The Twenty League: F2P and Vet Balance Rules and Restrictions. Feedback Helps!

[Burg]

For The Twenty League Turtle and I would like to try to find a way to balance out the differences between Vets / P2P 20s and F2Ps so both kind of 20s will be able to participate in competing in the tournament. So I came up with some rules and restrictions that I believe would be the best way to try to balance everything out while letting Vets have the Vets edge, and F2Ps being able to stay F2P.

Here they are:
1) Banned BoAs: Necklace, new AGM / DMF trinket, void trinket, new BoA rings, and possibly DPR (up in the air on that one being banned since it is easy to get).
2) Allowed BoAs: cloak, helmet, chest, legs, shoulders, weapon, offhand, insignia trinket, haste trinket, intellect trinket, and tyranny trinket.
3) Banned Enchant Slots for Vets / P2P 20: cloak, shoulders, chest, legs, weapon, offhand, necklace, and helmets (if lucky enough to be GFed).
4) Allowed Enchant Slots for Vets / P2P 20: gloves, bracers, rings, boots (except for minor speed to boots).
5) Dual faction gear is allowed.
6) F2Ps are allowed all of their enchants. These are chest, cloak, bracers, weapon, offhand (if BE), and the armor kits to gloves, legs, and boots.
7) Teams can be mixed up of both Vet / P2P 20 And F2P players.

Reasons:
1)My reasoning behind not banning enchants on things such as gloves, bracers, rings, and boots is because they are not BoA slots and for the most part either quest or expensive BoE gear. To get enchants off of them you have to pay 100g plus what you will have to pay to put the enchants back on. Not everyone has the gold for that.
2) The reason Vets (and F2Ps) are allowing to use BoA legs, cloak, and helmet is because they more then likely won'y have the BiS items for those slots. Plus most Vets won't have LFH like F2Ps
3) Vets getting to use dual faction is because they have paid $30 to be able to get them, would be unfair to take them away.
4) Taking away most enchants bring them a little bit closer to being a F2P, I think this is huge banning weapon enchants.

Turtle also shot out an idea that we would like to see what people think about. This could really help with balancing out the tournament and games! These ideas are for how many Vets / P2P 20s and F2Ps can be on one team.

Here is what it means:
FC - Vet Player
Healer - Vet Player
Healer - Vet Player
Healer - F2P Player
DPS - Vet Player
DPS - Vet Player
DPS - Vet Player
DPS - F2P Player
DPS - F2P Player
DPS - F2P Player

This is all we could think of! Please give your feedback on this issue, we would love to hear it. Anyway we could balance out the differences so everyone can participate in the tournament would be great!

 

[Light]

Im sure we can all compromise.

If anyone has any ideas on how both vets and f2ps can be included in a single league post your ideas

If its just going to be you throwing out an idea such as "Just make it all f2p" Do not bother posting. Please try to include everyones POV

 

[Hashbrowns]

Man a lot of weird restrictions but good job trying to balance it. Casters should get boa weps imo, they do no damage without it.

 

[tence]

For The Twenty League Turtle and I would like to try to find a way to balance out the differences between Vets / P2P 20s and F2Ps so both kind of 20s will be able to participate in competing in the tournament. So I came up with some rules and restrictions that I believe would be the best way to try to balance everything out while letting Vets have the Vets edge, and F2Ps being able to stay F2P.

Here they are:
1) Banned BoAs: Necklace, new AGM / DMF trinket, void trinket, new BoA rings, and possibly DPR (up in the air on that one being banned since it is easy to get).
2) Allowed BoAs: cloak, helmet, chest, legs, shoulders, weapon, offhand, insignia trinket, haste trinket, intellect trinket, and tyranny trinket.
3) Banned Enchant Slots for Vets / P2P 20: cloak, shoulders, chest, legs, weapon, offhand, necklace, and helmets (if lucky enough to be GFed).
4) Allowed Enchant Slots for Vets / P2P 20: gloves, bracers, rings, boots (except for minor speed to boots).
5) Dual faction gear is allowed.
6) F2Ps are allowed all of their enchants. These are chest, cloak, bracers, weapon, offhand (if BE), and the armor kits to gloves, legs, and boots.
7) Teams can be mixed up of both Vet / P2P 20 And F2P players.

