Twinking : Growing or Dying?
- Thread starter Shaun
- Start date
Gulbon
Legend
Twinking is definitely losing it's publicity, but twinking is also at it's peak if you think about F2P. There are F2P twinks who have never played P2P WoW who see F2P twinks and gear just like them to the point there's thousands upon thousands of F2Ps who joined WoW for the first time a month or two ago who are already 'twinked'.
Groenboompje
Banned
Twinking died a long time ago. We are now in the age of Tinking.
Kirise
OG
Currently, it's dying, but that varies patch to patch. 5.2 was one of the worst patches in twinking history, thanks to severe class imbalance. 5.3 helped a bit, and 5.4 should fire up some interest with enchantment scaling. But honestly, until skirmishes come back, I think MoP will be pretty low-key for twinks. Here's to hoping I'm wrong.
strec021
Legend
This is a really tough question. Twinking, from a representation and variety point of view, is better than it's ever been. But, from a balance point of view, it's horrendously atrocious. There have been pokes and prods at balance, with occasional resilience and enchantment changes, but two overarching problems plague it: Completely imbalanced BASE damage and healing on special abilities/heals, and ridiculous attack power scaling on abilities (looking at shield slam, avenger's shield, among others). If there was a sweeping 60% healing nerf 58-85 and 40% 1-57, healing would essentially be balanced.
In direct answer to the question? It's neutral. Because a lot of people are leaving due to the gross imbalance, but a lot are attracted to it because of the vast opportunity to play specs as opposed to the past.
In direct answer to the question? It's neutral. Because a lot of people are leaving due to the gross imbalance, but a lot are attracted to it because of the vast opportunity to play specs as opposed to the past.
donniedarkõ
Legend
I think you got your answer through the activity in this forum, the number of votes and the game itself. Nothing is going to improve until next expansion, they have decided not to lift a finger. Things are only going to get worse. Unless a big change happen or they balance classes.
willix
Legend
The high point in twinking was during BC towards the end of 2.4. Wotlk definitely challenged twinking a bit, and 3.2 saw the demise of several brackets as we knew them.
The only bracket that has come even close to the popularity of twinking prior to 3.2, is the 20-24 bracket. They are the closest thing to old school twinking, and no other bracket has come even close since the XP off segregation was implemented.
The best you can do now is wargames with friends.
The only bracket that has come even close to the popularity of twinking prior to 3.2, is the 20-24 bracket. They are the closest thing to old school twinking, and no other bracket has come even close since the XP off segregation was implemented.
The best you can do now is wargames with friends.
Mocha
Legendary
Twinking has been on a STEADY decline since the option to turn off exp was introduced. Let me discuss on the matter of battlegroups, premades, and guilds to represent a trend I've noticed.
Before battlegroups there were several twink guilds on nearly every server. Almost all of them would partake in guild vs guild premades.
Then there were battlegroups which funneled premading guilds down furthermore. Now there were a few premading guilds across all servers on a battleground. It wasn't very common to find more than one premading guild on one server. Some battlegrounds had more premading guilds than others etc. But after creating a larger pool of players we decreased our number of guilds by creating powerhouse guilds from players of other servers.
Then exp toggling changed things to twink vs twink. What this meant was some battlegroups could not get a single game. With that being said there were no premades (and therefore, premading guilds) on any battlegroup other than Cyclone in late TBC and Ruin early WOTLK. We all mushed to one battlegroup and had perhaps 1 premading powerhouse guild per server in ruin WOTLK. This created only a select handful of premading guilds in all of US.
Sure guilds had "more skillful players" but think of how many premades were not being had as a result of the hundreds of players who were considered good but weren't in a guild's 10 man.
In cata every Battlegroup merged which created 1-3 powerhouse premading guilds in ALL of US.
