WSG Premade Discussion

[Jadyn]

I'd like to hear some opinions on how people would theorycraft a good WSG 10-man team, and how they'd run it. So, what's your dream team class-wise and what would be your general strategy? Or if you have multiple dream teams, what's a setup you'd be really interested in trying or think is odd, but might work?



Remember, this is mostly about theorycrafting, but we haven't all had the same experiences in WSG, premade or otherwise, so be cautious about how you critique each other's ideas. Lets keep things hypothetical. =)



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My ideal setup atm would be:

Group 1

FC Druid

Resto Druid

Disc/Holy Priest

Holy Paladin or Mage

MM/Surv Hunter



Group 2

Resto Shaman

Sub Rogue

Sub Rogue

MM/Surv Hunter

Fire Mage



Group 1 runs the flag, Group 2 supports or covers midfield as necessary. If bogged down in midfield early on, both druids kitty stealth and continue on to grab flag, and both groups rez and meet them in midfield. Priority is getting the flag and escaping across midfield. Returning the flag is secondary priority.



If both teams have the enemy flag in their own base, Group 2 goes to return the flag. If the enemy has more than 4 on defense with the flag, then 1 player from Group 1 goes with them. If they have more than 6 on defense, then two players from Group 1 go. Which players depends on what they have on offense. If they have zero healers on O, the hunter can go with Group 2. If they have healers, the priest can go with Group 2 and help with dps. Though if they have retadins, it's best for the priest to stay with the FC until the Assault debuff goes up.



On offense, the resto shaman provides support purging, dps, and totems, switching to healing when necessary. The rogues go in first with saps, then stunlock the EFC while the hunter and mage provide burst dps. For CC, one rogue is paired with the mage and one rogue is paired with the hunter for rotating CCs, allowing them to lock down 2 players consistently and for a long duration.



Obviously, a good team will do their best to disrupt these plans, so a lot of it comes down to improvisation. Imho, this class composition is very versatile in what it can do in almost any situation, sporting one of every healing class, lots of different kinds of CC, and a balance of ranged and melee dps.

 

[Riot]

My personal favorite team would be.



Defence-

Fc warrior

Resto Druid

Survival/Marks hunter

Priest



Offence-

Warlock

Retadin

Rogue

Marks/Survival hunter

Priest

Warrior or Rogue



The defence would all go get the flag, the warrior goes and picks up. Then if there are people in therethe hunter lays frost trap to slow them, they make it across the field then own the opposing offence with cc and dos frost. The hunter the priest is a dispeller, and the Druids hits and roots and faerie fire win the game.



The offence starts in mid killing the opposing teams flag carrior and support team. If they can kill the fc they might be able to get a quick and easy cap. If not they pressure their team to have to get off their mount to heal or fiht back.

If the opposing flag carrier makes I to the other side the rogues sap and hunter keeps aimed shot up the rogues can cc the healers and dos the fc he priest is there just for dispels if needed warlock just chain fears the healers and dots the fc up and everyone else.



Easy win 3-0 alliance win!

 

[Riot]

My personal favorite team would be.



Defence-

Fc warrior

Resto Druid

Survival/Marks hunter

Priest



Offence-

Warlock

Retadin

Rogue

Marks/Survival hunter

Priest

Warrior or Rogue



The defence would all go get the flag, the warrior goes and picks up. Then if there are people in therethe hunter lays frost trap to slow them, they make it across the field then own the opposing offence with cc and dos frost. The hunter the priest is a dispeller, and the Druids hits and roots and faerie fire win the game.



The offence starts in mid killing the opposing teams flag carrior and support team. If they can kill the fc they might be able to get a quick and easy cap. If not they pressure their team to have to get off their mount to heal or fiht back.

If the opposing flag carrier makes I to the other side the rogues sap and hunter keeps aimed shot up the rogues can cc the healers and dos the fc he priest is there just for dispels if needed warlock just chain fears the healers and dots the fc up and everyone else.



Easy win 3-0 alliance win!

 

[Naturaltalnt]

I have never been a fan of the 5 group 5 group.



In WSG its either the 8 Midfield 2 Offense, the only time the O group increases is if they have defense, and depending on how much.



Midfield is suppose to halt any horde from getting across, but primiary targets are oppenents FCs.



If both teams have the flag some how, 7D 3O, this changes depending on their set up.

 

[Druiddroid]

group 1

FC mage, resto druid support or FC druid and holy paladin support



group 2

2 healers (priests/druid preferrable due to movement)

a shaman for purges and whatever else

a hunter for tracking and dps purposes

3 rogues



group 3



2 mages, with 2 sets, poly and FB spamming

groups 1 and 2 stick together until the FC is safe, then group 2 goes on offense. group 1 stays in base. group 3 stays at mid and goes to group 1 or 2 (depending on what's needed) if they have nothing to do.

