Are shadowfang and gloom bis at 29?

Why is this?

While t may be nice to hit harder, the increased amount of attacks that crit would far outdamage the few attacks that did using versitility. Crit just seems more useful. Also effects elem force and deadly poison. Ive watched people die from it after they ran away.

Know what else is awesome? Throw. this niftly little ability is hilarious. It procs elemental force.....and t has a half a second cd. U can littirily just spam throw on someone and with the crit my build has it does a bunch of damage to those that are kiting you. Very useful if u get rooted.
 
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If you use nightstalker, you will be waiting for energy for too long imo.

If you ambush + eviscerate, sure, it's some pretty nice burst but you don't get the +35% damage to eviscerate, and it's only 2 combos which won't hit very hight at all. Alternatively you can just go ambush -> revealing and wait till you get some energy for another sinister and eviscerate, but by the time you'll have a 4-5 combo evisc ready, the enemy already has had plenty of time to react and maybe pop some defensives or cc you or something. Pretty high risk of getting rooted / bm snared / conc shotted etc since you spend so long time outside stealth before the finisher.

With shadow focus, you have instantly enough energy for an ambush, revealing, sinister, and by the time you've used those, energy is really close to be ready for eviscerate. I've used arc torrent somewhere here so it's enough for evisc nearly instantly, but if you got some haste on gear, that might do the job aswell. With that combo you have at least 4 combos points in a minimum amount of time, and with revealing strike proc it's 25% chance you have 5 combos ready for max damage eviscerate. It's imo more burst in a short amount of time, and you don't have to wait much for energy. Sap spam also works better cus low cost. Lower speed kinda sucks, but you will learn positioning yourself with even 110% speed, it's not that much lower than the 120% with nightstalker, anyways (unless you use minor speed instead of blurred).

TLDR; Take nightstalker if you enjoy 1-shotting ppl at half hp with ambush and want to go a little bit faster with stealth. Shadow focus has more damage pontetial, though, if you can sit the target a bit longer and get a 4-5 combo eviscerate out. Just my two cents though, I can see why some people like nightstalker more.
I with nightstalker as nelf rog with minor speed and cloak enchant i reach 140%+ movement speed and I really lile that :p but ill try out nightstalker and see how it suits me
ive geared up my rogue a lot since I started this thread, and ive tried all sorts of combinations to try to find what works best for me as far as gear goes, and I am convinced so far that a mixture of ap gear and crit gear with crit enchants instead of versitility is the way to go.

Im still in the process of switching out a few items for others, but heres my character so far: Chickenwings @ Anvilmar - Community - World of Warcraft

the changes I intend to try are: I want to get eng up and get that eng cloak, and then take the boots away and put in Boots of the Foolhardy - Game Guide - World of Warcraft. This switch will add crit and some more AP, as my main goal is to obtain 40 crit and 300 ap unbuffed. I also need another stendals ring. Next I might obtain some blackwolf bracers from sfk if i am still lacking some crit, as i think those might provide more crit when scaled in a bg, at the cost of some stam and some haste.

end result: 40 percent crit, 300 ap, and 3.4k or so HP. This result means that I have enough crit to actually crit often, and 300 ap is a decent enough amount to hit hard, and the 3.4k hp is a lot more than a pure ap rogue build i see people running with lately, meaning u live long enough to actually follow through with a fc gank instead of getting 2 shot by the 2 people guarding him, thus pulling off a kamakazi attack and returning the flag. Most bg's ive played with this setup I usually am the only one returning flags, and i almost always return them. I'm the highest rogue on the damage charts too with the best klll death ratio.

I was trying out duel landslide, and the procs are pretty awesome when they do proc....but considering that this build focuses on crit and ap mixed, elemental force works best for me because elemental force is affected by crit. Meaning those deadly poison dots are very strong compared to the weak ones you get when using landslide.

My gearset also happens to provide a slight amount of haste, which is also useful for faster dots and faster weapon swings/proc chances. I dont focus on haste, but my gear just so happens to have some so its a plus.

Versitality is great, both offensively and defencevily, but 10 percent extra damage dont mean anything if ur sitting at 19 percent crit. The damage that 40 percent crit offers far outperforms versitality bonuses.


