Shaman or Priest for 2's?

Torny

OG
So I was thinking about which to make for a healer (Priest) or healer/dps hybrid (Shaman) for 2's and pugs Gulches. So I broke it down on what both classes bring to the table in 2's arena:



Shaman:

Ranged Interrupt

Snare

More Dps

Larger burst heal

Harder to Burst down

Bandage Interrupt (Flame Shock)

Purge

(Soon to be) Ghost wolf





Priest:

PW: Shield

Renew

Fear

More mana

Dispell

Bandage Interrupt (SW: Pain)



Am I missing something? Because from what I can see I don't see why Priest is the norm. Sure, if a priest's may have been better before hp nerf and spirit nerf which severely hurt the length of 2's matches, but now matches can be over in a quick burst. And I'd take melee flametongue attacks and flameshock over wands and SW pain any day.



The Shaman has a snare, and a ranged interrupt both of which are very important assets. And with Ghost Wolf coming they will be practically untouchable.
 
shaman.

and you see priests as the norm because priests are easy to be decent at and hard to be great at.

shamans are harder to be decent at (but still not hard.)
 
Depends on who your partner is.



A Priest cant snare, but can remove snares and CC from his partner. A shammy has to run into melee to attack, making switching targets really easy for the opponents DPS. A Priest can HoT and Shield, and possibly escape combat to drink (when partnered with mage, etc), while a shammy has to be constantly healing, so they get really limited regen.



A Shammy cant afford to LoS his partner for long, while a priest can. Which means a priest can generally fare better at healing himself and his partner when fighting a hunter/healer combo, as he can los the hunter and doesnt *immediately* have to come back out from LoS to heal his partner when the hunter changes targets. And hunters are all too popular these days.



By all means, both are great. Each offer certain advantages. I wouldnt be so quick to dismiss priests just because of regen nerfs. Priests are just more effective at healing, while shammies are more effective at pressuring opponents.
 
darzk said:
Depends on who your partner is.



A Priest cant snare, but can remove snares and CC from his partner. A shammy has to run into melee to attack, making switching targets really easy for the opponents DPS. A Priest can HoT and Shield, and possibly escape combat to drink (when partnered with mage, etc), while a shammy has to be constantly healing, so they get really limited regen.



A Shammy cant afford to LoS his partner for long, while a priest can. Which means a priest can generally fare better at healing himself and his partner when fighting a hunter/healer combo, as he can los the hunter and doesnt *immediately* have to come back out from LoS to heal his partner when the hunter changes targets. And hunters are all too popular these days.



By all means, both are great. Each offer certain advantages. I wouldnt be so quick to dismiss priests just because of regen nerfs. Priests are just more effective at healing, while shammies are more effective at pressuring opponents.
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Yeah but with a good team (say priest/hunter vs. shaman/hunter which is very common now-a-days) if the shaman knows his tremors and the hunter keeps the priest clipped the armor combined with stoneclaw/stoneskin drop sequence once the priest has used his fear duing a tremor. Lets the hunter and shaman rip the priest apart by purging everything he has and shocking his heals.
 
You cant just assume someone will **** up, which is definately what fearing while tremor is down would be classified as. But yes, shammy generally has the advantage over priest when they come head-to-head.



The priest should generally be trying to stay *out* of melee with the hunter to prevent the situation you just described, and it would be very difficult for the shammies hunter to run into melee with the priest - doing so would put thier team on the defensive as the shammy would have to be healing the hunter, and thus cant be purging the priest... but yeah, I conceded the point in the first sentance.
 
Depends on your own class.



Priests' biggest advantage, which should not be taken lightly, is the defensive Dispel. While both Priest and Shaman can get rid of your opponent's buffs, only Priests can dispel all those horrible things that could put you both in a lot of trouble (Fears, Sheeps, Roots, CC, DoTs.) Any team that doesn't have a Priest has to respect the fact that they can't get rid of CC (other than trinket and, in this case, Totem - which is not ideal.)