 

[Evernex]

ive never done a premade ever so any game with imbad is auto win most of the time

 

[Naturaltalnt]

Clearly you need some FC defense twinks

 

[Alnielro]

Right, I'll be doing this from the Alliance side as that can effect the tactics used somewhat with regards to racials. I would appreciate any feedback on this with regards to talents and specs as I'm fairly new to this game in some regards and haven't explored a lot of classes and how the talent trees differ.



Group One - Offense

Druid / Restoration / Flag carrier

Paladin / Retribution / Support

Warlock / Affliction / Crowd Control

Priest / Discipline and Holy / Crowd Control and Healer



Group Two - Midfield

Druid / Balance / Support

Rogue / Combat / Support



Group Three

Hunter / ? / Defense

Hunter / ? / Defense

Rogue / Subtlety / Defense

Mage / ? / Defense



Tactics

Group One - Offense

Druid being the obvious choice for FC as things like Polymorph and Frost Nova don't effect them like they do other classes. They also have HoTs and ridiculous armour and health in Bear Form. The Paladin is there as Support. They heal if the priest dies, Blessing of Freedom if Druid gets slowed, and annihilates any clothies that try to get past on the way to the FC. Paladins also have the Judgement that slows people down to walk speed which can be useful against Rogues and players on mounts. The Warlock is there for Crowd Control, Seduction and Fear, and for the possible long haul by DoTing everything in sight. Finally the Priest who is the main Healer, has Crowd Control and also has some DPS if needed.



Group Two - Midfield

The Druid and Rogue basically run around midfield taking out small pockets of enemy players and helping with offense and defense when needed. A good twink Rogue (depending on cooldowns) can take 2 or 3 others on if they get the drop. Sap one, Magic Dust (an item that I believe puts someone to sleep for so many seconds) one and stun lock the other. This is assuming people really want to spend money on Magic Dust. I'm not sure so much about the Rogue talent trees and how they work in regards to DPS as I believe the midfield rogue should put out more damage and shouldn't need Subtlety so much, which is why I placed the Rogue as Combat. But then again Assassination or Subtlety could work as well, feedback on this would be good. The Druid will be using Prowl until needed, or can be on the mount as bait and to catch other mounted players. The Druid can spam the 1.5s Improved Wrath they get and can do some serious damage with it. While 2 Rogues are good in midfield for stun locking, I used a Druid as they have the ability to stop enemy FCs but also to add their own HoTs to your FC. They can also chase down anything without a mount and are more resistant to snare effects.



Group Three - Defense

I'm stuck as to what talents the Hunters should use. Marksmanship gives them the bow damage and crits, but they get Scatter Shot with Survival. And then whatever Beast Mastery gives them at that level. At least one of the Hunters should be a Night Elf for Shadowmeld, especially if their pet has Prowl. If they don't they should make sure they park their pet a little away from where they Shadowmeld or a Rogue might sneak in. I'd say this one would be better as Marksmanship as it's more DPS/crit based and one of them just popping out of nowhere would just plainly suck for the offense. One of the hunters will (obviously) have Track Humanoids up, and I believe Hunters get a Track Invisible? Constant Flares over the Flag and either the Flag Room or an entrance. Frost Traps near the Flag as well. The Rogue would be good as a Human for Perception and the extra Stealth from the Cloak enchantment can help. The last being a Mage. Depending on what they're specced and their play style will determine their job. Arcane you have survivability with extra armour and better mana consumption for your Mana Shield. They also have Improved Counterspell against healers and an instant Fireball or Frostbolt with Premeditation. Fire specs have Blast Wave for blowing back or apart groups. They have the stun proc (though it's a small percentage, it's still there) and just good ole DPS. Lastly, Frost specs just slow everyone down so the rest of the team can tear their offense a new one.



So that's about it. Let me know what you think, any suggestions are appreciated as long as they're constructive and you can put some reason behind it. Any tricks and tactics while playing these roles or knowledge you have on talents would be great. Also, if gear or items have a major impact on playing styles as well.



Thanks!

 

[Riot]

If you like always having 2 in mid I would have it either 2 warlocks or warlock balance Druid because they can dot super fast and Druid can root these dots could kill the opponent and also would get time for the defence to recoop having the opposing offence need to eat bandage or get healed. Just a thought

 

[Weiland]

Idealy I would have 2 people running into the enemy base to extract the flag and have the other 8 in mid preventing the opposing team from crossing mid and getting their FC into your base.



Druid Flag carrier

Resto Shaman (Earthbind, heals, Ghostwolf)



Mid:

Warlock

Hunter

Hunter

DPS Priest

Mage

Rogue

Holy Pally

DPS/Healer Hybrid (Balance Druid/Shaman/Ret with decent healing gear/another priest)



This lineup gives you every major buff. 1 Dedicated FC, 5 pure DPS, 2 pure healers, and 2 hybrids that could cover DPS or heals, at least 2 offensive dispelers, and at least 1 defensive dispeler.