I am loving my setup so far, and the best part is I dont have to run gnomer 1000 times for those agility rings and bracer, and tbh I think this setup is better. The only item I might end up having to go out of my way and buy like i did my sf's and gloom shroud is a ring of precision, and in the future, I might try out a blackvenom blade for offhand.
I really dont agree on the crit or gearing choices, but its your rogue so good luck :)
Power ring is gfed. Why should I replace it with an equivalent agi ring? Am I missing something?
Well I just like the clean look of 3x Agi gnomer items, but it provides the same, so keep it if you want :)
 
ive geared up my rogue a lot since I started this thread, and ive tried all sorts of combinations to try to find what works best for me as far as gear goes, and I am convinced so far that a mixture of ap gear and crit gear with crit enchants instead of versitility is the way to go.

Im still in the process of switching out a few items for others, but heres my character so far: Chickenwings @ Anvilmar - Community - World of Warcraft

the changes I intend to try are: I want to get eng up and get that eng cloak, and then take the boots away and put in Boots of the Foolhardy - Game Guide - World of Warcraft. This switch will add crit and some more AP, as my main goal is to obtain 40 crit and 300 ap unbuffed. I also need another stendals ring. Next I might obtain some blackwolf bracers from sfk if i am still lacking some crit, as i think those might provide more crit when scaled in a bg, at the cost of some stam and some haste.

end result: 40 percent crit, 300 ap, and 3.4k or so HP. This result means that I have enough crit to actually crit often, and 300 ap is a decent enough amount to hit hard, and the 3.4k hp is a lot more than a pure ap rogue build i see people running with lately, meaning u live long enough to actually follow through with a fc gank instead of getting 2 shot by the 2 people guarding him, thus pulling off a kamakazi attack and returning the flag. Most bg's ive played with this setup I usually am the only one returning flags, and i almost always return them. I'm the highest rogue on the damage charts too with the best klll death ratio.

I was trying out duel landslide, and the procs are pretty awesome when they do proc....but considering that this build focuses on crit and ap mixed, elemental force works best for me because elemental force is affected by crit. Meaning those deadly poison dots are very strong compared to the weak ones you get when using landslide.

My gearset also happens to provide a slight amount of haste, which is also useful for faster dots and faster weapon swings/proc chances. I dont focus on haste, but my gear just so happens to have some so its a plus.

Versitality is great, both offensively and defencevily, but 10 percent extra damage dont mean anything if ur sitting at 19 percent crit. The damage that 40 percent crit offers far outperforms versitality bonuses.


I am loving my setup so far, and the best part is I dont have to run gnomer 1000 times for those agility rings and bracer, and tbh I think this setup is better. The only item I might end up having to go out of my way and buy like i did my sf's and gloom shroud is a ring of precision, and in the future, I might try out a blackvenom blade for offhand.

1 agi > 4 crit
vers > crit enchants for ring/neck/cloak
 
While t may be nice to hit harder, the increased amount of attacks that crit would far outdamage the few attacks that did using versitility. Crit just seems more useful. Also effects elem force and deadly poison. Ive watched people die from it after they ran away.

Know what else is awesome? Throw. this niftly little ability is hilarious. It procs elemental force.....and t has a half a second cd. U can littirily just spam throw on someone and with the crit my build has it does a bunch of damage to those that are kiting you. Very useful if u get rooted.

I see your point. Did you actually try it with a maxed ap + versa set with dual landslide though? It's pretty crazy damage is all I can say. EF is very nice for throw and poisons yeah, but instead of spamming throw or poison, you try and get a restealth with landslide and open with a 2k ambush + 2k eviscerate or a straight out 3k evisc instead :p

I'm just curious what kinda crits have you been getting with your build? Mainly ambush/evis/sinister/melee?

Power ring is gfed. Why should I replace it with an equivalent agi ring? Am I missing something?

Agi ring gives same amount of ap, but more dodge and like clari said, if someone has pala / monk / pet buff up, depending on the rest of your gear you might get a couple more ap from that if you have agility instead of ap, since the afforementioned buffs only increase agility by 5%, not attack power.

I with nightstalker as nelf rog with minor speed and cloak enchant i reach 140%+ movement speed and I really lile that :p but ill try out nightstalker and see how it suits me

Imo 110% is usually enough, it's just a matter of positioning yourself well. 140% definitely sounds nice though gotta say, would be fun to try out.
 
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There has been a lot of misinformation in this thread, and a quite a lot of stupitidy *cough*crit*cough*, but I want to add something which is not disputable and will clear up a lot of things.

