EU+US Stam set for Druid

[Iild]

If you have em. Those were available when you could use leg armor through the trade window too, so possible to have the old nethercleft leg armor on there.

this was never a thing idk where this false information started

 

[Michëlle]

What's your thought on Smoldering Gloves, (Cloth, however 7 Stam, 7 Versa and BoE)

 

[necroaqua]

What's your thought on Smoldering Gloves, (Cloth, however 7 Stam, 7 Versa and BoE)

Good if you can find them. IIRC they are GFd and don't drop anymore...but might be dropping again? But no confirmed sources...

 

[Yapah]

I choose crit over haste after some testing, because haste is not scaling well for low levels in this expansion. Also, as an FC druid in pugs (at least that's what my set is built for), you usually use Rejuv + Swiftmend way more than Regrowth. Haste does not change Swiftmend's amount, only changes Rejuv by a tiny bit, and you need to really stack haste A LOT, to get cast time reduction for Regrowth, that will make any sense. On the other hand, no matter how much crit you can add, it will always increase the crit chance by a tiny bit, resulting in a few more crits per BG.

Crit is 150% in bgs, also crit has the potential to overheal
Haste reduces your GCD which means faster shapeshifts, faster casts, faster instant abilities. You don’t need to stack stupid amounts of haste, even 10% would make your GCD go from 1.5 to 1.35. Not to forget haste isn’t cut in half in PvP.
[doublepost=1533573869,1533573254][/doublepost]

Lets say, 15 haste = 0.1 sec less in GCD, and 15 crit = 4 % (just guessing). If your Swiftmend hits for 750, then 4 % increased crit chance would mean you would crit once every 25 Swiftmends for 375 additional dmg. 375 / 25 = 15 heal more per Swiftmend (on avg). If you have 2 Swiftmends in your "get out of trouble" rotation, this would result in 30 hp. Also, having in mind a normal connection latency, 0.1 sec per GCD is reduced to even less significance.

Your pulling numbers out of your ass to validate your point.
at 29 (what 20s scale to in bgs)
1 haste = 0.221
1 crit = 0.234
1 vers = 0.187/0.093

Crit is valued at half so 0.117
For FCing Vers >Haste > Crit, one could even say 1 haste = 2 crit

 

[Michëlle]

Good if you can find them. IIRC they are GFd and don't drop anymore...but might be dropping again? But no confirmed sources...

I do have them enchanted w +7 Stam on my character, not bound though.

 

[necroaqua]

I do have them enchanted w +7 Stam on my character, not bound though.

Up to you then. It could be sold for a ton I'm guessing.

Cloth loses you some armor, but otherwise the next best gloves are scouting gloves with 4 verse. So you trade 2 verse for a bit more armor (and int and either crit/haste). There might be a few other BoE gloves that are good (I think there are 9stam gloves) - but its really up to you.

 

[Veechard]

Every druid I seem is bookie, and just regrowth when they need to heal. Is guardian druid stam and vers stacking a thing?

 

[necroaqua]

Every druid I seem is bookie, and just regrowth when they need to heal. Is guardian druid stam and vers stacking a thing?

Guardian isn't. I pretty sure tanks still take 30% extra damage in BGs.

Resto druids are the best FC at 19. Its more important for premades/wargames though. You need the high health/verse to stay alive with stacks and give your healers a chance to actually heal. Things like using cenarion ward to pre-HoT as well as having rejuv/swiftmend for fast self-heals on the run make it better.

A good boomie with a stam/verse set is going to carry almost as well as a resto druid, especially in pugs (and not take a healer slot in queue). You have most of the same tools, but not quite as good self-heal.
[doublepost=1533612651,1533576620][/doublepost]

I do have them enchanted w +7 Stam on my character, not bound though.

I just found a pair in my bank....hmmmm. Time for an upgrade.

Side note, I also found a http://www.wowhead.com/item=12996/band-of-purification - which may be another good ring option. Not better than Deep Fathom Ring tho.

 

[fahr]

On another note, anyone know how much 20 versa is in %?