Now if your end up in a situation where both teams have the flag I would split up the same team like this:



Offense:

Warlock (tongues on healers, constant pressure on everyone with dots)

Mage (sheep + burst)

Hunter (aimed shot on the FC)

Rogue (CC on healers, wound/crip and stuns to lock the FC in place)

Resto Shaman (Heals, totems, and purge on the FC)



Defense:

FC Druid

Holy Paly (main heals)

DPS Priest (really a hybrid, focus on keeping magic off everyone, bubbles on FC, then dps or heal as needed)

Hunter (tracking, flares, traps, main defensive dps)

DPS Hybrid (heal/dps as needed)





With the recent buffs to hybrid calsses, i'm tempted to say the more the better. It's so easy for Holy Priests/Balance Druids/Elemental Shaman to switch from doing masive dps, to masive heals. They can adapt to what the situation needs without any trouble.



I think i'm trying extra hard to include a dps priest in the 10 man though because thats what I play . You lose out on having someone spaming improved mana burn on anything that moves, but I think having 2 hunters viper stinging, and a lock draining if need be, really makes up for it.

 

[Powerglove]

rogue, 2x holy pally, ret pally, prot pally/warrior, mage, lock, arms warrior, hunter, priest



offense team

priest (dispels/fear/heals)

rogue (cc/dps)

rogue/ret pally (lots of dps, can be replaced w/ ranged)

mage (cc/dps/counterspell)

holy paladin/resto shaman (holy pally is less imporant w/ a ret pally there for freedom, but having 12 seconds of uninterrupted healing is great. resto shaman for purges/tremor+wf)



defense team

arms warrior (dem shout + thunder clap trumps melee dps, and theyre good at cleaning up in groups)

fc prot pally/prot warrior

holy pally

warlock (fear spam/dots on everyone/tongues)

hunter (frost trap+2 freedoms = epic win)





I dont think having a druid to FC is as important in premades, where whoever has control of mid wins basically.

 

[jenif]

5 hunters, 1 priest, 2 healadins 1 ret paladin 1 rogue



ret paladin and hunters are on focus dps. the hunters watch each other for melee peels and the hemo rogue watches and supports them in peeling melee dps. between dismantle, cheap shot, kidney shot, imp gouge, blind, several frost traps and blessing of freedom the hunters should be immune to any melee focus. judgement of justice and 5 big dps will be more than enough spike dps to pick off the enemy healers one by one.



as far as strategy goes moving in one big zerg is the way to go. grab the enemy flag, wait midfield for the enemy to cross, return the flag, move back to base with hunters splitting to cover both exits so the enemy can't sneak it.

 

[Jadyn]

Heh, some interesting ideas. I think it'd be pretty interesting if we tried one or two of them too. I'll let you guys know if we do anything new or different any time. =D



But now that we've got a pretty good list of dream teams, lets throw a complication into the mix:



What would you run and how, if you were facing a superior force in midfield. In other words, what if you couldn't dominate midfield. So lets assume the other team is running Jenif's comp, or 5 warlocks or something, and you can't do the same. How would you build your team and how would you play the match if you couldn't sit in midfield and control it?



The idea behind this is that a lot of teams aim to control mid then run the flag. If both teams do this, one team is probably going to lose control of midfield. The trick then is what to do when that happens.



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My team and strat was based off of what we ran in my guild when we started fighting our first 10v10s. At the time, the other guild pretty much always won contests for midfield control, so we had to come up with a way to avoid that type of a battle.



So same as I had before,

Group 1

FC Druid

Resto Druid

Disc/Holy Priest

Holy Paladin or Mage

MM/Surv Hunter



Group 2

Resto Shaman

Sub Rogue

Sub Rogue

MM/Surv Hunter

Fire Mage



This time, all 10 go with the flag, and return to base, before heading back to return the flag.

 

[Riot]

If they were controling mid the mid would go in the alliance ramp and wait for them to come to them. Because then they would get the first hit. Or just all gang up on 1 single person. So you kill that one fast then move to the next target.

 

[DevinS]

Group 1 - Defense

Fc druid

Cc mage

Priest x2

Hunter - If their O is really good a hunter with extra peels is leet



Group 2 - Offense

Priest - Offensive dispel, Fear their healers if Fc is low or get them to blow trinket so Lock can come in with a fear.

Shaman - Totems, Purjs, and heals if the priest is busy with dispels

Warrior - Slows, Can do massive burst

Warlock - Fears to Cc healers, Also can put out massive damage

Rogue - Plain old smash your face in...