Sadly being funneled into one pool has completely damaged our twinking population. Everybody says how as a result of that, everyone is a better player. Sure I can see where that person is coming from, but a players skill has nearly nothing to do with his ability in a premade. Premades are about coordination of a team. I've been on absolutely stacked allstar premade teams where we lost and I've been on complete underdog premade teams and we've won. At the end of the day, a group of competent players who work well as a team will always beat these "all-star" teams who can't see past their own egos.
Premading to me is the absolute highest form of competition in 19s. Pugs are just practices for premades. Some people were more into the arena side of things, but I've always been a battleground player because sure, winning a 2s match is fun, but I have never felt better than winning a premade as <Mayhem> with a family that we created from day one.
As of Cata twinking population has definitely increased with a little bit of activity going on in 39s and with the loss of Waw Tawent. The start of MOP was great for twinking. People actually rejoined the bracket because they thought the endless GY farming would be over. Sadly after the demise of EU 19s everything is twofold which is putting our bracket right back into the harsh conditions of cata. As of 2 months ago or so, things were really looking up. Hopefully EU will gain pops again so we can work on constructive in US once again.
Honestly if blizzard merged exp on / off again, brought back skirmishes, OR EVEN made it more difficult to GY farm or "contain" as some people put it twinking would boom overnight. I know a few hundred personal friends who are no longer playing 19s as a result of how horrible things have became. They've all either quit, moved to 20s or moved to 90s but will every once in a while check up on 19s to see if the bracket finally stopped gy farming themselves into no queues.
Quantity over quality does not apply here because it results in 0 games being played for everyone. It is a dead end. Recuperating the population to a flourishing status would be better for everyone. Hell I remember knowing at least 80 different level 19 twinks alone on my medium pop server of Akama. As of cata I am the only 19 twink on the server and the only one of the servers which formerly comprised of my entire battlegroup Vengeance.
Sadface.
It doesn't help knowing that blizzard could make everything amazing again literally over night. Perhaps that's why I'm still playing even though I have not been "happy" with the game since November 12 2008?
Cheers everybody. I hope you take this post with a grain of salt. I don't mean to rant but I just wanted to share a few ideas that came to mind when considering the words "growing" "twinking" and "dying"
Mocha
Before battlegroups there were several twink guilds on nearly every server. Almost all of them would partake in guild vs guild premades.
Then there were battlegroups which funneled premading guilds down furthermore. Now there were a few premading guilds across all servers on a battleground. It wasn't very common to find more than one premading guild on one server. Some battlegrounds had more premading guilds than others etc. But after creating a larger pool of players we decreased our number of guilds by creating powerhouse guilds from players of other servers.
Then exp toggling changed things to twink vs twink. What this meant was some battlegroups could not get a single game. With that being said there were no premades (and therefore, premading guilds) on any battlegroup other than Cyclone in late TBC and Ruin early WOTLK. We all mushed to one battlegroup and had perhaps 1 premading powerhouse guild per server in ruin WOTLK. This created only a select handful of premading guilds in all of US.
Sure guilds had "more skillful players" but think of how many premades were not being had as a result of the hundreds of players who were considered good but weren't in a guild's 10 man.
In cata every Battlegroup merged which created 1-3 powerhouse premading guilds in ALL of US.
Sadly being funneled into one pool has completely damaged our twinking population. Everybody says how as a result of that, everyone is a better player. Sure I can see where that person is coming from, but a players skill has nearly nothing to do with his ability in a premade. Premades are about coordination of a team. I've been on absolutely stacked allstar premade teams where we lost and I've been on complete underdog premade teams and we've won. At the end of the day, a group of competent players who work well as a team will always beat these "all-star" teams who can't see past their own egos.
Premading to me is the absolute highest form of competition in 19s. Pugs are just practices for premades. Some people were more into the arena side of things, but I've always been a battleground player because sure, winning a 2s match is fun, but I have never felt better than winning a premade as <Mayhem> with a family that we created from day one.