Reasons:
1)My reasoning behind not banning enchants on things such as gloves, bracers, rings, and boots is because they are not BoA slots and for the most part either quest or expensive BoE gear. To get enchants off of them you have to pay 100g plus what you will have to pay to put the enchants back on. Not everyone has the gold for that.
2) The reason Vets (and F2Ps) are allowing to use BoA legs, cloak, and helmet is because they more then likely won'y have the BiS items for those slots. Plus most Vets won't have LFH like F2Ps
3) Vets getting to use dual faction is because they have paid $30 to be able to get them, would be unfair to take them away.
4) Taking away most enchants bring them a little bit closer to being a F2P, I think this is huge banning weapon enchants.

Turtle also shot out an idea that we would like to see what people think about. This could really help with balancing out the tournament and games! These ideas are for how many Vets / P2P 20s and F2Ps can be on one team.

Here is what it means:
FC - Vet Player
Healer - Vet Player
Healer - Vet Player
Healer - F2P Player
DPS - Vet Player
DPS - Vet Player
DPS - Vet Player
DPS - F2P Player
DPS - F2P Player
DPS - F2P Player

This is all we could think of! Please give your feedback on this issue, we would love to hear it. Anyway we could balance out the differences so everyone can participate in the tournament would be great!

I like the idea! Especially mixing ftp and vet dps/healers together. The only problem I see with this, is that outside of a few classes that relied of proc stacking to go off, the class comps will likely still stay the same as the standard, as they will still outperform the other lower tier classes.

One possible solution to this could be a point system, based on what is considered top tier, and what is considered lower tier (top tier having a higher point value than the lower tier) and giving a team a point restriction for their entire team. While, as a community we would need to decide on what classes would get what point value, I believe that this could vary teams more, allow more diversity, and allow players to play the classes that they enjoy (and lead to different comps) more than what may or may not be fotm/top tier just to be able to compete.

Just fuel for thought

 

[Burg]

Man a lot of weird restrictions but good job trying to balance it. Casters should get boa weps imo, they do no damage without it.

They would get their BoA weapons and even their offhands. The only thing they won't have is an enchant. I just think weapon enchants are what makes a huge difference in the difference between a Vet / P2P 20 and a F2P.

 

[Burg]

I like the idea! Especially mixing ftp and vet dps/healers together. The only problem I see with this, is that outside of a few classes that relied of proc stacking to go off, the class comps will likely still stay the same as the standard, as they will still outperform the other lower tier classes.

One possible solution to this could be a point system, based on what is considered top tier, and what is considered lower tier (top tier having a higher point value than the lower tier) and giving a team a point restriction for their entire team. While, as a community we would need to decide on what classes would get what point value, I believe that this could vary teams more, allow more diversity, and allow players to play the classes that they enjoy (and lead to different comps) more than what may or may not be fotm/top tier just to be able to compete.

Just fuel for thought

I like the idea of a point system for sure. That is something we could think about trying to add in! Will just need to figure out how we would really want to implement it.

 

[Rapido]

Im sure we can all compromise.

If anyone has any ideas on how both vets and f2ps can be included in a single league post your ideas

If its just going to be you throwing out an idea such as "Just make it all f2p" Do not bother posting. Please try to include everyones POV

fuck all the bullshit. just make all f2p you sillies!

 

[Hashbrowns]

They would get their BoA weapons and even their offhands. The only thing they won't have is an enchant. I just think weapon enchants are what makes a huge difference in the difference between a Vet / P2P 20 and a F2P.

I think that would be good and yea the procs are pretty broken. Thanks for trying to balance this and bring everyone together I don't know why people are so violently against it...

 

[Neon]

f2p or vet no inbetween

 

[Allybeboba]

As I suggested in the other thread. Perhaps the chair people or the committee, whichever the case may be, should consider a maximum AP/SP amount and then just let everyone build their characters around that.
Just have someone build a MAX AP/SP set the within the set restrictions and whatever that is, be it xx attack power and xx spell power. We will work within those restrictions. We all know the real culprit of enchants is the procced damage enchants. That really should be the only gear/enchant restriction.
The less rules/restrictions = the better.
KISS principle... Keep It Simple, Stupid

/cheers
Sweetsidney

 

[Allybeboba]

They would get their BoA weapons and even their offhands. The only thing they won't have is an enchant. I just think weapon enchants are what makes a huge difference in the difference between a Vet / P2P 20 and a F2P.

