Is This The Dawn Of A Cultural Shift?
- Thread starter Kincaide
- Start date
OP
OP
Kincaide
Legend
No I'm not making myself clear then. There is no "veteran" account. Blue posts have already said that that's just internal terminology. Think about this logically. They are making it so that every account, across the board, when it is in a non-paying status, is exactly the same. There is no distinction between an account who has paid in the past but is not currently paying, and an account who has simply never paid. The only difference is the account who paid in the past would have had an opportunity to put a character in a guild and so would be able to add a character to the guild while in pay-off mode, but the account who has never paid couldn't have had a character in a guild so that option isn't available simply because there's no guild to join.
Therefore, an account whose payment has lapsed, and an account who simply never has paid, are quite literally exactly the same thing. It's false to think in terms of veteran status versus trial status. That's a logical error.
Baumbart
Legend
The thing is that they are not the same even from Blizz point of view. There are certain services like the expansion trials every 3 months that regular starter accounts are not eligible for (and probably still won't be eligible). Your initial post makes it seem like all starter accounts will be made into veteran (or whatever they eventually decide to call them) and there's no indication of it.
Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying this in defense of f2p purity or whatever, it's just that in terms of mere technical account management there will likely still be a distinction.
OP
OP
Kincaide
Legend
You make a good point. I think I might tweet Blizzard about it. I think that it would be easier bookkeeping for -them-, if they are literally the same even on the back-end. My point was really that for all intents and purposes on the front-end they are the same, to the point that there isn't a reason for us to hold a cultural distinction between the former two groups anymore.
Grizzlefoot
Legend
Can i play my lvl 19 without paying for a sub or am i mistaken
OP
OP
Kincaide
Legend
It depends. Blizzard might mess with the xp-on, xp-off with the new features. This is definitely going to be one of the very first things tested in 6.1, because if it works the way we hope to, then a ton of F2P players will be able to join the 19s.
Edit: not to mention the hundreds of thousands of old lapsed subscribers who might get back into the game for pvp if they're able to play 19s for free.
Björke
Legend
My question: I buy the battle chest on my pure f2p so that I have access to content that is considered p2p today like 225 profs, endgame enchs and guild looms, etc. After my gametime runs out - Is it confirmed that I am still able to get all of these things on my (new) <21 characters?
If so, then there would be a difference between pure f2p and veteran accounts. And even if we were not to be able to access these things, it would show on your characters, because of the "p2p content" you obtained.
I do not want to praise pure f2p over p2p, but to me this contradicts with your statement, that there would be no difference anymore and a "paradigm shift"
EDIT:
The gear difference on your characters is what makes the differences between f2p and p2p for me. Id consider a p2p 20 with f2p restricted characters closer to the f2p side than the p2p side of the bracket. Of course you have nice things like btags and grouping to facilitate your experience, but when it comes down to what is the essence of f2p - that is pvp, for without it, there would be no bracket - there is no difference between the two. Now as I have stated above, this equality in pvp would crumble, if a veteran account that is currently not payed for but has gear advantages others dont have, would be viewed as the same as an actual "oldschool" f2p.
If so, then there would be a difference between pure f2p and veteran accounts. And even if we were not to be able to access these things, it would show on your characters, because of the "p2p content" you obtained.
I do not want to praise pure f2p over p2p, but to me this contradicts with your statement, that there would be no difference anymore and a "paradigm shift"
EDIT:
The gear difference on your characters is what makes the differences between f2p and p2p for me. Id consider a p2p 20 with f2p restricted characters closer to the f2p side than the p2p side of the bracket. Of course you have nice things like btags and grouping to facilitate your experience, but when it comes down to what is the essence of f2p - that is pvp, for without it, there would be no bracket - there is no difference between the two. Now as I have stated above, this equality in pvp would crumble, if a veteran account that is currently not payed for but has gear advantages others dont have, would be viewed as the same as an actual "oldschool" f2p.
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OP
OP
Kincaide
Legend
But considering every old starter account can get the battlechest for 5 dollars and spend a month upgrading their 20 (or 19!) to have those professions and bank slots and BoAs and enchants, why wouldn't they? It's 5 dollars. How strongly is someone going to stick to the idea of "purity" which is really just a sour-grapes way of feeling superior? (wow, that was a personal opinion I just inserted there, take it as such.)
I've said before, I think the "upgraded 20" is going to be the new norm. If not the "sub-off 19". Or both. It's five dollars!!
Iorek
Grandfathered
I dont get why most of you get mad with "pure F2P" terminology, it means that they never paid to play wow. Therefore, they dont have any game content linked. And they are a lot more than 5% of F2Ps, maybe 5% here on TI
NO, they never paid, they dont have >20 toons. It has nothing to do with superiority (I know it is your personal opinion, but I had to answer XD)
It's just a simple and useful term
So... this cultural shift means that all of you will make level 20/19 real twinks using a temporary sub-on?
