EU+US what do you think of the Frag Belt?
- Thread starter Raosco
- Start date
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- Tags
- 19 bracket bis fotm
Allybeboba
Legend
ascoot
Legend
So I assume when you run into a leveler that wants to enjoy bgs, has half of your hp, and no enchants, you run away, switch to a few pieces of dungeon gear and a green weapon, then come back to have your interactive gameplay? Otherwise I guess your moaning makes you a giant hypocrite, but of course there wouldn't be any of those on xpoff.
Laurenti
Legend
I'm talking about twink vs twink gameplay. No one takes off their gear when they fight levelers, because the gear they have equipped is intended to be obtained. On the contrary, frag belt tinkers are NOT intended to be obtained, therefore I have an issue with it. People who abuse bombs of course will support keeping them in the game; they enjoy any unintended faceroll advantage they can get. They are the same people who bitched about ENG goggles being nerfed. They are the same people that liked twinks back in the day against levelers because they could 1 shot people. These are the same people who came back to twinks as soon as gear was re-implemented, but did not participate in pugs or wargames during stat templates. These are the same people that open in mid on a rogue to kill a 500 hp naked fury warrior when there are twinks on the enemy team and much more effective shit to be done. These are the pug heroes that rarely participate in wargames. These are the same people who buy saltwater potions. These are the same people who chug speed pots. These are the same people who would defend a 10k damage on use because it was hard for them to farm and everyone else is just lazy for not pushing their twink to the max. I could care less if you call me a hypocrite because I have a twink at all. At least I'm not spamming a frag belt on CD or using ridiculous consumables. Equating having a twink to using shit you shouldn't have on a twink is silly.
Also get your tu quoque out of here and actually address any real part of my original post xd
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Cleatuss
Royal Member
scrub.
[doublepost=1532461378,1532461236][/doublepost]i think you all should stfu and wish for legion style everyone is the same templates. fucks sake
Iild
big pwner never small pwn
Quack
Guest
Cleatuss
Royal Member
no and i don’t care. you should go make another best of plebs list. scrub
[doublepost=1532462839,1532462542][/doublepost]logging in. looking to frag bomb lildick
Tonkks
Tônks
You do know twinks have used consumables.. both in pugs and premades... for more than 10 years correct? Getting a ton of OP stuff is the reason twinking exists. No, your inferno robe, jutebraid, sacred trousers, lucky fishing hat, arena grandmaster, nethercleft leg armor, and Rumsey rum were NEVER intended for a 19 to have. That is the point of twinking. Twinking has never been balanced. Twinking will never be balanced. Sometimes, blizzard allows things into the game that become SO OP that they need to be banned in premades. A 10,000 damage one shot item is a good example. Old aimed shot is a good example. Outside high level kings/arcane int/fort are good examples... maybe even frag bombs are a good example, if they were usable in war games that is... but speed pots/potions/elixirs/bandages are horrible examples. And if you think anyone should not use some OP trinkets or buffs or what not- do NOT combine the two- because it really devalues your argument.
I wonder if people that are always complaining about consumables count their wins and losses, and consider games where someone uses a healing potion as void, and if the other team did not “crutch” on them they really would have won. Laughable. Nothing is stopping you from using saltwater potions. Nothing is stopping you from queueing, prepared, with consumables that will help your team win. It is 100% up to you if you want to queue, not prepared to play your opponent, knowing there is a good chance they will have these items. Don’t complain about being unprepared. Don’t complain about losing because you were not prepared.
Laurenti
Legend
Yes some consumables were allowed in premades. However, you can bet that saltwater potion would not be allowed in premades if we were still syncing groups 1-4 into the same pop. Rumsey was healthy for gameplay because it was a slight buffer to burst. If it wouldn't be allowed in a premade because its busted, then I'm going to look down on you for using it in a pug. Twink gear has usually been exempted from this, with the exception of outrageous things such as some enchants.
Put it this way. You open on me in a pug. I trinket cheap. Your kick is too slow and you don't get me before envelop goes off. I live and you die. However, you frag bomb and now I die because half my hp and an interrupt off the end of your lockout. This literally happened 3 days ago. What would have been a relatively close game ended pretty one sided because I literally can't survive a bomb opener unless you do something really stupid.
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Quack
Guest
and now they don't
Tom Ganks
Guest
I'm stingy about it but not salty enough to go out and report it.
Tonkks
Tônks
Because you cannot in wargames. It used to be all consumables that we’re allowed were spoken about before the game, and the list was long. Some of the things that twinks considered meta back in the day, like potions, are considered a “crutch” by some today. It makes no sense to me.
I don’t want to give a one sided opinion publicly on bombs/belt tinkers- but I will say they have added some excitement for me. A ranged CC for a healer, added burst.. the ability to use rocket boots as an alternative can change games- and it has been doing just that. I understand your frustration with them. You feel like you trinket cheap, juke kick, and just “outplayed” me, and I am “crutching” on the bomb to stop you from healing. I see this as very similar to a Druid using dash to get away when several defenders who have “outplayed” his positioning- but everyone is okay with a Druid dashing- because it is in the game.
Movement is the single most important aspect of 19s bgs. It’s why minor speed to boots has been a necessity since 2007. It is also why the single best class to help your team win for the last expansion has been a Druid. Not because they do OP damage, OP healing, or have OP health.. but their movement. 30% passive speed is OP. Shapeshifting CCs is OP. Dash is OP. Some consumables can be OP as well, in a similar way.
What I DONT like about frag bombs is that they are now GFd. Many items in the bracket have gone through the GF process, and they have been accepted- what makes this different?
My main idea towards consumables/items in general has been this... if you can prevent your opponent from using them, that discussion is a good one to have. Let’s ban speed pots. Let’s ban tinkers. Sure. In a premade setting, perfect.
But if you queue wsg, you cannot prevent your opponent from using anything really- which means you should use these things yourself. Not doing so is putting yourself at a disadvantage, and I do not see any “honor” in knowingly disadvantaging yourself. I would rather win after popping a consumable than losing. If you do not want to do the same- that is your choice- but it is silly to me trying to control what your opponent can and cannot use.
Shaket
Legend
literally the same motherfuckers lmao
"wtf you dont have frag belt u scrub, but dont u dare use a pot appropriate to your level cuz then u r compensating for poor positioning and bad gameplay and ur bad 4 using consums"
Laurenti
Legend
Last time I checked, an inferno robe, a lucky fishing hat, or an arena grand master has never instantly dealt half of someones healthpool, along with ccing said person, as well as a one shot to any random leveler caught in the blast radius.
[doublepost=1532474053,1532473852][/doublepost]
I feel like most people who are against the use of frag belts are ALSO against the use of consumables in pugs. Not sure of a specific individual who hates speed pots and goblin gliders, but loves their good ol' frag belt.
Tonkks
Tônks
But items like LFH/AGM/Nethercleft have made a level 19 virtually unkillable by levelers, more than doubling the twinks effective hp. Simple enchants, and the combination of enchants, double base agility. Satyr and ele force do incredible damage on their own, without needing to do anything. I can 1v3 levelers doing nothing but running and pistol shotting.
You are correct, the frag belt can one shot, stun, do a lot of damage, and is a game breaking item... but what this and other things have in common is that 19s were not intended to get any of these items. I agree with you in regards to how they should be unusable in bgs- I really do. I wish they were not available... but because they are, they should be used. Just my opinion I guess.