Why is Wall of the Dead > Gizmo's Hypertech Buckler?

[scytale]

but as a twink, your winning ratio should be greater than 50%.



its like flipping a coin, as twinks, we have a better chance of landing a head(win), so in the long run, the amount of heads we get should be more than that of tails.

Have you never seen a horde twink in the same BG as you? That's about the only way I can imagine that your train of thought even made it from your head to the screen. I can quote completely worthless stats too....nice 152 EotS and SotA wins.



So back on topic, I've been rolling with Wall of the Dead over Gizlock's simply for the increased HP and mitigation on my ele shammy. As resto you really only have frost shock and EB totem to peel melee off and surviving that initial burst is necessary. If you're fighting melee then water shield provides more than enough mana to make up for the loss of 10 Int. Anyway you look at it, you can live without the "potentially lost" stats from either item. It's just 1 piece of gear that you can easily balance out from stats elsewhere.

 

[scytale]

how do you manage to win wsg 28/58=48% on your twinked out druid, 83/163=51% on your twinked out warrior

Wanted to also mention that if stats show anything significant, then it is for those that have a fairly balanced W/L ratio. Unless your Battlegroup is completely dominated by one faction then a twink that plays a lot of games should have near 50%. What I am trying to say is that this shows he does not just AFK or BG-hop out of losing games. If nothing else, that shows he's willing to stick out the good and bad games and those are the twinks that are really out for a good game.



edit: do not take the reverse logic from my post...someone with a really high W/L ratio does not necessarily afk out or get carried.

 

[Falkor]

If nothing else, that shows he's willing to stick out the good and bad games and those are the twinks that are really out for a good game.

yea i have honestly never /afk'd or intentionally bg hopped. i am more than willing to stick out the bad games to get some good fights against horde twinks.

 

[glancealot]

Unless your Battlegroup is completely dominated by one faction then a twink that plays a lot of games should have near 50%.

my friend, i would like to introduce you to binomial distribution.



assuming that you play every single game from beginning to end.



let's say if you are not a twink, lets say you are just an average joe (with average enchant/gear out of all the players, average skill out of all the players), then your winning ratio should be around 50% in the long run, because there are twinks on both sides, non-twinks on both sides.



however, when you are a twinked out character with average skills, you are above average, your team should win more than 50% (how much above 50%? depends on what average is in your battle group)



furthermore, if you are a twinked out character with exceptional skills, then your winning ratio should be even higher.



armory any good solo queuer, you will notice that they all have way above 50% winning ratios.



some do afk out of losing games, for example this guy his AB record is 148/148, so either he queues AB with 4+ guildies every single time or he afk's out of losing AB's. we cannot tell by looking at his reputation as he probably played AB before the stats system was out.

 

[Taitaih]

49s are a bracket where even the best of players can get torn down by two non twinked characters just purely because of the burst potential of the bracket. I remember non-twinked ret paladins when they first got their buffs. They could tear down a rogue to pieces.



I have met many good players with bad win ratios, and many bad players with good ones. Generally it might be a good way of telling, but until you actually play with them, don't judge.

 

[nosoup4crr]

lol @ binomial distribution.



what a dumdum.

 

[tweedledum]

Dum reporting in!

 

[Alkaholic]

my friend, i would like to introduce you to binomial distribution.



assuming that you play every single game from beginning to end.



let's say if you are not a twink, lets say you are just an average joe (with average enchant/gear out of all the players, average skill out of all the players), then your winning ratio should be around 50% in the long run, because there are twinks on both sides, non-twinks on both sides.



however, when you are a twinked out character with average skills, you are above average, your team should win more than 50% (how much above 50%? depends on what average is in your battle group)



furthermore, if you are a twinked out character with exceptional skills, then your winning ratio should be even higher.



armory any good solo queuer, you will notice that they all have way above 50% winning ratios.



some do afk out of losing games, for example this guy his AB record is 148/148, so either he queues AB with 4+ guildies every single time or he afk's out of losing AB's. we cannot tell by looking at his reputation as he probably played AB before the stats system was out.

Too bad binomial distribution doesn't take into account /afks, battleground imba, queue times, skill of ur team, skill of the other team, class representation, or anything relevant. It works fine if u're rolling a SIX sided die multiple times but what if everytime u rolled it, the number of sides changed? Or if u flip a coin and instead of getting heads or tails, sometimes it didn't even come down (/afks) or 2 coins fell and u couldn't catch either (premades).



Please understand the math before tossing out terms...