And F2Ps that nerver paid to play wow (shortened: pure F2P) will play vs 29s and 20 twinks being in a greater disadvantage or vs 29s in a low population bracket if most of you change to 19 bracket
If these changes happen, that portion of F2Ps probably will quit wow
NO, they never paid, they dont have >20 toons. It has nothing to do with superiority (I know it is your personal opinion, but I had to answer XD)
It's just a simple and useful term
So... this cultural shift means that all of you will make level 20/19 real twinks using a temporary sub-on?
And F2Ps that nerver paid to play wow (shortened: pure F2P) will play vs 29s and 20 twinks being in a greater disadvantage or vs 29s in a low population bracket if most of you change to 19 bracket
If these changes happen, that portion of F2Ps probably will quit wow
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OP
OP
Kincaide
Legend
Nah, they'll probably pass on one combo meal and pay the $5.
I know, I know, I KNOW I sound like the same arguments P2Ps have made for years! I know.
Björke
Legend
But considering every old starter account can get the battlechest for 5 dollars and spend a month upgrading their 20 (or 19!) to have those professions and bank slots and BoAs and enchants, why wouldn't they? It's 5 dollars. How strongly is someone going to stick to the idea of "purity" which is really just a sour-grapes way of feeling superior? (wow, that was a personal opinion I just inserted there, take it as such.)
I've said before, I think the "upgraded 20" is going to be the new norm. If not the "sub-off 19". Or both. It's five dollars!!
I get where you are going with this. With the easy and cheap access to the content the f2p community might evolve to a veteran community. Yet you have to agree with me, that there is going to be a difference since the two are not the same. Even if every pure starter account bought a battle chest, there still would be the possibilty to be a purist
Now the thought of an evolution is very interesting and I myself am interested (and not opposed in case I aroused a wrong impression). An again more balanced 20-29 bracket is a good goal in my opinion.
Thats the other side of the matter.
Its basically a very darwinistic approach, which it by the way always was. The possibility to obtain p2p content now just got a lot cheaper
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OP
OP
Kincaide
Legend
I get where you are going with this. With the easy and cheap access to the content the f2p community might evolve to a veteran community. Yet you have to agree with me, that there is going to be a difference since the two are not the same. Even if every pure starter account bought a battle chest, there still would be the possibilty to be a purist
Now the thought of an evolution is very interesting and I myself am interested (and not opposed in case I aroused a wrong impression). An again more balanced 20-29 bracket is a good goal in my opinion.
Thats the other side of the matter.
Its basically a very darwinistic approach, which it by the way always was. The possibility to obtain p2p content now just got a lot cheaper
29s will always have the advantage of abilities and glyphs, and in the case of abilities, that's no small difference (looking at you, ferals). BUT, anything that narrows the gap will be that much better. Plus of course the possibility of maybe getting to play 19s, if you can get fully BIS in one month.
Crystalpall
the F2P PvEr
[JTV][/JTV]The question is: what with faction changes etc for F2Ps?
PragmTwice
Grandfathered
I haven't been paying much attention to the "f2p" scene since WoD ruined the bracket with 29's but this is all great news for "f2p", Assuming the worst case scenario, and xp-off is disabled for lapsed accounts, the gap between f2p and p2p will close a lot, and guild access will make it easier to organize. Is there still a server which f2ps are mostly based on? I know it was Aerie Peak before, has that changed?
OP
OP
Kincaide
Legend
It's still Aerie Peak
There are other servers, but yeah, if people want to seriously consider having multiple F2P guilds on one server, now that we can have actual guilds as F2P, Aerie Peak is the place to do it.
PragmTwice
Grandfathered
It's still Aerie Peak
Great, I know where to go then. Only question now is if I resub my dead account and get started making 19 twinks now, or wait for 6.1 to drop and get confirmation on everything.
Aradiel
Legend
There are still 3 levels for accounts, Starter, Battlechest and WoD. The biggest change, apart from vet accounts, is that game time tokens can be traded and put on AH. It's effectively turning the game into F2P for those with more time/gold than money. It also makes gold for those with more money than time to grind out gold. I wonder if there will be a way to get game time for gold on a vet account. Also, will they eventually bring in services for gold?
The other unknown is whether or not P2P 20 and below with full chants, BoAs and profs can still be accessed as vets, and what happens to XP locked 19s. Personally, I'd like vet 20s to be in the XP on bracket, and just not gain XP. Interestingly, in my recent WoD trial, the first week I was in BGs against 90s only. The last few days they put me in the 90-99 XP on bracket. So it's not inconceivable that vets will be put in XP on.
The other unknown is whether or not P2P 20 and below with full chants, BoAs and profs can still be accessed as vets, and what happens to XP locked 19s. Personally, I'd like vet 20s to be in the XP on bracket, and just not gain XP. Interestingly, in my recent WoD trial, the first week I was in BGs against 90s only. The last few days they put me in the 90-99 XP on bracket. So it's not inconceivable that vets will be put in XP on.