EU+US Mistweaver Enchants Help.

[PepeLePewPew]

I'm all for theory crafting, but sometimes it can obfuscate the reason primary stats are noted as primary.
Haste on a MW just doesn't help as much as any available primary stat, especially at level 20 (and especially for MWs). I wrote on another thread of a preference for pandaren over trolls because that epicurean buff is brilliant compared to berserking. Haste vs critical sure, but not vs a primary stat. Don't get me started on players swapping out agility for a secondary on rogues.

 

[Snack]

I'm all for theory crafting, but sometimes it can obfuscate the reason primary stats are noted as primary.
Haste on a MW just doesn't help as much as any available primary stat, especially at level 20 (and especially for MWs). I wrote on another thread of a preference for pandaren over trolls because that epicurean buff is brilliant compared to berserking. Haste vs critical sure, but not vs a primary stat. Don't get me started on players swapping out agility for a secondary on rogues.

Though I agree with you, there are examples where secondary stats like haste will give you a higher healing output than a primary stat: 1 haste will improve your healing pr second more than 1 stamina or 1 spirit. That's why I recommended Dcm to get a good balance between spirit and haste, because though spirit doesn't increase your HpS it does increase the time on which you'll have sufficient mana to cast spells. Of course intellect and spell power is preferred, but it rarely comes down to a choice between haste/spirit or intellect.

 

[Allybeboba]

Position yourself better, if both rogues are stealthed and you either know they're around, or if you have no idea where they are, keep Enveloping Mist up on yourself, and be ready to roll away.

Can't roll or heal when stunned. Rogues aren't the only stealthers. And we all know there is plenty of other CC available that healers have to contend with.
A 6,000 HP healer will out live 4500 HP healer any day of the week. And as I stated before, you can't heal when you are dead. That .05-.08 extra cast time is not going to make that much of a difference. But that extra 1500 health will. Add in versatility on top of that, and you have yourself a winning combination for success. The only spirit enchant I bother with is heartsong.
If I ever get low I quaff a mana pot, run to a healing hut, or reserve myself to casting soothing mists for a bit while standing back. Heirlooms have plenty of spirit on them. Spirit enchants aren't needed for healers at this level.

 

[Snack]

Can't roll or heal when stunned. Rogues aren't the only stealthers. And we all know there is plenty of other CC available that healers have to contend with.
A 6,000 HP healer will out live 4500 HP healer any day of the week. And as I stated before, you can't heal when you are dead. That .05-.08 extra cast time is not going to make that much of a difference. But that extra 1500 health will. Add in versatility on top of that, and you have yourself a winning combination for success. The only spirit enchant I bother with is heartsong.
If I ever get low I quaff a mana pot, run to a healing hut, or reserve myself to casting soothing mists for a bit while standing back. Heirlooms have plenty of spirit on them. Spirit enchants aren't needed for healers at this level.

I really disagree. First of all only ferals have stun out of stealth, and if a feral opens on you, and you don't have your trinket ready, you'll be dead no matter the 1500 extra HP.

I generally just don't agree with stacking stamina on a healer, you should be able to avoid getting killed by knowing the flow of the game, when to fall back, when to hot yourself, and when to predict rogue openers. Again if you're having trouble with them, I'd recommend downloading BattlegroundTargets to keep track of stealthies and then be extra aware when they're stealthed. I am sure a veteran tink like yourself, will get a hang of it in no time. Good lucK!

 

[Trollguden]

I really disagree. First of all only ferals have stun out of stealth, and if a feral opens on you, and you don't have your trinket ready, you'll be dead no matter the 1500 extra HP.

I generally just don't agree with stacking stamina on a healer, you should be able to avoid getting killed by knowing the flow of the game, when to fall back, when to hot yourself, and when to predict rogue openers. Again if you're having trouble with them, I'd recommend downloading BattlegroundTargets to keep track of stealthies and then be extra aware when they're stealthed. I am sure a veteran tink like yourself, will get a hang of it in no time. Good lucK!

