5.3 = P2P's became much more powerful relatively to F2P's

Piglet said:
rsq - if you can give me the statistics for "f2p pug wins against 6 24's" and "f2p pug wins against 3 24's" in 5.2. (All I know is that the latter was very frequent, and the former happened quite a few times, but I obviously don't remember how many times exactly).

Then I will do the job of collecting similar statistics for 5.3.
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Technically as the person who is making assertions, the burden of proof is on you.
 
I don't find the gap larger. In fact I find it easier to kill 24s. Everyone kinda just keels over.

But for comparison sake I looked through some screenshots to compare/contrast F2P geared char vs P2P 20 geared (same char) in both 5.2 and 5.3. And a comparably geared 24. The gap tightened between 20s and 24s certainly. But there wasn't any huge buff to 24s.

a2ge1v.jpg


P2P has always been stronger in the gear/stat sense. This is nothing new.
 
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Piglet said:
a convincing illustration of this for me personally was today, when a 24 rogue (not gonna name him, but he is a famously badly skilled rogue) easily killed me. While in 5.2, I dueled him a zillion times on my hybrids, and killed him every single time without exceptions.

A simple test. How many times your f2p PUG won against a team with 2-3 24s? Myriad of times.
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So your assertion is that since you arent face rolling this rogue a quote zillion times like before when healers where blatantly overpowered that you can now assert after 1 fight that this patch has made P2P's more powerful than f2ps?

No shit it isnt fair to go up against 24's... but your clearly misinterpreting this scenario so let me paint you a picture..

Seems that your problem is more with the nerf to healing... not with 24s, because the debuff affects 24 healers just as much as f2ps. All this means is you arent going to be able to go god mode to outheal DPS classes, which if its vs a rogue all that means is juking 1 interrupt then free casting.
 
how is this even a discussion?

we ALL should know how gear/stats scale in this game.
+1 agility is worth more to a 20 than it is to a 24.
the gear scaling that f2ps have now make them RELATIVELY more powerful than a 24 in the the same gear.

at 85 with ilvl ~410, my prot paladin was a freaking BEAST.
at 88 in the same gear, that same toon takes twice as long to kill anything.
only way to get anything done is grab a whole pack of mobs (15+) for vengeance.
 
The more interesting question is do F2Ps with scaled BiS gear now equal P2Ps in BiS gear without P2P enchants, in terms of dmg/heal output, hp, etc. I haven't spent any time looking at what it takes to build a BiS 24, but I'd be curious to know if there are instances of players thinking of rerolling to a scaled 20 with P2P enchants.

Having played a few bgs now with each of my characters, 24s do feel a bit squishier to me. They hit just as hard as before, but their HP didn't get bumped like mine did.
 
SallyG said:
a2ge1v.jpg
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This is basically all the "proof" any1 needs.. Fighting some random rogue or fighting someone in general won't prove much. Fights can change and people can get lucky crits. Stats don't get lucky bonus's lol. According to these stats for rogues atleast p2p 20 is almost the exact same as a 24 if not actually better.


Could you give a link because I am pretty sure what the p2p rogue is however the 24 interests me and I'm not sure if it's BiS. If that 24 is BiS then 24s really have no reason in being 24 unless they get an important spell like spriest or druid. Will shake up the bracket quite a bit in 24s get smart
 
Mage and warrior also get cool stuff and so do shamans.
If possible its best meet it half way. For example if u get the nice stuff at 21/22 you stop there instead of goin all the way.
 
This patch is awesome so far however they need to up resil to atleast 50% and replace resil looms w/ pvp power.
 
Goesid said:
This patch is awesome so far however they need to up resil to atleast 50% and replace resil looms w/ pvp power.
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Yeah the resil gear and trinks need to account for something. Pointless having them now. I think resil will come back. They can make new trinks for pvp power that way you can switch out depending on your role/objective. Better yet bring the resil back on the gear and make the trinks boost resil and pvp power at the same time.
 
Lillhunter said:
This is basically all the "proof" any1 needs.. Fighting some random rogue or fighting someone in general won't prove much. Fights can change and people can get lucky crits. Stats don't get lucky bonus's lol. According to these stats for rogues atleast p2p 20 is almost the exact same as a 24 if not actually better.


Could you give a link because I am pretty sure what the p2p rogue is however the 24 interests me and I'm not sure if it's BiS. If that 24 is BiS then 24s really have no reason in being 24 unless they get an important spell like spriest or druid. Will shake up the bracket quite a bit in 24s get smart
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It's a Monk, not a Rogue. It's comparable, but maybe not a completely fair comparison due to gear/potential BiS. It's all I had at the time!

Though I would be very curious about 24s stats in BGs compared to P2P 20s now. Given that the little 20s scaled well. Maybe that's a thread for the 20-24 forum...
 
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i just wonder how long it will take 24s to realize they can go to 23, have the gear scaling of a f2p, and the enchants of a 24.

23 hunts, coming to a gy near you!
 
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They seem more powerful to me. F2P that is. 24 spriest are so op though unless a shaman tortures him all game..
20's have the high ass HP now i know that.
 
@tell it like it is
pretty sure it works like this
Bottom of brack in this case 20
20 gains 4 item lvls on their items
21 gains 3
22 gains 2
23 gains 1
24 gains nada
 
Hozuka said:
orBSGSE.png
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Nesyla said:
I'm glad to announce to you all that i finally made it to talk to a Great GM who took some time to log on my toon and check by himself.


Therlainvele, you're a Hero bro.


This is not intended, he said he would have sent the report to the bug team.


Screenshot


All hail Therlainvele !


- Nesy
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[MENTION=13500]Bisonpower[/MENTION]

taken from 80-89 section.
seems we might see a resil buff sometime soon.
 
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