 

[Michëlle]

I'm using Lorepkeeper's Ring, 4int, 6stam, 6versa and Deep Fathom Ring.
Here's a link to my character. https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/character/aszune/Björnbröder
[doublepost=1533653698,1533653668][/doublepost]Side note, I also found a http://www.wowhead.com/item=12996/band-of-purification - which may be another good ring option. Not better than Deep Fathom Ring tho.[/QUOTE]

That's what I'm refering to

 

[DoByG]

Your pulling numbers out of your ass to validate your point.
at 29 (what 20s scale to in bgs)
1 haste = 0.221
1 crit = 0.234
1 vers = 0.187/0.093

Crit is valued at half so 0.117
For FCing Vers >Haste > Crit, one could even say 1 haste = 2 crit

I can see you failed to understand my intention with the last comment so I will put a more detailed version for you here:
1. Of course, I pulled the numbers out of the magic hat (I literally said "those are just example numbers"). That was to explain the way anyone can calculate what benefit you will get from each of those stats after I got 3 PMs on that subject. Using variables would be way better (so I won't have to put up made up stats) but you would be surprised how many people do not understand what the fuck they should do with X and Y.

2. If you prioritise Vers over Crit/Haste (as you should be, I hope we do not disagree here) your bis lvl 20 set would have a total of 10 crit or haste (I am excluding the Adaptable pieces here, they will reduce the crit/haste even more but you need RNGesuss on your side to get your hands on one). Those 10 come from all the BG rewards slots: 3 from legs (7 vers 3 other), 3 from feet (5 vers 3 other), 1 from ring (4 vers 1 other), 1 from bracers ( 4 vers 1 other), 1 from 1h (4 vers 1 other) and 1 from off-hand (4 vers 1 other). So that 10 haste would be a total of 2,2 % haste scaled to 20-29 lvl, which will reduce your global CD by 0,033 sec. That's 1/30th of a second. Its faster than a frame on a regular movie you can see in the cinema. I guess it is better than nothing, but TBH I am not sure that tiny bit of a difference is important for me. I would say it depends on the internet speed, reflex speed etc and anyone can decide for themselves.

3. 10 crit, on the other hand, is 1.17 % crit chance. On a regular FC get-out-of-trouble rotation, you can heal :
- 2 Swiftmend * 732,
- 2 Regrowth * 366,
- 1 Regrowth HoT * 91
- 1 Rejuvenation * 262
for a total of 2549 additional health. (the numbers are pulled out of my vet's ass, I would assume most of the FCs would be close to those).
1.17 % of that would be 29.83 health. So for each rotation, you complete, you will gain on avg about 30 effective health and this would increase if you manage to self-heal a larger amount. Of course, this does not take into consideration the overheal (even tho its hard to self-overheal while attacked as an FC), and also RNG % that comes with criticals.

So in conclusion, because of the small amount of crit or haste you can stack, I would say neither will be of great benefit, but in my case, while haste has neglectable benefit, one crit more here and there can save lifes. That being said, anyone can read the wall of text I wrote here and decide what would be bis for their play style.

 

[Chainz]

Crit is 150% in bgs, also crit has the potential to overheal
Haste reduces your GCD which means faster shapeshifts, faster casts, faster instant abilities. You don’t need to stack stupid amounts of haste, even 10% would make your GCD go from 1.5 to 1.35. Not to forget haste isn’t cut in half in PvP.
[doublepost=1533573869,1533573254][/doublepost]

Your pulling numbers out of your ass to validate your point.
at 29 (what 20s scale to in bgs)
1 haste = 0.221
1 crit = 0.234
1 vers = 0.187/0.093

Crit is valued at half so 0.117
For FCing Vers >Haste > Crit, one could even say 1 haste = 2 crit

Using haste makes a minuscule difference. I like to have the 1.4 cast which is around 3,9/4% haste in my pug set, but more than that is a waste.

 

[necroaqua]

I can see you failed to understand my intention with the last comment so I will put a more detailed version for you here:
1. Of course, I pulled the numbers out of the magic hat (I literally said "those are just example numbers"). That was to explain the way anyone can calculate what benefit you will get from each of those stats after I got 3 PMs on that subject. Using variables would be way better (so I won't have to put up made up stats) but you would be surprised how many people do not understand what the fuck they should do with X and Y.

