EU+US BiS 19 Rogue Gear?
- Thread starter Baaliici
- Start date
Holythane
Lewno
Test it out yourself in bgs?
Ogre
Grandfathered
Just tested it, it was worse than the heirloom
Vor
Grandfathered
Numbers? Just get it too (after 5 days camping) on my Horde toon.
Ogre
Grandfathered
it was very little difference, maybe 5 damage or so.
necroaqua
Grandfathered
Interesting. With weapons no longer scaling, it may simply be the visible damage. I'll need to do some testing with a bunch of weapons.
Snack
Salty
It's weapon speed
necroaqua
Grandfathered
It was weapon speed because everything scaled to ilvl 24 and weapon speed was not normalized.
Now that things don't scale up to ilvl 24, I'm not sure. Theoretically, Brushwood Blade and Sinister Scimitar should be better damage than the Heirloom 2.8 speed weapon, but reports are that they are NOT providing better damage. So it now just may be based on visible damage. I have yet to test with all the invasion stuff going on. I also don't have the sunstrider axe or brushwood blade. But I'll be testing sinister scimitar vs shadowfang vs regular invasion axe vs heirloom plus a few other weapons to see if I can figure it out. I will also check for daggers with the jagged wing slasher, talon of vultros, regular and TF invasion daggers, etc.
Can't go wrong with the 2.8 heirloom weapon. I would go into a BG and look at the tooltip for ambush and your other primary skills. Try all your possible mainhand weapons and see where the tooltip is giving you the best damage. Really you should also test the damage out against the same person several times in practice...which you might be able to do in arena...but the tooltip should work for now.
gingrninja
Grandfathered
necroaqua
Grandfathered
Thats what a couple of people have said. If you have it, take it into a BG and compare it to the heirloom 2.8speed and see what the tooltip says for yourself.
gingrninja
Grandfathered
I do have it but am at work atm. I'll SS some numbers later if no one beats me to it.
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Snack
Salty
I dont know what you mean about scaling, no items are scaling in instanced PvP anymore, and Weapon speed hasn't been normalized yet. It's all about weapon speed really, brushwood blade is an exception for some reason.
StS Ralso
Previously known as Spikethesilent
So I had this theory: Outlaw rogues have some abilities that depend on weapon dmg; like Ambush and Saber Slash
then they have other abilities that depend on Attack Power; like Pistol Shot and Run Through
conclusion: go for invasion/ bg chest weapons on a Outlaw Rogue, or am I just crazy?
then they have other abilities that depend on Attack Power; like Pistol Shot and Run Through
conclusion: go for invasion/ bg chest weapons on a Outlaw Rogue, or am I just crazy?
Snack
Salty
If you mean for instanced PvP then yes you are crazy, since the AP on your weapons are nullified upon entering instanced PvP. You'd want the slowest possible weapon in your MH and the weapon with the highest ilvl which is WF'd invasion axe or blue PvP weapon in OH.
StS Ralso
Previously known as Spikethesilent
Oh yea, forgot about the weapon beeing nullified. Well I seem to be at my normal state of mind atleast x)
necroaqua
Grandfathered
Right. Items used to scale. But they don't anymore.
Damage for a given skill is a combination of weapon damage, skill base damage, and AP (from agility). Agility is fairly static with the stat template system - dropping ilvls might make a .1% or .2% change - barely worth noticing. Skill damage stays static based on level. Weapon damage is the only thing that matters.
Since attack speed isn't normalized AND items scaling, the best way to get weapon damage was a slow attack speed. A low level weapon that has a 2.8 attack speed would scale to the same weapon damage as a heirloom or shadowfang with 2.8 attack speed - so it didn't matter how low the ilvl of the weapon was. A higher ilvl weapon might have been better - but things like Emil's Brand were so fast that it didn't matter - the 3.8 2H weapons were still better damage.
But now they've removed scaling. And there have been reports of both brushwood blade and sinister scimitar being worse than the heirloom. So something is wrong with our understanding. With weapons no longer scaling up to ilvl 24 - weapon damage for weapons ilvls <=24 may no longer solely depend on weapon speed. So perhaps the listed weapon damage on the weapon is what is being used. Perhaps theres some normalization of damage that factors in multiple things. I've heard that the ilvl 34 invasion bow deals more damage than the ilvl 24 invasion bow, and its more damage than a .1% in agility would be. Since the bows are both the same speed, the damage can't be normalized based on attack speed - which points to actual weapon damage being used.
Unfortunately with the obsession with getting all TF invasion gear (and my computer dying a slow death) - I haven't made time to actually test a wide variety of weapons to see. I might make an attempt tonight and take several screenshots with different weapons to see if I can figure something out.
Snack
Salty
I don't think you are right, I think there are simply something wrong with the Sicimater and Brushwood Blade, since every other weapon follows the pattern of slow > fast. And I havn't heard anyone say that the 34 bow gives a notable dmg increase in instanced PvP compared to the 24 ilvl bow
necroaqua
Grandfathered
Like I said - we don't really know what the model is. But the old model isn't quite right. Sinister scimitar was definitely more damage than the heirloom before the patch. Now it supposedly isn't. So I'm inclined to believe something has changed. I'm just not sure what - so more testing is required.
As to the 34 bow, I can't remember exactly where it was said....probably in one of the early threads showing off the "first" ilvl 34 bow.
Arkant
Freedom~
~50 more Cobra Shot damage.