EU+US 70 Armory, not Just BIS (make sure your toons are on here, if not please comment!)

Onlydreams said:
Also since "openworld" gear doesn't specify if it's openworld pve gear or openworld pvp gear, and since the offhand without stamina would be better for openworld pve, we can't really make a judgement call on the offhands.
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^ Here is me giving a hyper-specific example on two offhands that could be considered BiS for two completely different purposes

Onlydreams said:
You can also argue proc ring being better for priests than mages because pretty much all of mages damage comes from ray of frost - meaning any proc outside of a ray of frost cast is essentially useless.
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^ Here is me giving a hyper-specific example on two rings that could be considered BiS for two completely different classes/specs.

Blackberryy said:
i thought we agreed open world is not really set?
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Blackberryy said:
therefore you agreed, in my eyes, that there is really no set list for BIS open world.
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^ And here we have you extrapolating my two hyper-specific examples to essentially mean "ANYTHING GOES WHEN IT COMES TO OPENWORLD GEAR".

Onlydreams said:
Yeah there's always going to be grey areas and different builds in dueling gear. That doesn't mean "anything goes" though.
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^ Me trying really hard to tell you not to extrapolate my examples.
 
 
Blackberryy said:
Hoodstarmori [US][Alliance][Vanity]
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giphy.gif
 
Onlydreams said:
The checkmark is intended for BiS armories, not "pretty much BiS" armories.
Since your druid is obviously going for instanced PvE gear I would recommend you check out this thread for the bis list: http://xpoff.com/threads/level-70-pve-bis-gear-compendium.72217/
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What a great guide for pve bis @Fx and who ever else was involved! So much effort and thought put in.
Just curious if you looked at the http://www.wowhead.com/item=44050/mastercraft-kaluak-fishing-pole for Feral/Guardian and if it was one of the grey areas?

@Blackberryy great intuitive and props to trying to boost activity and produce an up to date armory list! Makes me want to re-sub.

Don't take comments to personally, some people (myself included) are passionate about the bracket and are just straight to the point. Keep up the great work!
 
Chey said:
Just curious if you looked at the Mastercraft Kalu'ak Fishing Pole for Feral/Guardian and if it was one of the grey areas?
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It's an interesting question. The benefits of equipping the fishing pole over the standard http://www.wowhead.com/item=34198/stanchion-of-primal-instinct is a +3 average ilvl boost as well as a weapon damage boost of roughly 15 per swing.
But you're losing out 21 crit rating, ~2,3k health in bear form (guardian) and 81 agility in cat form (feral).
So as a feral druid it's almost certainly not worth it. We're weighing +5% damage bonus (from ilvl increase) + ~15 swing damage vs 21 crit and 81 agility. 81 agility is well over a +10% agility increase for most ferals.

As a guardian it becomes a little harder to tell. Once again we're obviously losing damage from the huge agility drop, although partially made up for by the ilvl+swing damage. But after the recent huge buff to guardian damage I don't think they'll have trouble holding aggro regardless. The big question is obviously the 3% damage reduction VS the ~2,3k health. I'm not entirely sure how you could go about comparing these but my gut feeling says 3% damage reduction is better.

You sound like you've looked into it yourself. Curious to hear your thoughts and/or findings.
 
Rubicante said:
besides that and preference for a 3 slot staff I would say I'm BiS
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I actually also thought the staff and the main hand+off hand setup were very similar and basically down to personal preference until quite recently when a guy from my btag called "Hebrew" (dunno if he uses these forums) brought the twilight tome to my attention. But let's do the comparison, shall we?
We have http://www.wowhead.com/item=34337/golden-staff-of-the-sindorei vs http://www.wowhead.com/item=34335/hammer-of-sanctification and http://www.wowhead.com/item=45849/twilight-tome
17 versatility rating (2h) VS 8 haste rating and 11 intellect (mh+oh). This is of course assuming you're gemming intellect in both (which you should), but let's also do the comparison with haste gems:
17 versatility rating and 32 haste rating (2h) VS 32 Intellect (mh+oh)
In both cases the mh+oh wins by a significant amount. Some people might have a visual preference towards staves, but when talking BiS there is no denying the mh+oh setup.