2. If you prioritise Vers over Crit/Haste (as you should be, I hope we do not disagree here) your bis lvl 20 set would have a total of 10 crit or haste (I am excluding the Adaptable pieces here, they will reduce the crit/haste even more but you need RNGesuss on your side to get your hands on one). Those 10 come from all the BG rewards slots: 3 from legs (7 vers 3 other), 3 from feet (5 vers 3 other), 1 from ring (4 vers 1 other), 1 from bracers ( 4 vers 1 other), 1 from 1h (4 vers 1 other) and 1 from off-hand (4 vers 1 other). So that 10 haste would be a total of 2,2 % haste scaled to 20-29 lvl, which will reduce your global CD by 0,033 sec. That's 1/30th of a second. Its faster than a frame on a regular movie you can see in the cinema. I guess it is better than nothing, but TBH I am not sure that tiny bit of a difference is important for me. I would say it depends on the internet speed, reflex speed etc and anyone can decide for themselves.

3. 10 crit, on the other hand, is 1.17 % crit chance. On a regular FC get-out-of-trouble rotation, you can heal :
- 2 Swiftmend * 732,
- 2 Regrowth * 366,
- 1 Regrowth HoT * 91
- 1 Rejuvenation * 262
for a total of 2549 additional health. (the numbers are pulled out of my vet's ass, I would assume most of the FCs would be close to those).
1.17 % of that would be 29.83 health. So for each rotation, you complete, you will gain on avg about 30 effective health and this would increase if you manage to self-heal a larger amount. Of course, this does not take into consideration the overheal (even tho its hard to self-overheal while attacked as an FC), and also RNG % that comes with criticals.

So in conclusion, because of the small amount of crit or haste you can stack, I would say neither will be of great benefit, but in my case, while haste has neglectable benefit, one crit more here and there can save lifes. That being said, anyone can read the wall of text I wrote here and decide what would be bis for their play style.

You're definitely right that crit/haste basically doesn't matter. A few thought:

• Most 19 FCs take Cenarion Ward instead of double swiftmend. I believe the argument is that they generally heal for the same, but with the 30 second buff, you can pre-HoT before you start crossing mid, and it activates as soon as you get hit, but also means you don't need to leave travel/bear form to cast swiftmend. Its definitely better for team-play. I can buy the solo argument though for swiftmend. Just something to note, as most of your calculations assume double swiftmend.
• That 1.17% crit is at 150%, so you're looking at 15 effective health instead of 30. So it matters even less.
• Since it matters so little in terms of effective health, any miniscule savings in cast time or GCD is likely better as you getting out of that situation is going to be slightly better, though basically immeasurable. The haste also probably is worth at ~15 effective health on your HoTs, though I haven't done the calcs.
• And since this thread is mostly 19s, we don't scale up to 29, so both haste/crit are slightly stronger. They still compare the same, but the choice matters a bit more at 19.

 

[fahr]

Watch me whip watch me nay nay

 

[Yapah]

I can see you failed to understand my intention with the last comment so I will put a more detailed version for you here:
1. Of course, I pulled the numbers out of the magic hat (I literally said "those are just example numbers"). That was to explain the way anyone can calculate what benefit you will get from each of those stats after I got 3 PMs on that subject. Using variables would be way better (so I won't have to put up made up stats) but you would be surprised how many people do not understand what the fuck they should do with X and Y.

2. If you prioritise Vers over Crit/Haste (as you should be, I hope we do not disagree here) your bis lvl 20 set would have a total of 10 crit or haste (I am excluding the Adaptable pieces here, they will reduce the crit/haste even more but you need RNGesuss on your side to get your hands on one). Those 10 come from all the BG rewards slots: 3 from legs (7 vers 3 other), 3 from feet (5 vers 3 other), 1 from ring (4 vers 1 other), 1 from bracers ( 4 vers 1 other), 1 from 1h (4 vers 1 other) and 1 from off-hand (4 vers 1 other). So that 10 haste would be a total of 2,2 % haste scaled to 20-29 lvl, which will reduce your global CD by 0,033 sec. That's 1/30th of a second. Its faster than a frame on a regular movie you can see in the cinema. I guess it is better than nothing, but TBH I am not sure that tiny bit of a difference is important for me. I would say it depends on the internet speed, reflex speed etc and anyone can decide for themselves.

3. 10 crit, on the other hand, is 1.17 % crit chance. On a regular FC get-out-of-trouble rotation, you can heal :
- 2 Swiftmend * 732,
- 2 Regrowth * 366,
- 1 Regrowth HoT * 91
- 1 Rejuvenation * 262
for a total of 2549 additional health. (the numbers are pulled out of my vet's ass, I would assume most of the FCs would be close to those).
1.17 % of that would be 29.83 health. So for each rotation, you complete, you will gain on avg about 30 effective health and this would increase if you manage to self-heal a larger amount. Of course, this does not take into consideration the overheal (even tho its hard to self-overheal while attacked as an FC), and also RNG % that comes with criticals.

