Dedruid
Legend
I remember this, I sometimes mucked up and grabbed the wrong rank spell - but this does seem the best way to fix that all.
Things Blizz could implement at low levels
- Thread starter Stamm
- Start date
I remember this, I sometimes mucked up and grabbed the wrong rank spell - but this does seem the best way to fix that all.
Yndigo
Something funny
Yeah, i miss rank 1 frostbolt for example for that 1 second cast slow. Bring it back pls.
yasueh
OG
Ahh the days of spellbars full of all ranks of moonfire, and short cast frostbolts with a lot less damage, but the same slow.
Yeah, balancing really went to shit when they got rid of ranks. They must be using formulas or something, so the scaling is the same for everything, and they can't think "Ohh, class X is OP in bracket Y. Lets nerf spell Z a bit at that rank." No, instead they buff something that's weak at endgame, and the formula makes it OP across half the lower levels, where it's counter class/spell doesn't exist.
I'd have to say about the same number we had in 19s back in TBC. Enough to fill 1-0 and a few keys around WASD, without using modifiers or macros (so you can have everything on about half a dozen keys with modifiers and macros). Add more and you end up making some abilities redundant compared to new ones, or having too much duplication of capability between classes. At endgame the number of abilities you have is just stupid. You regularly use only very few of them, and a lot of them only in very specific circumstances.
A good equivalent to rock-paper-scissors(-lizard-spock) between the classes, with every class having it's hard counter, combined with limiting numbers of any one class in a BG, could see much more strategy in BGs.
Or they could take another lesson from Firefall/FPS games. Let people change class during the game (something you can do with no levels/gear, and a hard PvE/PvP split). In Firefall there are battleframe stations in the spawning areas, so after you die, you can switch to another class. That way a team stacking one class gets countered by people respawning as it's counter.
Firefall and GW2 are also strictly against pay to win, instead having a lot of items that are either cosmetic or convenience only, like paint jobs, hats and headgear, pets, mounts, or temporary XP and resource gathering boosts. WoW is pay to win, not just because of F2P-vs-P2P, but because the longer you've subscribed, the more heirlooms and enchants you can throw at lower level PvP characters.
More custom gear, mounts and pets could be rewarded for gaining PvP ranks, and it doesn't need to have any stats on it, or give any advantage. It should be "I get to wear this because I kick ass", not "I get to kick ass because I wear this".
Right now every expansion sees a crap-ton of PvE gear, new mounts, pets and vanity items from PvE, but PvP only gets a single set of gear for each class, and mounts for being above a certain rating. PvP rewards just plain suck, and they aren't helped by having good PvPers walking around in PvE gear, instead of something that stands out as different from PvE gear, as well as what most PvPers wear.
No stats would mean full sets, and outfits that look good (provided Blizz can make some decent armor sets). Letting players customise the colors would help.
Yeah, balancing really went to shit when they got rid of ranks. They must be using formulas or something, so the scaling is the same for everything, and they can't think "Ohh, class X is OP in bracket Y. Lets nerf spell Z a bit at that rank." No, instead they buff something that's weak at endgame, and the formula makes it OP across half the lower levels, where it's counter class/spell doesn't exist.
I'd have to say about the same number we had in 19s back in TBC. Enough to fill 1-0 and a few keys around WASD, without using modifiers or macros (so you can have everything on about half a dozen keys with modifiers and macros). Add more and you end up making some abilities redundant compared to new ones, or having too much duplication of capability between classes. At endgame the number of abilities you have is just stupid. You regularly use only very few of them, and a lot of them only in very specific circumstances.
A good equivalent to rock-paper-scissors(-lizard-spock) between the classes, with every class having it's hard counter, combined with limiting numbers of any one class in a BG, could see much more strategy in BGs.
Or they could take another lesson from Firefall/FPS games. Let people change class during the game (something you can do with no levels/gear, and a hard PvE/PvP split). In Firefall there are battleframe stations in the spawning areas, so after you die, you can switch to another class. That way a team stacking one class gets countered by people respawning as it's counter.
Firefall and GW2 are also strictly against pay to win, instead having a lot of items that are either cosmetic or convenience only, like paint jobs, hats and headgear, pets, mounts, or temporary XP and resource gathering boosts. WoW is pay to win, not just because of F2P-vs-P2P, but because the longer you've subscribed, the more heirlooms and enchants you can throw at lower level PvP characters.