Agi vs AP

Lets say you have Cloaked Shoulder gaurds of Agi, this will give you +13 agi and therefore +13 AP, Cloaked Shoulder Gaurds of Power, this will give you +13 Ap and therefore +13 AP. The AP you get from them is the same HOWEVER, with agi you gain dodge rating where pure AP you dont. This is because dodge and other secondary stats scale off of your Agility and not your Attack Power. Just wanted to clear this up, and this is the reason the Glove Enchant Major Agility is Better than Crusher or Greater Power, also why Emissary Cuffs of Agi is better than Emisarry cuffs of power, is the AP the same? Yea, but its not bis because the Agi one gives you secondary stats. Also the stat bonus thing with % agi. This was mentioned before jut wanted to put a seperate post which made it clearer for the people who cant do their own research or read well.

P.S. If you argue this you seriously have a mental problem and should consult your doctor immediatly.
 
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[MENTION=20770]Felfiend[/MENTION]

I agree with you on AGI vs AP... That said, would you change out the AP enchants on this rogue? What else would you change. I have access to tons of gear that I don't have equipped too.

UupdSR9.jpg
 
[MENTION=20770]Felfiend[/MENTION]

I agree with you on AGI vs AP... That said, would you change out the AP enchants on this rogue? What else would you change. I have access to tons of gear that I don't have equipped too.

UupdSR9.jpg

minor speed 2 boots. Don't worry about swapping to agil for dodge. Dodge is irrelevant. We had upwards of 40-50% dodge in mop If I remember correctly and now we're sitting at like 18%
 
minor speed 2 boots. Don't worry about swapping to agil for dodge. Dodge is irrelevant. We had upwards of 40-50% dodge in mop If I remember correctly and now we're sitting at like 18%

Are you saying Minor Speed to boots for the stacking?

If so, that is irrelevant because I don't use the "Gift" cloak enchant since I have a GF'd cloak with 12agi. I do have another pair of boots with minor speed just in case I do use the BOA Cloak with "Gift of Versatility".
 
minor speed 2 boots. Don't worry about swapping to agil for dodge. Dodge is irrelevant. We had upwards of 40-50% dodge in mop If I remember correctly and now we're sitting at like 18%

I mean, im saying instead of AP just get agi, same dmg more bonus, obo for bracers or someshit, take the 6 ap enchant over the 4 agi enchant, im not saying agi>ap indefinetly, im jsut saying that when you have the option ot get the same ap or agi, go for agi.

That being said, [MENTION=3]Drayner[/MENTION] your rogue is looking good, just grab a second charged gear of agi and grab a major agi enchant for gloves also use boa helm, agi+haste better then crit because of loss of agi from boa helm, or scratchy for pure agi
 
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That being said, your rogue is looking good, just grab a second charged gear and grab a majro agi enchant for gloves

Thanks. Ya... that 2nd AGI charged gear has eluded me. I got 2 AGI bracers and 1 AGI ring in my 1st 10 runs and now... 30 runs of nothing since.
 
Are you saying Minor Speed to boots for the stacking?

If so, that is irrelevant because I don't use the "Gift" cloak enchant since I have a GF'd cloak with 12agi. I do have another pair of boots with minor speed just in case I do use the BOA Cloak with "Gift of Versatility".

oh ok. I see. Didn't realize. I've seen nudes of ur rogue btw.
 
oh ok. I see. Didn't realize. I've seen nudes of ur rogue btw.

I think my rogue is sexier with her armor on. That fantasy look. :)

Thanks again [MENTION=20770]Felfiend[/MENTION]. I have been using the BOA helm mostly but was trying out the eyepatch last night. Is that other helm (Scratchy?) a quest item and still available? I've never heard of it.
 
I think my rogue is sexier with her armor on. That fantasy look. :)

Thanks again [MENTION=20770]Felfiend[/MENTION]. I have been using the BOA helm mostly but was trying out the eyepatch last night. Is that other helm (Scratchy?) a quest item and still available? I've never heard of it.

Im not 29 so im not sure, but its a pure agi helm which all glass cannon rogues uses, prob bis, idk though. Not-Scratchy Helm - Item - World of Warcraft

Also i prefer Foremans as -1 agi for +9 haste is better imo, i think there are some hands from SH and an ally quest hands which are better, not sure though, again im 20
 
Felfiend

I agree with you on AGI vs AP... That said, would you change out the AP enchants on this rogue? What else would you change. I have access to tons of gear that I don't have equipped too.

UupdSR9.jpg

I know you asked Felfiend but I thought I'd reply xD

Get 2nd agi ring
Get Ashen's Gloves (9 agi 6 stam 6 crit)
Get the scratchy helm (13 agi)
Get 6 agi glove enchant
Get AGM
 

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