EU+US 20's (Veteran & F2P) Tier List - BFA 8.3

Henry

Henry

Veteran
Updated 7/25/20.


In light of a recent thread requesting a more detailed "Tier List" for the Vet/F2P bracket, I've compiled the below general guidelines based on common feedback.

**This is primarily a tier list for Battlegrounds - performance in Arenas is not considered here.**

There are, admittedly, many variables to an accurate tier list. The below "Assumptions" are outlined under each list and are assuming an optimal gear set-up and a balanced team comp with equally-skilled players.

The ordering of each bullet under a particular Tier is arbitrary; specs within a given Tier can be reordered interchangeably based on the composition and needs of the team comp.

I will do my best to update these lists regularly with each patch and expac - if you disagree with anything here, please leave your feedback and if the general consensus agrees with you, I'll update it accordingly!




~~~~~~~~~~




Tier List - Veterans

Assumptions:
  1. BiS Gear & Enchants.
    1. (Without BiS Gear & important Enchants like "Crusader" and "Superior Impact", melee specs (Fury, Arms, Ret) and "Weapon Damage Specs" (i.e. those that benefit disproportionately from +weapon damage enchants and modifiers like MM, Surv, Feral, etc.) fall lower on the Tier List.)
  2. Well-rounded Team Composition with Healer Support.
    1. (Without Healer Support, specs lacking self-sustain (Warrior, Hunter, Mage, etc.) fall lower on the Tier List.)
  3. Equally-skilled Players.

S Tier (Best In The Bracket):
  • Balance Druid
  • Restoration Druid
  • Restoration Shaman

A Tier (Better Than Average):
  • Arcane Mage
  • Discipline Priest
  • Fury Warrior
  • Holy Priest
  • Marksmanship Hunter
  • Mistweaver Monk
  • Outlaw Rogue

B Tier (Average):
  • Arms Warrior
  • Beast Mastery Hunter
  • Destruction Warlock
  • Elemental Shaman
  • Feral Druid
  • Holy Paladin
  • Retribution Paladin
  • Shadow Priest
  • Survival Hunter

C Tier (Worse Than Average):
  • Demonology Warlock
  • Enhancement Shaman
  • Frost Mage
  • Protection Paladin
  • Subtlety Rogue
  • Windwalker Monk

D Tier (Worst in the Bracket):
  • Affliction Warlock
  • Assassination Rogue
  • Brewmaster Monk
  • Fire Mage
  • Guardian Druid
  • Protection Warrior



~~~~~~~~~~




Tier List - F2P

Assumptions:
  1. BiS Gear with Optimal Secondary Stats
    1. (F2P does not have access to important enchants like "Crusader" and "Superior Impact" and, as such, certain specs like Fury, Arms, Ret and Feral have dropped on the Tier List when compared to the Veteran rankings.)
  2. Well-rounded Team Composition with Healer Support.
    1. (Without Healer Support, specs lacking self-sustain (Warrior, Hunter, Mage, etc.) fall lower on the Tier List.)
  3. Equally-skilled Players.

S Tier (Best In The Bracket):
  • Balance Druid
  • Restoration Druid
  • Restoration Shaman

A Tier (Better Than Average):
  • Arcane Mage
  • Discipline Priest
  • Holy Priest
  • Marksmanship Hunter
  • Mistweaver Monk
  • Outlaw Rogue

B Tier (Average):
  • Beast Mastery Hunter
  • Destruction Warlock
  • Elemental Shaman
  • Holy Paladin
  • Shadow Priest
  • Survival Hunter

C Tier (Worse Than Average):
  • Demonology Warlock
  • Enhancement Shaman
  • Feral Druid
  • Frost Mage
  • Protection Paladin
  • Retribution Paladin
  • Subtlety Rogue
  • Windwalker Monk

D Tier (Worst in the Bracket):
  • Affliction Warlock
  • Arms Warrior
  • Assassination Rogue
  • Brewmaster Monk
  • Fire Mage
  • Fury Warrior
  • Guardian Druid
  • Protection Warrior
 
Last edited:
Gonna pick this apart and give some of my 2 cents.