More custom gear, mounts and pets could be rewarded for gaining PvP ranks, and it doesn't need to have any stats on it, or give any advantage. It should be "I get to wear this because I kick ass", not "I get to kick ass because I wear this".
Right now every expansion sees a crap-ton of PvE gear, new mounts, pets and vanity items from PvE, but PvP only gets a single set of gear for each class, and mounts for being above a certain rating. PvP rewards just plain suck, and they aren't helped by having good PvPers walking around in PvE gear, instead of something that stands out as different from PvE gear, as well as what most PvPers wear.
No stats would mean full sets, and outfits that look good (provided Blizz can make some decent armor sets). Letting players customise the colors would help.
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The Saint
I won't like you
r1 healing touch, with glyph of healing touch saved my ass countless times.
yasueh
OG
1. Remove hit rating and miss chance.
2. Remove soulbinding (of course, this means anything can be sold).
3. Instead of having PvP and PvE servers, make it so that there are PvP and PvE zones. Raids and dungeons would be in PvE zones. All the game's best resources and gear drops would be in PvP zones (including all the best raiding gear. Raid bosses would only drop stuff like enchanting and crafting materials).
4. You could still be killed by other players in PvE zones, the only difference from PvP zones is a bunch of NPCs show up and kill you if you start a fight, or do anything to help someone who starts a fight.
5. When you're killed, 50% of your gear and anything in your inventory is destroyed. The rest is dropped as loot (In PvE zones the people who contributed to the kill can pick it up without consequences. If anyone else picks it up, people can kill them without an NPC response).
The result?
EVE Online players stop thinking of even the most hardcore WoW PvPers as gaming's biggest bunch of pussies.
Low levels get to group up and gank level 95's, steal half their gear, and make them cry.
2. Remove soulbinding (of course, this means anything can be sold).
3. Instead of having PvP and PvE servers, make it so that there are PvP and PvE zones. Raids and dungeons would be in PvE zones. All the game's best resources and gear drops would be in PvP zones (including all the best raiding gear. Raid bosses would only drop stuff like enchanting and crafting materials).
4. You could still be killed by other players in PvE zones, the only difference from PvP zones is a bunch of NPCs show up and kill you if you start a fight, or do anything to help someone who starts a fight.
5. When you're killed, 50% of your gear and anything in your inventory is destroyed. The rest is dropped as loot (In PvE zones the people who contributed to the kill can pick it up without consequences. If anyone else picks it up, people can kill them without an NPC response).
The result?
EVE Online players stop thinking of even the most hardcore WoW PvPers as gaming's biggest bunch of pussies.
Low levels get to group up and gank level 95's, steal half their gear, and make them cry.
Kincaide
Legend
Do you think perhaps this goes a little beyond the scope of the original question? You're practically talking about a whole new game. While that's an interesting mental exercise, it doesn't really address the question of what little things could be done to make the best of the game we already have.
yasueh
OG
Well considering that what Bliz could implement at low levels entirely falls into the realm of fantasy, I don't see any problem with exploring that realm to it's full extent.
The things that Bliz might be willing to do however, are pretty non existant, so I'm drawing a blank on what to say about them.
The things that Bliz might be willing to do however, are pretty non existant, so I'm drawing a blank on what to say about them.
Kincaide
Legend
You come across a lot of the time as basically hating Blizzard and proselytizing for other games, but, wouldn't you agree that the re-implementation Spell/Ability ranks would be one potential change that they could make, and that that would be an effective way to resolve some of our issues?
I expect you to reply with something along the lines of "They could but they won't so this is pointless" but remember, they did implement level scaling, so somebody up there is paying attention to non-end-game PvP.
yasueh
OG
Could, not would. Blizzard have a long history of not going back on changes they make, regardless of how poorly thought out or badly implemented they are. They are also one of the poorest developers out there when it comes to iteration. They don't fix a lot of things, and if they do it takes them months or even years, where other devs release fixes in weeks, or even days.