Even though this setup is very situationial with a hunter on D it's still my favorite setup.

 

[elocon]

ZERG ftw!

I whould play a zerg team, where all go for flag in start and go for other teams flag on backway. Then keep going that way.

The principle is that you are stronger together.

1 FC

4 Healers/Assist

2 CC/DPS

3 Randoms with Brust dmg (And all classies have have assist skills too like off-heal or CC)



For example:

FC- Feral Druid

Heal/Assist- Disc Priest

Holy Paladin

Resto Shaman

Resto Druid

CC/Off-dps- Survival Hunter

Frost Mage

Brust- Arms Warrior

Fire Mage

Sub Rogue



Now when theres no Healing+ and Damage+, Healers can help finish other flag carrier when they dont got other things to do. I tell you, one mindblast, moonfire, Judgement and/or Earth shock work just fine. The Brust also stack up great when no healer got anything more important than get the last 1k hp(?) of their FC.

 

[Jadyn]

What about this idea for handling a team with midfield control?



Small group on flag room D, like say Rogue, Mage, Priest. Lock down any sort of attempt that isn't backed up by their whole team.



The other 7 hit the enemy base enmass, getting the druid FC to the flag, who then meets them in midfield as the ones who died on the way there rez.

 

[Titanhart]

i guess i'd play...



Defense: (base/ramp)

Ret Pally - Judgement of Justice, and stun, 15% speed, and good survivability.

Hunter - tracking, frost trap, conc shot, and potentially aimed shot.



when together this 2 person base-D can easily seperate a FC from guards (keeping guards trapped behind a corner, and letting FC get some distance away) and both can put out great dmg.



Midfield:

Warlock - curse of exhaustion, DoTs, fear spam, and felhunter counterspell.

holy Pally - tagged with warlock

Arms Warrior - controlled burst.

Rogue - annoying clothies.

Resto Druid - tagged with warrior and rogue



idea here is that this rather small-average size midfield group can sustain them selves for a long time. with the holy pally + warlock working as a team within a team, tagged together so the pally can keep lock up. same thing with the druid + warrior + rogue team within a team. to completely maximize, pally and druid heal each other, but thats an extra bonus. also this team backs up FC-team.



if i was creating a quick strike midfield team (a team that never travels without any1 else in the team. they are completely glued to each other. if after an engagment, some people are left dead, then regrouping is important) this team's main priority is to strike and disrupt other teams zerging and grouping attempts.



Rogue

Rogue

Hunter

Holy Pally

Mage



idea is that rogues and hunter peel open clothies very fast. mage to whoop out CCs on healers, counterspell, sheeping, quick-sheeps. Mage's frost nova + Pally's stun to help rogues get ontop of ppl.



FC team:

Prot Pally - AGM, Divine Protection, pvpTrinket, Stoneform/human racial, Lay on Hands, Stun and Judgment of Justice keeps pets/rogues off. Hand of Freedom, Purify,

Shaman - totem spam, frost shock spam, earth shock to cs D.

Priest - fear, dispell, power word shield, healz.



FC with lots of survivability allows shaman and priest time to stop healing to disrupt attackers.



theres very little commenting on peoples dream-teams in this thread, so im willing to encourage yall to make a start on mine. =)

 

[Druiddroid]

What would you run and how, if you were facing a superior force in midfield. In other words, what if you couldn't dominate midfield. So lets assume the other team is running Jenif's comp, or 5 warlocks or something, and you can't do the same. How would you build your team and how would you play the match if you couldn't sit in midfield and control it?



The idea behind this is that a lot of teams aim to control mid then run the flag. If both teams do this, one team is probably going to lose control of midfield. The trick then is what to do when that happens.

i heard that one team beat another team that owned them in mid by placing two AE spamming mages at midfield. it worked because it did really well against the tight opposing midfield group and they eventually won the game.



personally i think that distractions like that really help rather than trying to get everyone in your group into one area. if their team encounters yours, it's bad news. staying in a tight group of 10 is the worst thing you can do IMO.

 

[Jadyn]

i heard that one team beat another team that owned them in mid by placing two AE spamming mages at midfield. it worked because it did really well against the tight opposing midfield group and they eventually won the game.



personally i think that distractions like that really help rather than trying to get everyone in your group into one area. if their team encounters yours, it's bad news. staying in a tight group of 10 is the worst thing you can do IMO.

Well, there's a difference between being a tight group and all going the same direction. Any smart team should be spread out at least a little bit in most situations (obviously, melee focusing one target is an exception).



And we did play a game once against a team that had two AE spamming mages sitting below our GY with healers. I think it was a 7-man, and our 4-5 players just ran around them, grabbed flag, and capped. But it wasn't really much of a strategic win, because they were more interested in farming the pugs than winning the game most of the time. =/