This, there is nothing else to it. I roll full int/spirit gear on my 29 and only have 3,6 but I've never been this effective before and I've tried alot of different stuff, trust me. The amount of heals you loose because you are afraid of rogues and ferals will cost you in the end. Just make sure u can survive everything except feral burst and always be ready with burst heal to counter (always have 3 chi up, ready to insta pop Enveloping mist and lust).

 

[AlbinoCow]

@Snack @Trollguden , In my response i literally say u should wep swap and to do it when pushing or falling back... ie : "Of course u can do something like keep sp to wep at opening of mid, then swap to heartsong once either ur team gains some breathing room thru kills or u get pushed back and are already getting low on mana". If u are in a group with ppl u know will have correct positioning and protect u if need be, of course u can run much lower hp. But in pugs that generally isnt the case and for u to continue to keep the best positioning u would have to be moving back or overextending in to reach the players who push in too far or because ur frontline isnt pushed far enough up. MWs can only heal on the run if they already applied an enveloping mist before moving, so u can have ur heal on one target and thats it. Sometimes its better to hold ur bad positioning and continue to heal so ur team can push out of the bad positioning is currently has. If u run 3.6 hp u will have a tough time doing that. All i would take is a rog open and any oher source of dmg at the same time to global u before even a 450-500 enveloping mist ticks. Also if u get silenced, which no matter how good u are in a bg it does happen, u are much more likely to die even with rolls / cds. Holding 3 chi at all times to heal urself is a detriment to mw heals. First off it is impossible to always have 3 chi, second off u could use that chi to heal another teamate being focused and with a higher stam build choose to take the dmg knowing u can just outheal it in 3 seconds when u have the chi again.

A rounded mw generally gets ~230 sp with wep, 5.6k hp, 280 base mana regen, 20-22% haste. To run a 3.6k hp build u would be around 270sp i would assume (thats only around a 20% more healing) and slightly more mana regen and slightly more haste. Even at 200 sp once u get enveloping mist on a target that target will generally not die, having ur enveloping mist tick for 50-70 more isnt going to stop the burst comparatively. Ill say it again, what mw needs to concentrate on is its weakness, multitarget healing.

 

[Snack]

@Snack @Trollguden , In my response i literally say u should wep swap and to do it when pushing or falling back... ie : "Of course u can do something like keep sp to wep at opening of mid, then swap to heartsong once either ur team gains some breathing room thru kills or u get pushed back and are already getting low on mana". If u are in a group with ppl u know will have correct positioning and protect u if need be, of course u can run much lower hp. But in pugs that generally isnt the case and for u to continue to keep the best positioning u would have to be moving back or overextending in to reach the players who push in too far or because ur frontline isnt pushed far enough up. MWs can only heal on the run if they already applied an enveloping mist before moving, so u can have ur heal on one target and thats it. Sometimes its better to hold ur bad positioning and continue to heal so ur team can push out of the bad positioning is currently has. If u run 3.6 hp u will have a tough time doing that. All i would take is a rog open and any oher source of dmg at the same time to global u before even a 450-500 enveloping mist ticks. Also if u get silenced, which no matter how good u are in a bg it does happen, u are much more likely to die even with rolls / cds. Holding 3 chi at all times to heal urself is a detriment to mw heals. First off it is impossible to always have 3 chi, second off u could use that chi to heal another teamate being focused and with a higher stam build choose to take the dmg knowing u can just outheal it in 3 seconds when u have the chi again.

A rounded mw generally gets ~230 sp with wep, 5.6k hp, 280 base mana regen, 20-22% haste. To run a 3.6k hp build u would be around 270sp i would assume (thats only around a 20% more healing) and slightly more mana regen and slightly more haste. Even at 200 sp once u get enveloping mist on a target that target will generally not die, having ur enveloping mist tick for 50-70 more isnt going to stop the burst comparatively. Ill say it again, what mw needs to concentrate on is its weakness, multitarget healing.

As I stated before, haste > stamina for healing in general, and haste/spirit > stamina for multi target healing. Haste lowers your GCD, it makes soothing mist tick faster, and you're able to apply more hots on more targets. I partly agree with you, and you certainly know your mistweaving

 

[Allybeboba]

Haste operates on a bell curve not linearly fellows. Once you hit it's zenith you are wasting precious resources.