As of Cata twinking population has definitely increased with a little bit of activity going on in 39s and with the loss of Waw Tawent. The start of MOP was great for twinking. People actually rejoined the bracket because they thought the endless GY farming would be over. Sadly after the demise of EU 19s everything is twofold which is putting our bracket right back into the harsh conditions of cata. As of 2 months ago or so, things were really looking up. Hopefully EU will gain pops again so we can work on constructive in US once again.
Honestly if blizzard merged exp on / off again, brought back skirmishes, OR EVEN made it more difficult to GY farm or "contain" as some people put it twinking would boom overnight. I know a few hundred personal friends who are no longer playing 19s as a result of how horrible things have became. They've all either quit, moved to 20s or moved to 90s but will every once in a while check up on 19s to see if the bracket finally stopped gy farming themselves into no queues.
Quantity over quality does not apply here because it results in 0 games being played for everyone. It is a dead end. Recuperating the population to a flourishing status would be better for everyone. Hell I remember knowing at least 80 different level 19 twinks alone on my medium pop server of Akama. As of cata I am the only 19 twink on the server and the only one of the servers which formerly comprised of my entire battlegroup Vengeance.
Sadface.
It doesn't help knowing that blizzard could make everything amazing again literally over night. Perhaps that's why I'm still playing even though I have not been "happy" with the game since November 12 2008?
Cheers everybody. I hope you take this post with a grain of salt. I don't mean to rant but I just wanted to share a few ideas that came to mind when considering the words "growing" "twinking" and "dying"
Mocha
Oliks
Check it!
I don't understand the last part of what you wrote
But yes I should have written mine differently:
A lot of people are moving to US from EU, and because of that EU is getting less and less pops, which makes people stop playing and quit or move to US..
Also, remember that there is a lot of europeans in ÙS who are leveling mains to get heirlooms etc then to make their twinks or people who are still in auction sales trying to buy one
.So i guess it should be EU is dying because US is growing
Twinkling has been dying slowly since the release of patch 3.2. Less brackets get pops each expansion and the brackets that get pops become less active. Patch 5.4 is going to have a negative impact on twinking once again and could be the nail in the coffin for a lot of twink brackets until Blizzard makes some major changes.
Let's hope that by next expansion Blizzard finishes and perfects their scaling of levels, gear, and enchants in battlegrounds to the point where they can merge players who queue with their experience on and off into the same pool. This would resurge twinkling. Players who still want to play competitive games against other twinks can join serious twink guilds and queue war game battlegrounds against other twink guilds.
Let's hope that by next expansion Blizzard finishes and perfects their scaling of levels, gear, and enchants in battlegrounds to the point where they can merge players who queue with their experience on and off into the same pool. This would resurge twinkling. Players who still want to play competitive games against other twinks can join serious twink guilds and queue war game battlegrounds against other twink guilds.
grathlong
Legend
I think that we lost a lot of the graveyard farmers, and people who simply gank beginners. Now we actually have more evened out games versus other competitive players. The F2P is definitely making the 20-24 bracket grow. I've seen some new 19 twinks but not too many sadly. In general I think it is growing though.
willix
Legend
20-24 has seen a ton of growth because it is a natural content cap for people who are just trying the game out and has 24/7 queues. Combine that with the fact players from other brackets are tired of working to get activity only to have sub par games, and you have a recipe for a swiftly growing bracket.
I can see 5.4 having a major impact on 20-24 because of the 24s and P2Ps getting enchants like Mongoose and X Ray Scope, while F2P continue to struggle with +2 weapon dmg and minor beast slaying.
danny glover
Officially Retired
19s died a long time ago, now it's just an avatar chat.
Kibbies
Legend
5.4 for f2p would be fantastic if everyone was simply a f2p and everyone quit 24s... everyone would have fun with a level playing field and competitiveness. Sadly that's never going to happen, but it is theoretically possible for everyone to agree to. 19s farm each other (dont give me that gy contain bullshit, one sided farming isnt fun, no idea why you guys dont control mid to atleast let the other team group up for a proper fun fight) and 24s pay for a rediculous advantage, Twinking is killing itself /thread