Rubicante said:
the trinks are also for preference
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I think you've misunderstood the word preference...
You're using http://www.wowhead.com/item=129850/icon-of-the-silver-crescent&bonus=692 which is a direct downgrade to http://www.wowhead.com/item=34429/shifting-naaru-sliver (and a big downgrade at that) and... http://www.wowhead.com/item=32496/memento-of-tyrande ... The worst t6 trinket in the game.
Replace with any of these:
http://www.wowhead.com/item=41121/gnomish-lightning-generator
http://www.wowhead.com/item=32483/the-skull-of-guldan
http://www.wowhead.com/item=40865/noise-machine
(listed from best to worst)
 
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Onlydreams said:
You sound like you've looked into it yourself. Curious to hear your thoughts and/or findings.
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Yeh I used to tank with it back in late wtlk early cata but that was when weapon dps was the biggest thing.

Last time I played was 7 months ago and was testing versa gems in the http://www.wowhead.com/item=34337/golden-staff-of-the-sindorei with solo Kara attempt.

Only got to the Opera before real life stuff had me leave game. That was when moonfire had a big increase from the spell power on the staff so I guess now it is way to much of a dps loss to bother with.

Your 3 and 5 man raids have given me a renewed interest and actually looking forward to getting back into some test logging.

I think the http://www.wowhead.com/item=44050/mastercraft-kaluak-fishing-pole is a viable option and will most likely be a choice depending on boss encounter.

It will be difficult to get the data to say if it could be bis or not and even then it may depend on the group you are running with, for example your small bis groups or a larger under geared group may effect which weapon is better for that situation.

but hell I just love this theorycrafting, such a great part of the game.
Shame it has been removed from PVP.
 
@Chey I'm glad our challenge runs have renewed your interest. I'm guessing you're US? Otherwise we'd be happy to invite you.

One thing I just remembered that I had forgotten in my original response was weightstones and sharpeningstones (that cannot be applied to fishing poles). And also the fact that crit converts to avoidance for guardian druids.
So assuming you're using the BiS weightstone which is http://www.wowhead.com/item=28421/adamantite-weightstone we're actually only looking at a swing damage difference of ~7. As well as a total crit/dodge rating loss of 30.
Not saying that completely debunks the fishing pole, but it's important to factor in.
 
Thanks! although i am just as passionate and have been in the bracket since i made my new wow account in early wrath. My rogue is my pride of the whole game lol, with 80 days playtime The Diplomat title as a 70 and many other hard to accomplish titles and achievements as a 70. although i havn't pved a whole lot since WOTLK and just started back up in legion, i guess it's going to take me a bit to get in the swing of things again. And i'm to thank @Onlydreams @Fx for that
Chey said:
What a great guide for pve bis @Fx and who ever else was involved! So much effort and thought put in.
Just curious if you looked at the http://www.wowhead.com/item=44050/mastercraft-kaluak-fishing-pole for Feral/Guardian and if it was one of the grey areas?

@Blackberryy great intuitive and props to trying to boost activity and produce an up to date armory list! Makes me want to re-sub.

Don't take comments to personally, some people (myself included) are passionate about the bracket and are just straight to the point. Keep up the great work!
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Onlydreams said:
@Chey I'm glad our challenge runs have renewed your interest. I'm guessing you're US? Otherwise we'd be happy to invite you.

One thing I just remembered that I had forgotten in my original response was weightstones and sharpeningstones (that cannot be applied to fishing poles). And also the fact that crit converts to avoidance for guardian druids.
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Yeh I play on US server but from Australia, shame would of loved to play with you guys.

Yeah I completely overlooked the stones which dose make a difference.

I had considered the crit/dodge loss but now that Bears are not dodge stacked it was kind of mute and only applicable on physical damage fights. Crit is still obviously a dps loss regardless.
Bear stat priority Armor>Versa=stam/mastery>Haste>Agility>Crit
according to.
http://www.icy-veins.com/wow/guardian-druid-pve-tank-stat-priority

I know that is for end game, however as far as I can work out (disregarding mastery) the talents for 70 keep the stat priority the same with the mitigation rotation.

Given that logic http://www.wowhead.com/item=34183/shivering-felspine would actually be bis over http://www.wowhead.com/item=34198/stanchion-of-primal-instinct with the option to gem to maintain the same agility or use a stam/versa/haste gem too.

argh so much to play around with, I will re-sub this weekend so iam not just talking out my ass. Thanks for the renewed interest guys!!! I feel alive again haha.
 
Sunshine said:
Hmm ok I'll take that trinket from my bank then :D my gloves are better tho because of gf'd enchant and +11 stats gem.
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True, but for anyone who doesn't have the GF'd enchant, 7 crit and 1 haste is better than 2 agi :D
 
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