 

[Nait]

sux how one duesche can ruin a perfectly good thread by bashing somones W/L %

 

[Druiddroid]

and then people in their rage bash back the basher

 

[Falkor]

and then people in their rage bash back the basher

and the world goes 'round. thus is the circle of life!

 

[Maerduk]

I think I got too bored of this shit with all the debates over pallies/warr a couple months earlier. I skipped like 3 pages of rubbish and got to the last page and it was still some debate about stats rofl. Anyway I personally use gizlock's on my pally as holy, but truth be told I'm an mp whore. I love seeing my mana regen so fast that I can just keep spamming heals all day. Granted, 4 mp/5 isn't exactly an outrageous amount of mana regen but when stacked with other regen enchants/buffs it's quite noticeable collectively.



I have both giz's and wall of the dead and I just keep the dead laying around if I ever decide to make a prot/flag running set. The mitigation isn't exactly the greatest stat in the world as it applies to physical damage only, the proc rarely happens, and the majority of classes I have trouble with as a holy pally tend to be caster classes (ie especially ass clown mana burn spamming priests which makes mp/5 king). You can also argue block rating on the shield, but let's be honest how many blocks in a fight are you going to be gaining especially with redoubt being thrown so deep in the prot tree so it's no longer accessible in a holy build. I'm too lazy to do the math and I'd prefer see screens to prove it, rather than someone number crunching theoretical farce.



The majority of playing I've done in the 49 bracket on my pally has been as holy and I'd take gizlock's over wall of the dead any day.

 

[Taitaih]

Imo it all comes down to survivability and who you play (and don't play) with. I think both are fine shields, however neither of them save you from a guaranteed death if you have two many people on you. Wall of the Dead might prolong that death a little longer if you're going against melee, and Gizlock's if you're going against casters. If you're a healer and you get silenced, then you definitely want Wall of the Dead on.



I guess my final verdict on the situation:



Wall of the Dead still > Gizlock's. 330 Health (with +18 stam enchant) can easily make the difference. If you played during the fire festival 30 stam buff, you probably saw a great increase in survivability (at least I sure did)



If you're a healer, you're going to get targeted and focus fired or CCed immediately. In terms of surviving, Wall of the Dead is definitely superior. The only time I've gone oom on my paladin is when I'm Flag Carrying, and during that time I'm still wearing Wall of the Dead. If priests have enough time to mana burn during a BG, something's going wrong with your surrounding people. In a 1v1 situation, a priest should stomp you anyway because of mana burn.

 

[Alkaholic]

*stab stab*

 

[Dye]

Wall of Dead all the way. Wtf has this discussion lasted 4 pages? its an absolutely pointless discussion. Wall of Dead FTW and gizlock's FTL. end of discussion. goodbye.

 

[Kaanaa]

Thank you to everyone that contributed to the discussion.



To the ones who are completely off-topic, politely GTFO my thread. And Ugarak - incredibly helpful post as usual.



Kaanaa

Silver Hand

 

[Dye]

you needed an ass kicking.

Thank you to everyone that contributed to the discussion.



To the ones who are completely off-topic, politely GTFO my thread. And Ugarak - incredibly helpful post as usual.



Kaanaa

Silver Hand

well seeing how you asked the dumbest question over a shield that obviously you can look at and tell what is better, I could tell you needed a slight "get it got it good" from someone who can actually look at something, and then analyze it. Seeing how it took you 4 pages before you made your decision is pretty sad, and that you let the discussion reach 4 pages.

 

[Alkaholic]

Damn, be nice...lol

 

[Taitaih]

well seeing how you asked the dumbest question over a shield that obviously you can look at and tell what is better, I could tell you needed a slight "get it got it good" from someone who can actually look at something, and then analyze it. Seeing how it took you 4 pages before you made your decision is pretty sad, and that you let the discussion reach 4 pages.

Maybe if you actually took time to read the page, 2.5 of the pages are chok full of win/loss ratio bullshit and somewhat valuable discussion about ST bracers.



It's a valid question, not stupid. Not everyone has experience twinking here in 49s and realizes that survivability is important. If you were talking just pure healing then Gizlok is better. However a dead healer means no heals, and therefore Wall of the Dead is better in this situation.

 

[Kirise]

What Taitaih said. Plus, a few 49ers decide they don't need the extra survivability, and decide to slot for mana regen. Or they could simply change their chest enchant from +6 all stats to +150 hp to make up for the lower stam of Gizlock's. Choosing your gear is a matter of optimizing your stats by slot, and with so many slots, you can achieve the same stats through several different optimizations.



Ugarak, you've had people bring attitude and vinegar to threads of yours in the past. Please don't be the one who does that here -- promote the discussion instead.



Thank you,



Bwappo