknowledge it as exploiting to some degree.

Be honest, everyone who twinks to some degree condones exploiting. Part of the point of twinking itself is taking advantage of whatever makes us the most powerful after all.

 

[Goesid]

Have people not read the End User License Agreement or something? It states pretty clearly if these kinds of things are okay or not.
It states under section C (License Limitations) that any use of exploits or use of in-game bugs that provide an advantage counts as cheating.

So the only two relevant questions to determine if this is against the End User Agreement are the following.
Did Blizzard intend for the xp buff to be used this way?
Are you gaining an advantage by using it this way?

If they did not intent for it to be used that way and you are gaining an advantage, it's pretty clearly against the End User Agreement.

I highlighted the important parts since some have problem reading.

I mean, no. No I havent.

 

[Legitheals]

I highlighted the important parts since some have problem reading.

So exploiting in-game items that have their scaling bugged is cheating.

 

[Neon]

Like I mentioned early: 1) there is no need to justify exploiting at that case (added last part to prevent some radical examples with cheating and texture bugs), do it if you feel like it, what's a big deal;
2) well, i genuinelly believe "ghost run" exploit much more tricky at game-logic aspect than that nonsense which is at peak just a reason for some reports to see that Devs don't care even if they forgot to strip some buffs/debuffs at entering bgs.

Like really, let's say few players will full gearing 29 twink as a "consumables" for a pop-off bg serie - I would definitely love to see that.
Cmon, most of you played when 29 was a thing - i'm myself played as a 20 at that time so don't tell me stories about unspeakably spooky power gap that will cripple our healthy bracket.
Let some chaos in. Or at least acknowledge the idea.

 

[Conzil]

So exploiting in-game items that have their scaling bugged is cheating.

What do you mean with in-game items that have their scaling bugged? Can you give an example?

 

[Chops]

The way I see it, anything that takes advantage of unintended game mechanics OR item scaling issues is to some degree exploiting.... Be honest, everyone who twinks to some degree condones exploiting. Part of the point of twinking itself is taking advantage of whatever makes us the most powerful after all.

I think you actually really nail the issue here

When I say "exploit" I mean actually manipulating a mechanic or bug to achieve some advantage because that mechanic or bug allows your character or some piece of equipment to behave in a way counter to the games intended design.

The problem comes down to me (and others) using the phrase "not intended" because then people pick up on that as say "yea well blizzard obviously doesnt intend for you to have gear so obviously out of your characters ilvl range, twinking is exploiting, checkmate hypocrite!" But gear that was looted legitimately and just happens to still be useable isnt a mechanic or gear exploit. It wasnt duped or hacked or whatever, it was just looted. Normally. Like you'd loot any other piece of gear.

So we get into this semantics battle over "intended" rather than the mechanics of the exploit.

If it was something you would innocently encounter through the normal course of playing a game, we'd see a lot more levelers in BGs like "wait, how come Im not gaining any XP? How come I have this debuff" How do I get rid of this?" and instead we have a bunch of twinks telling us that they only have this debuff through *nudgenudgewinkwink* "just playing the game" but of course what they mean is doing a very specific and repeatable set of actions that allow them to circumvent an annoying aspect of the games design.

Thats an exploit. Everyone knows that this is not how that debuff is suppose to work and that it wouldnt work that way unless you were engaging in a very specific set of actions intended to make it work in this one specific way. Just like everyone knew you werent supposed to be able to stack the Draught Of Ten Lands and then pretended to be shocked when they got banned for it. And everyone knew you weren't supposed to be duping gold with the easter egg. And people knew the trade window glitches were exploits. We all knew when we used the korraks event to summon our F2Ps into Molten Core. etc etc etc.

Its disingenuous to argue that because its possible and easy that its not also an exploit.

 

[Epichealtime]

Cmon, most of you played when 29 was a thing - i'm myself played as a 20 at that time so don't tell me stories about unspeakably spooky power gap that will cripple our healthy bracket.
Let some chaos in. Or at least acknowledge the idea.

We're talking about ooking them here. But it's worth mentioning that the level squish made the effective difference between 20 and 29 larger now than it's ever been

 

[Goesid]

What do you mean with in-game items that have their scaling bugged? Can you give an example?

he means ilvl 49 artis, bramble and love neck