I have the highest respect for the Blizzard developers who made the original WoW, and worked on the first couple of expansions. WoW changed the face of video gaming by making it mass market, in a way no other games has. However, Blizzard as they are now are what's called gameplay zealots. They have no real interest in working on anything outside of just one playstyle, endgame raiding, and simply do not do much at all to develop the rest of the game.
I'm sick of seeing other games released, where the developers really do care about their players, listen to them, respond to their requests, and go out of their way to make the game that as many of their players want as possible. The developers of those games achieve so much more than Blizzard, with far, far less resources at their disposal, and they deserve people's attention. WoW doesn't. It's a has-been, with more of a maintainance crew than a proper dev team, and they're hidden away behind a tight knit PR department so you can't ask them anything, or get any real information out of them.
I really love computer games, and I still love WoW, but that's because of what it was, and what it could be. I'm not going to kid myself. No matter how many players, and how much money the game gets, it's going nowhere, and not doing anything to improve computer gaming any more. Instead I'm going to support the games and developers that I see, who are doing what Blizzard did when they first made WoW. Revolutionising gaming with new ideas and better versions of the existing ones, instead of making poor copies of other people's ideas, and just relying on existing popularity and market visibility to suck much needed support away from everyone else.
And yes, Blizzard did implement level scaling. I made that suggestion on their forums at least 2 years ago. Since then I've seen both Rift and GW2 come out, with great implementations of it right from the start. Meanwhile Blizzard's implementation is a very poor copy, and there's no indication that they're making any real effort to fix the problems with it.
Other developers think along the lines of "If we fix this, people will play it." Blizzard think "People aren't playing this, so we won't fix it."
I have the highest respect for the Blizzard developers who made the original WoW, and worked on the first couple of expansions. WoW changed the face of video gaming by making it mass market, in a way no other games has. However, Blizzard as they are now are what's called gameplay zealots. They have no real interest in working on anything outside of just one playstyle, endgame raiding, and simply do not do much at all to develop the rest of the game.
I'm sick of seeing other games released, where the developers really do care about their players, listen to them, respond to their requests, and go out of their way to make the game that as many of their players want as possible. The developers of those games achieve so much more than Blizzard, with far, far less resources at their disposal, and they deserve people's attention. WoW doesn't. It's a has-been, with more of a maintainance crew than a proper dev team, and they're hidden away behind a tight knit PR department so you can't ask them anything, or get any real information out of them.
I really love computer games, and I still love WoW, but that's because of what it was, and what it could be. I'm not going to kid myself. No matter how many players, and how much money the game gets, it's going nowhere, and not doing anything to improve computer gaming any more. Instead I'm going to support the games and developers that I see, who are doing what Blizzard did when they first made WoW. Revolutionising gaming with new ideas and better versions of the existing ones, instead of making poor copies of other people's ideas, and just relying on existing popularity and market visibility to suck much needed support away from everyone else.
And yes, Blizzard did implement level scaling. I made that suggestion on their forums at least 2 years ago. Since then I've seen both Rift and GW2 come out, with great implementations of it right from the start. Meanwhile Blizzard's implementation is a very poor copy, and there's no indication that they're making any real effort to fix the problems with it.
Other developers think along the lines of "If we fix this, people will play it." Blizzard think "People aren't playing this, so we won't fix it."
MarzRider
Legend
......
Steps out of stormwind/org. Boom ganked by multiple rogues. Sick there went my arena gear I just spent 3 months getting.
So in other words, dont go anywhere outside of your factions main city.
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yasueh
OG
Kincaide
Legend
There are brothels in Goldshire, you're just not looking on the right server. You deviant!
MarzRider
Legend
Guess ill have to strike it rich first.
Nickgoodfield
Legend
Just Put back Skirmish already and It will be fine.
Zatox
OG
Just to clear some things up people mentioned about my Ranked spells idea, I believe you should only be able to use your current ranked spell, rather then allowing r1 usage. Certain classes benefitted far too much from it back in the day, and would be the same now. Mages, for example, would obliterate any current melee class with r1 bolt slow.
Nakedplumber
Tink
It needz to bcum liek call of duty liek a fps
Sweetluvin
Krew
Skirmish + Rated arena
Add on with certain rules, like no double healer comps or two of the same class.
Plus, a separate bracket for Wizard comps only