Henry said:
S Tier (Best In The Bracket):
  • Restoration Shaman
  • Restoration Druid
  • Discipline Priest
  • Balance Druid
  • Marksmanship Hunter
  • Arcane Mage
Click to expand...
I think rsham, balance, rdruid, and ret (depending on what you're considering) should all be in their own tier, with things like MM, arc, disc, etc being one tier under.
Henry said:
B Tier (Slightly Over-Tuned):
  • Outlaw Rogue
  • Survival Hunter > Beast Mastery Hunter
  • Shadow Priest
Click to expand...
Outlaw should probably be in A tier, otherwise, I could agree with this.
Henry said:
C Tier (Slightly Under-Tuned):
  • Demonology Warlock > Destruction Warlock
Click to expand...
Destro should be a tier or two higher, bolt > immo > conflag > imp bolt can hit for like a 1k burst.
Henry said:
Frost Mage = Fire Mage
Click to expand...
Frost > fire.
Henry said:
F Tier (Tank Specs, due to 30% Innate Damage Taken Debuff):
  • Protection Paladin
  • Brewmaster Monk
Click to expand...
It's 50% now, but prot pala should be up a tier or maybe even two and brew should be up a tier. Brew and prot are both better than sin rogue.
Henry said:
  • Arms Warrior
  • Windwalker Monk
Click to expand...
From a pug standpoint, these can both go up a tier I'd say. Arms has incredible burst potential (WW too but not as much) and WW's disable is nothing to laugh at.


Now, for f2ps.
Henry said:
A Tier (Highly Impactful):
  • Holy Priest
  • Holy Paladin
  • Mistweaver Monk
  • Marksmanship Hunter
  • Balance Druid
  • Arcane Mage
Click to expand...
Balance should be in the top tier.
Henry said:
C Tier (Slightly Under-Tuned):
  • Demonology Warlock > Destruction Warlock
  • Frost Mage = Fire Mage
  • Elemental Shaman
  • Shadow Priest
  • Survival Hunter
  • Fury Warrior
  • Feral Druid
  • Windwalker Monk
Click to expand...
Fury should be down a tier or two, survival hunter is fundamentally good if you play a peel play style so even without enchants I'd bump it up a tier.

Otherwise, I pretty much agree with everything else. Good thread!
 
Waiwhat said:
Shadow priest over elememtal shaman ? Rly
Click to expand...

Was on the fence with Shadow being B vs. C tier, but yes I think that's right, if only for the reason that overall, Shadow puts more pressure on the enemy team and enemy healers than a spec like Ele does with split dot pressure.

Ele has 2 major weaknesses: maelstrom generation and mana problems with off-heals. Earth Shock crits can do big damage, but it takes way too long to charge up enough maelstrom to use it consistently in important team fights. And the off-heals with Healing Surge are, on paper, significant - but the mana cost is so high for the Ele spec that you end up OOM after like 3 heals.

Overall, gaining Earth Shock but at the cost of Riptide, Unleash Life, etc. and the introduction of serious mana problems leaves it feeling very underwhelming to play.
 
Last edited:
Henry said:
Ele has 2 major weaknesses: maelstrom generation and mana problems with off-heals. Earth Shock crits can do big damage, but it takes way to long to charge up enough maelstrom to use it consistently in important team fights. And the off-heals with Healing Surge are, on paper, significant - but the mana cost is so high for the Ele spec that you end up OOM after like 3 heals.
Click to expand...
Pretty much this. Ele can be insane, but they only really shine in sweaty games, which are usually far and few in this bracket.

Aurora shadow can do the same thing as ele as a support spec, spamming huge bubbles on your team and mind flaying targets for your melee while weaving in dots and free mind blasts. Quickblade shadow can take an entire team down to half health in a single VE so...
 
ohti said:
Gonna pick this apart and give some of my 2 cents.


I think rsham, balance, rdruid, and ret (depending on what you're considering) should all be in their own tier, with things like MM, arc, disc, etc being one tier under.

Outlaw should probably be in A tier, otherwise, I could agree with this.

Destro should be a tier or two higher, bolt > immo > conflag > imp bolt can hit for like a 1k burst.

Frost > fire.

It's 50% now, but prot pala should be up a tier or maybe even two and brew should be up a tier. Brew and prot are both better than sin rogue.

From a pug standpoint, these can both go up a tier I'd say. Arms has incredible burst potential (WW too but not as much) and WW's disable is nothing to laugh at.


