Rogue BiS (yes, again, hehe)

M4rk0s

Legend
hey guys, i know theres a couple of threads talking about BiS for rogues, but i couldn't get to the conclusion that i'm looking for.
first of all, sorry if my english is not that good, i'm a brazillian :S
my main doubt is about the weapons:
a dagger in the main hand will give a most powerfull ambush and allow you to use backstab but has a lower auto attack, am i right?
and a slower weapon (sword/mace) will give a weaker ambush but most powerfull auto-attacks and you'll have to use SS instead of backstab, right?
is the SS better than backstab? assuming your using a slow weapon...
please correct me if i'm wrong...

now about the off hand, should it be a fast weapon because of the instant poison?
wouldn't be better a slow weapon that gives me more AP, resulting in a most powerfull ambush and eviscerate?

below are a couple of combination i made at chardev, as you can see they all are hit capped and +40% crit to make sure that i'll always crit with my ambushs
another point about these combinations is that i don't care that much about stam/resi, i know i should but i just wanna have a big dps...

chardev 9
Slow sword MH, fast dagger OH

chardev 9
"Slow" dagger MH, fast dagger OH

chardev 9
"Slow" dagger MH, slow mace OH (now that i noticed that even using a slow OH i got slow ap, so my theory about best eviscerate sounds wrong :S)

Posting these here for a comparison

chardev 9
This is a BIS posted here at TwinkInfo by @kratos as you can see in this link http://www.twinkinfo.com/f40/24-twink-gear-guides-28719/

chardev 9
Sounds like blackvenom and the chest are no attainable anymore... Posted by @Leveltwentyfour at http://www.twinkinfo.com/f40/perfect-level-24-rogue-25334/

thanks in advance :)
 
Here's what I would consider to be BiS, although that term is highly situational but nonetheless this is what I would prefer to be wearing in most situations

chardev 9

and here is a breakdown of the reasons for the changes I made (in comparison to the perfect level 24 rogue link, with the gf items disregarded)

Reason for monkey over agility is that to me -3agi for +6stam just seems like a retarded thing not to take

Reason for stam over str on bracers is basically the same reason as above, I prefer 90 health over 9ap any day of the week

Reason for BOA over temple's is simple - hit cap.

Reason for scarlet kris over bangalash's claw is partly so I'm not too far over hit cap, and partly because I prefer the speed for those extra poison applications

Reason for Outlaw Sabre in mainhand is because it's the best slow main hand wep, and if you really want a big boom on your ambush you can make a macro that switches to Bangalash's claw for your ambush, and back to the sabre when you want to hit with SS, because getting behind people to stab them isn't ideal in PvP as many people learned when people started backing into walls to avoid mutilate.

Second part of the above paragraph is why I prefer SS over Backstab.

My reasoning behind the sludge caked throwing knives over the glass shooter, as much as I'll miss those extra stats, is because throwing knives when used properly can be damn useful. For landing that daze on the hunter who's cheetah'ing into the distance, for stopping that healer from drinking, for stopping that guy from bandaging away all the hard work you put into killing him.

And finally human over worgen because I prefer a 2nd AGM over 1% crit and a second sprint.

All of the above is just my personal preference, but on that note it is also what I would recommend to anyone else creating a 24 rogue twink.
 
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Also not quite sure what you were getting at about a slow offhand giving you better eviscerate damage, eviscerate isn't affected by the speed of either of your weapons... it's only affected by your raw stats not the top damage of your weapons, so yes if the stats on the slower weapon were better then it would give you higher evis hits, but considering that the venerable mass doesn't give you much better stats than a fast dagger alternative you're going to lose out on a fair amount of damage, or utility depending on what poison you apply to your off-hand weapon.
 
thanks for your answer Spitfire... :D

the main reason why i got agility over stamina is for the 40% crit

about Sharpened Scarlet Kris (http://www.wowhead.com/item=44091), wouldn't be better to use Doomspike (http://www.wowhead.com/item=3413), since its 1.4 instead of 1.5? (which also, will give more agility for the crit above)

Outlaw Sabre is horde only, what do you think about Venerable Dal'Rend's Sacred Charge (http://www.wowhead.com/item=42945) in this slot? about the macro, didn't thought about that, it feels like it's the best option :)

about the ranged weapon, again i would go for the gun because of the agility for the 40% crit...

the race i'll run a human, definitely, 2AGM or 1AGM and 1 Swift Hand of Justice (http://www.wowhead.com/item=42991) for the haste

i really aprecciate your answer and the time you took to write it down :)
 
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Spitfire said:
Also not quite sure what you were getting at about a slow offhand giving you better eviscerate damage, eviscerate isn't affected by the speed of either of your weapons... it's only affected by your raw stats not the top damage of your weapons, so yes if the stats on the slower weapon were better then it would give you higher evis hits, but considering that the venerable mass doesn't give you much better stats than a fast dagger alternative you're going to lose out on a fair amount of damage, or utility depending on what poison you apply to your off-hand weapon.
Click to expand...
i realized that while i was posting, thanks ;)
 
M4rk0s said:
the main reason why i got agility over stamina is for the 40% crit
Click to expand...

Fair enough, I wouldn't really consider having a 5% chance not to crit on my ambush a major problem but if you really want to go for that 40% crit I don't think you'll attain what most people would refer to as BiS, it will still be effective but I think you'll just lower your overall effectiveness and significantly gimp your survivability by aiming for 40% crit

M4rk0s said:
about Sharpened Scarlet Kris (Sharpened Scarlet Kris - Item - World of Warcraft), wouldn't be better to use Doomspike (Doomspike - Item - World of Warcraft), since its 1.4 instead of 1.5? (which also, will give more agility for the crit above)
Click to expand...

Yes, it would... I overlooked this option thank you for pointing it out :)

M4rk0s said:
Outlaw Sabre is horde only, what do you think about Venerable Dal'Rend's Sacred Charge (Venerable Dal'Rend's Sacred Charge - Item - World of Warcraft) in this slot? about the macro, didn't thought about that, it feels like it's the best option :)
Click to expand...

If you aren't fussed about having a slightly worse item then yeah, Dal'rend is the best option... personally I started off as horde and then faction changed once I had the sabre :)

M4rk0s said:
about the ranged weapon, again i would go for the gun because of the agility for the 40% crit...
Click to expand...

Again I think by aiming for this 40% crit you'll end up actually lowering survivability, and by going for the gun over thrown you'll also be forfieting some PvP utility
 
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Thanks again bro! You helped me a lot :)
I think i didin't meant BiS, the right thing to say would be the "higher burst" or "at least 40% crit"...
I will chose for the first 2 specs linked at the top, switching between one and the other depending when i'm stealth for ambushs or not...
About the link you posted, besides the doomspike, the neck and glove, there's better ones, in the link above you can see what i would call an actually BiS:
http://chardev.org/profile/408564-BiS24Rogue.html
 
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so, i'm not sure if you can get that neck and glove, i have to check it myself and i'll let you know as soon as i get to 24.
anyways, i have another link of a very simple to build rogue that still got the 40% that i'm looking for:
chardev 9
i know that Petrolspill leggins is better, and the weapons can be changed, but, as i said, it's focusing on 40% crit ;)
 
Once you take off wicked dagger you lose the 40% which I wouldn't use wicked dagger x 2 at all or smelting pants , plus engineering n herb are bis for 90%!of most rogues, can't get neck or gloves from other list

1201 Hp ouch

/Tickle
 
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