So in conclusion, because of the small amount of crit or haste you can stack, I would say neither will be of great benefit, but in my case, while haste has neglectable benefit, one crit more here and there can save lifes. That being said, anyone can read the wall of text I wrote here and decide what would be bis for their play style.

I'm assuming you meant 10 crit is 2.34% crit chance (1.17% dmg increase)
I would still take 2.2% faster spells/GCD (effectively 2.2% increased healing) over 1.17% direct healing increase

 

[Bestworld]

I'm assuming you meant 10 crit is 2.34% crit chance (1.17% dmg increase)
I would still take 2.2% faster spells/GCD (effectively 2.2% increased healing) over 1.17% direct healing increase

You won't cast much though. I see reasons for both stats. You'll usually depend more on your ability to kite and your use of instants. Swiftmend crit is a legit lay on hands, 1500+ heal. It's quite retarded. Haste is good in the phases where you are mid healing, but tbf, you rarely cast at all outside of that. The 1 heal you cast for baiting kick or w/e shouldn't be worth the potential loss of crit heals of your instants. That's just my opinion though.

 

[Yapah]

You won't cast much though. I see reasons for both stats. You'll usually depend more on your ability to kite and your use of instants. Swiftmend crit is a legit lay on hands, 1500+ heal. It's quite retarded. Haste is good in the phases where you are mid healing, but tbf, you rarely cast at all outside of that. The 1 heal you cast for baiting kick or w/e shouldn't be worth the potential loss of crit heals of your instants. That's just my opinion though.

haste reduces GCD which includes your hots and shapeshifts

 

[DoByG]

You're definitely right that crit/haste basically doesn't matter. A few thought:
Most 19 FCs take Cenarion Ward instead of double swiftmend. I believe the argument is that they generally heal for the same, but with the 30 second buff, you can pre-HoT before you start crossing mid, and it activates as soon as you get hit, but also means you don't need to leave travel/bear form to cast swiftmend. Its definitely better for team-play. I can buy the solo argument though for swiftmend. Just something to note, as most of your calculations assume double swiftmend.

Yea makes sense, but I feel CW is not optimal for solo. Not sure how haste or crit will affect it tbh so nothing more to say on this one.

That 1.17% crit is at 150%, so you're looking at 15 effective health instead of 30. So it matters even less.

It's actually 2.34 %, but because we are only getting 150 % I have just used half of the crit % in the calculations, so 1.17%

Since it matters so little in terms of effective health, any minuscule savings in cast time or GCD is likely better as you getting out of that situation is going to be slightly better, though basically immeasurable. The haste also probably is worth at ~15 effective health on your HoTs, though I haven't done the calcs.

10 haste increases Rejuv by 5 (total) and Regrowth by 2 (total), so ~ 7 effective health.

And since this thread is mostly 19s, we don't scale up to 29, so both haste/crit are slightly stronger. They still compare the same, but the choice matters a bit more at 19.

I totally forgot we are talking 19s here, though it is in general. Haven't tested how haste works in 10-19, but if you get closer to the 0.1 sec mark, I would guess it may be more appealing.

 

[necroaqua]

Yea makes sense, but I feel CW is not optimal for solo. Not sure how haste or crit will affect it tbh so nothing more to say on this one.



It's actually 2.34 %, but because we are only getting 150 % I have just used half of the crit % in the calculations, so 1.17%



10 haste increases Rejuv by 5 (total) and Regrowth by 2 (total), so ~ 7 effective health.



I totally forgot we are talking 19s here, though it is in general. Haven't tested how haste works in 10-19, but if you get closer to the 0.1 sec mark, I would guess it may be more appealing.

Heard.

In general everyone is saying "meh, it doesn't matter". Just with slightly different viewpoints on how much it doesnt matter lol. Perhaps go with crit if you take double swiftmend, and haste for cenarion ward.

 

[DoByG]

haste reduces GCD which includes your hots and shapeshifts

Again, your BiS set will reduce your GCD by less than 1/30th of a sec, not sure if we all comprehend how miniature this is. Try starting a timer and stopping immediately after. You will hardly ever get less than 1/10th of a sec, and that's 3 times more than the amount we are talking about. Not trying to sell you on crit, just debunking the reduced GCD myth.