Also, a well timed Fear can end the game just as quickly as a ES-Stomp-ES. Shamans have no abilities that actually cause Loss of Control. It's a really powerful ability, especially when it's instant!



I've actually been seeing a lot more Shamans popping up in the Arenas. I think it's easy to be a 'decent' Shaman or Priest, though 'decent' priests don't even know how to dispel and have a lot less to lose than a 'decent' shaman - at least they can figure out that melee attacks will do damage.



I'll run through my personal opinion on which would be better in each case:



Warrior: Priest. You need the utility, and with Hamstring the Priest should be able to exploit his freedom more than Shamans - they get in melee range anyway. Shaman's EB will also be fairly useless here.

Priest: Shaman

Shaman: Priest

Mage: For the same reason as Warlocks, the CC that the Mage provides will compliment the Priest's favor of long distances. Between Fear and Sheep, you should be able to completely lock down one opponent. I've had a lot of success with this matchup.

Warlock: Priest (read up)

Druid: Shaman. They compliment eachother well, though Druids don't really work in 2s in any matchup. I suppose their high survivability is better suited for this team than a Priests.

Hunter: Shaman. This is often said to be the King of 2s. The offensive capabilities are just brutal. Priest/Hunter is great too, though.

Rogue: Tough call. I've had a lot of success with Rogue/Priest, but a well coordinated Rogue/Shaman team can destroy almost anything else. With Kicks, Gouges, Shocks and EBs, it's hard to pass up that kind of burst potential. Often an untrinketed Sap will give the two enough time to down their partner and the game will already be over. Priest/Rogue is a bit more 'contained', and I think has a better matchup against certain teams than the other.



Really though, it's up to what you're comfortable with. If you want a more bursty, offensive feel then gogo Shaman. If you want a more manipulative, control-the-field sort of game, /love Priest.
 
Böne said:
Yeah but with a good team (say priest/hunter vs. shaman/hunter which is very common now-a-days) if the shaman knows his tremors and the hunter keeps the priest clipped the armor combined with stoneclaw/stoneskin drop sequence once the priest has used his fear duing a tremor. Lets the hunter and shaman rip the priest apart by purging everything he has and shocking his heals.
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These sort of tactics are exactly why it is probably harder to be 'great' at a priest, as Bone said. If they don't know how to react to solid offense and snares, they'll be dead really fast. Shamans at least can fight back :p
 
darzk said:
You cant just assume someone will **** up, which is definately what fearing while tremor is down would be classified as. But yes, shammy generally has the advantage over priest when they come head-to-head.



The priest should generally be trying to stay *out* of melee with the hunter to prevent the situation you just described, and it would be very difficult for the shammies hunter to run into melee with the priest - doing so would put thier team on the defensive as the shammy would have to be healing the hunter, and thus cant be purging the priest... but yeah, I conceded the point in the first sentance.
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Suprisingly if the priest got the fear off and the shaman DIDN'T have the termor down then its a shaman fuck up not a priest pro move. A shaman should not be retarded and atleast have some kind of CD watcher so that they can see when the priest has fear again. and once they do... whenever in fear range and on the priest... practically spamming tremor (not actually spamming but it feels like it sometimes.)



You are right though that a priest should be getting out of the way in this kind of match up... but it is pretty easy to trap some1 in something as small as an arena with 2 people.
 
Torny said:
So I was thinking about which to make for a healer (Priest) or healer/dps hybrid (Shaman) for 2's and pugs Gulches. So I broke it down on what both classes bring to the table in 2's arena:



Shaman:

Ranged Interrupt

Snare

More Dps

Larger burst heal

Harder to Burst down

Bandage Interrupt (Flame Shock)

Purge

(Soon to be) Ghost wolf





Priest:

PW: Shield

Renew

Fear

More mana

Dispell

Bandage Interrupt (SW: Pain)



Am I missing something? Because from what I can see I don't see why Priest is the norm. Sure, if a priest's may have been better before hp nerf and spirit nerf which severely hurt the length of 2's matches, but now matches can be over in a quick burst. And I'd take melee flametongue attacks and flameshock over wands and SW pain any day.