Now, for f2ps.

Balance should be in the top tier.

Fury should be down a tier or two, survival hunter is fundamentally good if you play a peel play style so even without enchants I'd bump it up a tier.

Otherwise, I pretty much agree with everything else. Good thread!
Click to expand...

Edited with your proposed changes. Thanks, Ohti!
 
I disagree with ret pally ranking strictly from a bg point of view. It has zero gap closers, and is so easily cc'd/slowed it's insane. Against randoms sure it can wreck, but it's so easy to counter in bgs with a decent group. If you can stay on the target, sure you can absolutely wreck but with the meta going so ranged class heavy, that's the issue; you have to get to the target without anything like charge.

In areas/duels? Ret is amazing. This is a list for bgs though.

I disagree with hpally too but oh well. Let people dream!
 
tence said:
I disagree with ret pally ranking strictly from a bg point of view. It has zero gap closers, and is so easily cc'd/slowed it's insane. Against randoms sure it can wreck, but it's so easy to counter in bgs with a decent group. If you can stay on the target, sure you can absolutely wreck but with the meta going so ranged class heavy, that's the issue; you have to get to the target without anything like charge.

In areas/duels? Ret is amazing. This is a list for bgs though.

I disagree with hpally too but oh well. Let people dream!
Click to expand...

Where would you put Ret and HPal on the tier list? And do you mean Vet or F2P or both?
 
tence said:
I disagree with ret pally ranking strictly from a bg point of view. It has zero gap closers, and is so easily cc'd/slowed it's insane. Against randoms sure it can wreck, but it's so easy to counter in bgs with a decent group. If you can stay on the target, sure you can absolutely wreck but with the meta going so ranged class heavy, that's the issue; you have to get to the target without anything like charge.

In areas/duels? Ret is amazing. This is a list for bgs though.

I disagree with hpally too but oh well. Let people dream!
Click to expand...
Yeah, that's what I was talking about. Ret beats literally everything by the second hoj if played right (some ppl say except for hunter but like just los properly and you'll beat hunters too.)

From a BG only pov they could probably be moved down one or even two, you right.
 
Demote Ret to B Tier on the Veteran list, and C Tier on the F2P list?
[doublepost=1595710389,1595710297][/doublepost]And as for HPal, I do believe they’re A Tier unless you have a specific reason against it. HoJ, Bubble, big burst heals, and they’re tanky.

I’m definitely open to an alternative point of view though!
 
Henry said:
Demote Ret to B Tier on the Veteran list, and C Tier on the F2P list?
Click to expand...
If we're only considering BGs, then yeah probably. Tence has the better answer though he has more experience.
[doublepost=1595710452,1595710403][/doublepost]
Henry said:
And as for HPal, I do believe they’re A Tier unless you have a specific reason against it. HoJ, Bubble, big burst heals, and they’re tanky.
Click to expand...
Hpal is the worst healer because it does the least damage of all the healers.

Being the worst of the best specs still puts you in A tier.
 
Y’all really put elemental shamans as C Tier lmao. I would love to hear why ele shamans are consider C tier?
 
Childishgankino said:
Y’all really put elemental shamans as C Tier lmao. I would love to hear why ele shamans are consider C tier?
Click to expand...

From a few posts up:


"Was on the fence with Shadow being B vs. C tier, but yes I think that's right, if only for the reason that overall, Shadow puts more pressure on the enemy team and enemy healers than a spec like Ele does with split dot pressure.

Ele has 2 major weaknesses: maelstrom generation and mana problems with off-heals. Earth Shock crits can do big damage, but it takes way too long to charge up enough maelstrom to use it consistently in important team fights. And the off-heals with Healing Surge are, on paper, significant - but the mana cost is so high for the Ele spec that you end up OOM after like 3 heals.

Overall, gaining Earth Shock but at the cost of Riptide, Unleash Life, etc. and the introduction of serious mana problems leaves it feeling very underwhelming to play."​


Probably could be B Tier for Vets, though...Anyone else agree?
[doublepost=1595711818,1595711642][/doublepost]Ret demoted to B on Vet list and C on F2P List.

Keeping Holy in A list unless anyone else agrees it should be demoted.
 
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