There are some healers that are totally reliant on weapon enchants. A mistweaver, for instance, will go OOM in no time if it did not have Heartsong, an enchant that only gives extra spirit.

/cheers
Sweetsidney

 

[Burg]

There are some healers that are totally reliant on weapon enchants. A mistweaver, for instance, will go OOM in no time if it did not have Heartsong, an enchant that only gives extra spirit.

/cheers
Sweetsidney

In the F2P premades, I have not seen any of the MW Monks that play be enchant dependent. If MW Monks become useless then so be it.

#bringbackholypaladins

 

[Allybeboba]

So what you are stating that none of the MW you play with use Heartsong?
I would like for Paladins to make a comeback. You know I have one.
You asked for suggestions, I am merely giving mine.

 

[Burg]

So what you are stating that none of the MW you play with use Heartsong?
I would like for Paladins to make a comeback. You know I have one.
You asked for suggestions, I am merely giving mine.

Wait? What? I never said none of my MW Monks didn't use it did I? But since you want to go their my warriors also use Crusader...

That is not the point of the whole weapon enchant thing. The point of it is that a F2P MW Monk, since you want to talk about that class in particular, will not be using Heartsong, they will be using +1 weapon damage, unless they use 2h staff then the +2 intellect.. In a tournament where F2Ps and P2Ps are together, the P2Ps should not be allowed to use a weapon enchant, since that is one of the huge difference makers.

I hope you now see the reason for it, and I thank you for your feedback. It would just not be right though to allow certain classes to use it while facing F2Ps.

 

[Lanky]

To make it simple as possible wouldn't it be easier to just say, make new heirlooms which have enchants on them? Sorted?

 

[Burg]

To make it simple as possible wouldn't it be easier to just say, make new heirlooms which have enchants on them? Sorted?

That's really the point, yes.

 

[LennywBT]

It may seem quite strange seeing F2P and Vets in one Wargame, but seems like this is a really nice idea and will help the 20 community get together, and not be as separated as it is and was before. I am pretty sure i am able to help with anything, Challonge etc. IF you require assistance, just toss me a PM! =)

 

[Allybeboba]

Wait? What? I never said none of my MW Monks didn't use it did I? But since you want to go their my warriors also use Crusader...

That is not the point of the whole weapon enchant thing. The point of it is that a F2P MW Monk, since you want to talk about that class in particular, will not be using Heartsong, they will be using +1 weapon damage, unless they use 2h staff then the +2 intellect.. In a tournament where F2Ps and P2Ps are together, the P2Ps should not be allowed to use a weapon enchant, since that is one of the huge difference makers.

I hope you now see the reason for it, and I thank you for your feedback. It would just not be right though to allow certain classes to use it while facing F2Ps.

No no...
I was not suggesting ones you play with yourself... You misconstrued. I was not accusing you of anything.
I meant as in played with as a teammate.
We have known each other long enough in game, you should know I would never treat you that way.

Your tournament, your rules...
Sweetsidney

 

[HéalBǿt]

seems very reasonable and well thought-out. I wouldn't change anything.

To make it simple as possible wouldn't it be easier to just say, make new heirlooms which have enchants on them? Sorted?

could be your new rules header, but spelling them out as you did is also important so there is no fudge room.

/e goes looking for a fudge room and finds a bunch of male be's looking at each other.

 

[Honey Badger]

Option 1

Just do all F2p

or

Option 2

Fc - Vet

All Dps and heals - f2p

Underpowered classes Heals/DPS - (Vet) to help balance and promote different comps

* Underpowered Vets and FC are only ones allowed to wear Boa pants, cloak and helm ( depending on underpowered class enchants allowed)

or

Option 3

FC - Vet
All Dps and Heals - F2p

Lastly change the league's name - it's on par with a person who names their Druid - "Druid"