The Shaman has a snare, and a ranged interrupt both of which are very important assets. And with Ghost Wolf coming they will be practically untouchable.
Click to expand...



Imo you should 100% go Shaman, even if there heals are not as powerfull the offer alot more servivability and offensive play style.
 
Quara said:
Rogue: Tough call. I've had a lot of success with Rogue/Priest, but a well coordinated Rogue/Shaman team can destroy almost anything else. With Kicks, Gouges, Shocks and EBs, it's hard to pass up that kind of burst potential. Often an untrinketed Sap will give the two enough time to down their partner and the game will already be over. Priest/Rogue is a bit more 'contained', and I think has a better matchup against certain teams than the other.



Really though, it's up to what you're comfortable with. If you want a more bursty, offensive feel then gogo Shaman. If you want a more manipulative, control-the-field sort of game, /love Priest.
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For Rogue, it is a tough call indeed. Shaman/Rogue have basically nonstop interrupts but I find that the shaman's incrdedibly slow heal & lack of a HoT cripples their healing capability a bit much.



If you don't know what you're facing a Priest is probably the safer option aswell, providing a fair bit more survivability.
 
Ummmm go shammy all the way. YOU CAN PURGE AGM!!!! that alone should say something. I can kill ANY class 1v1 no prob except maybe, maybe a very good rogue. Shammy can kite much better as well, and the heals are HUGE! I would say shaman/lock is a deadly combo, me and a guildy lock (not even fully finished yet) did arena today and DEMOLISHED everything, all combos. pally/shammy, rogue/priest, no problem. Keep ur totems in check tho, time tremor, etc. I can crit heal on lock 850 which is more than enough, and cure poison is an underrated spell, since it means a free bandage, and shaman are less squishy.

Having said all that, roll shaman, especially after 3.2, unless you enjoy being completely shut down by that shaman/lock, shaman/hunter combo for some reason.

:D
 
Lawlpurge said:
Ummmm go shammy all the way. YOU CAN PURGE AGM!!!! that alone should say something.
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How is this a reason to pick Shaman when the discussion is about Priest or Shaman? You're aware Priests can dispel AGM, right?
 
Lawlpurge said:
Rly? I wasnt aware. Purge tooltip says it "removes helpful effects from enemies" like AGM. I didnt know if AGM was considered a "magic" effect. Soooo either all the priests i've played against were scrubs and didnt know this either, since ive never gotten mine dispelled by a priest. kthxbai
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They were all scrubs.
 
Purge: "Purges the enemy target, removing 1 beneficial magic effect."



Dispel is the number one move that shows you how much of a noob a Priest is, for whatever reason it never seems to dawn on the bad ones just how powerful a move it is.
 
Ertai said:
Purge: "Purges the enemy target, removing 1 beneficial magic effect."



Dispel is the number one move that shows you how much of a noob a Priest is, for whatever reason it never seems to dawn on the bad ones just how powerful a move it is.
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In pugs I usually throw a renew up or even dot them just to test if they're bads. works wonders
 
Quara said:
In pugs I usually throw a renew up or even dot them just to test if they're bads. works wonders
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It sucked when they took away Rank 1 Renew. It was so useful if you could get people to keep dispelling it.
 
shamans are superior in almost every way for 2v2 and 1v1s but priests are a lot more of an asset in 3s/5s/and play a bigger role in warsong gulch.
 
Ertai said:
It sucked when they took away Rank 1 Renew. It was so useful if you could get people to keep dispelling it.
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Yeah, downranking was the bomb. Cloaking your agm's and such with r1 pw:f, renew, fade, etc. Made +haste to Hat really good vs other good priests.



edit: lolandtouchofweakness..what a joke that was.
 
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