 

[Snack]

Haste operates on a bell curve not linearly fellows. Once you hit it's zenith you are wasting precious resources.

And do you know what the haste breakpoints are? Btw. that is why a mix between spirit/haste is a good idea, not just full out haste

 

[Allybeboba]

Yes, I have been experimenting with it since the introduction of haste for casters. With that said, I have plenty of experience with it. How about you? Care to share your experiences and longevity of haste knowledge?

 

[Snack]

Yes, I have been experimenting with it since the introduction of haste for casters. With that said, I have plenty of experience with it. How about you? Care to share your experiences and longevity of haste knowledge?

Care to lay out your numbers for us? So that we can compare, and see if we are on the same page

 

[Allybeboba]

Care to lay out your numbers for us? So that we can compare, and see if we are on the same page

What numbers would you like?
I have already linked a level 20 Mistweaver for the OP. Mind you, that is only one of my 20 Mistweavers.
Have you recited one of your own characters as examples? Perhaps you have, and I missed it as I do not peruse this site that often.
Why must you turn most threads you post on a you vs someone else thread?
My diagnosis is...
Your fear of being left out of the group or being seen as not important. So you strive to be the center of attention. It is not uncommon really. As people mature, they naturally grow out of that need. At least most people do. Good luck and good night.

 

[Snack]

What numbers would you like?
I have already linked a level 20 Mistweaver for the OP. Mind you, that is only one of my 20 Mistweavers.
Have you recited one of your own characters as examples? Perhaps you have, and I missed it as I do not peruse this site that often.
Why must you turn most threads you post on a you vs someone else thread?
My diagnosis is...
Your fear of being left out of the group or being seen as not important. So you strive to be the center of attention. It is not uncommon really. As people mature, they naturally grow out of that need. At least most people do. Good luck and good night.

What an elaborate way to dodge a question... I feel sorry for you, if you think this is me trying to turn this thread into a personal fight, all I've done is asking you simpel questions? But I guess it's only natural that you would try to turn this around on me, as it seems you don't really know what you say you knew?

But we'll try again, give you another chance; at what haste value would you say that haste has "reached its zenith" for a mw monk?

 

[Allybeboba]

I have given it to you already, twice in this thread alone. You just failed to see it.
Please do not make me spell out each and every post for you all as if you all could not read. Or at the very least had a high school education.

 

[AlbinoCow]

I have given it to you already, twice in this thread alone. You just failed to see it.
Please do not make me spell out each and every post for you all as if you all could not read. Or at the very least had a high school education.

I have given it to you already, twice in this thread alone. You just failed to see it.
Please do not make me spell out each and every post for you all as if you all could not read. Or at the very least had a high school education.

 

[Snack]

I have given it to you already, twice in this thread alone. You just failed to see it.
Please do not make me spell out each and every post for you all as if you all could not read. Or at the very least had a high school education.

I know it can be frustrating to get caught in a lie, but can we please keep this civil and on topic? Thank you.

The numbers you have posted have been stamina values, and not one of your posts gave an answer to my question, surely you, with your superior reading abilities and education, are able to see that. You did post an armory of your monk. What you didn't, however, was to explain how this how any influence on my question; at what haste value does a MW monks haste curve 'reach zenith'.

And please, if you know these numbers, just reply with them, it will surely be faster than an irrelevant paragraph about my education.

 

[Allybeboba]

What lie would that be? Your "numbers" are on the first page.
It is now time for you to start answering my questions. You have quite a bit of catching up to do I believe. For you have failed to answer very few, if any. We are awaiting with abated breath.

 

[Snack]

What lie would that be? Your "numbers" are on the first page.
It is now time for you to start answering my questions. You have quite a bit of catching up to do I believe. For you have failed to answer very few, if any. We are awaiting with abated breath.

Ok once and for all, can you quote the post in which you gave the information I asked for?

And what questions have I left unanswered?

 

[Allybeboba]

A better question would be what questions of mine have you answered?

 

[Snack]

A better question would be what questions of mine have you answered?

You have not asked any topic-relevant questions.

But let's end this, it's clear to everyone that you have no idea what the haste values are.

I wish you a good day