Tzvetan
Veteran
What, exactly, are you asking for?
Let's consolidate brackets so we can get some queues to pop!
- Thread starter Knewbie
- Start date
What, exactly, are you asking for?
OP
OP
Knewbie
I D G A F F
Exactly? I’m not sure...any extra exposure/promotion would be helpful. I assume some know other [in-game] community/bracket/guild leaders or members who haven’t seen the poll, or don’t know that it exists, and it would be great if more weighed-in since voting numbers seem light. I really just want to engage everyone so they feel like they’re part of the solution and invest in the effort...the more the merrier!
Fx
Unnecessarily Rude
Would it be fair to say that there isn't a massive difference between the 40-49 and 50-59 bracket?
I'd imagine 50-59 would be (generally speaking) more fun for players as they get a few more abilities as well as access to Vanilla raids (lvl50 required to be able to enter) in case anyone is interested in PvE content.
Idea being that the people voting 40-49 vs 50-59 could reasonably be expected to also enjoy the other bracket and so you get a larger community if the two groups would work together and choose one of the two brackets.
I'd imagine 50-59 would be (generally speaking) more fun for players as they get a few more abilities as well as access to Vanilla raids (lvl50 required to be able to enter) in case anyone is interested in PvE content.
Idea being that the people voting 40-49 vs 50-59 could reasonably be expected to also enjoy the other bracket and so you get a larger community if the two groups would work together and choose one of the two brackets.
kayas
Veteran
The 59s hurt me for that exact reason. I would love to run old raids again with 59 twinks and such, but it would kill me to get all that T1-2 gear / weapons and not be able to use them. q_q
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/illidan/Genral
OP
OP
Knewbie
I D G A F F
@Fx Some great points to consider! As you say, I don’t see much difference between 49s and 59s, but one could also say “okay, but you can do even more with 69s” and we’d be slippery-sloping right back where we are now. I think the best thing to do for now is make the case for your preferred bracket (done!) and lobby others you know for their votes, then we’ll see how this thing shakes out in a few days.
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Tzvetan
Veteran
The issue with 59s is that you’re shoehorned into socket gear, whereas 49s allow for a much greater variety in gearing and approach. Further, you’re running only Azerothian dungeons at 49, while 59s require primarily BC content for gearing. Also, and I’ll admit that I could be mistaken about this, but it seems that, with all those gems, 59s would be a very bursty bracket with low TTK, which isn’t the best for WGs IMO. You don’t get any additional talents at 59 and there are DKs, so 49 is about as ideal as a mid bracket gets, IMHO.
kayas
Veteran
Just to add a final input, I can only speak for my warrior, but I was able to replace every piece of BoE gear (minus waist, I’m pretty sure I have BiS) with better dungeon loot in one night (minus weapons).
So with that in mind: ~4 hours of PuGing 3 or 4-boss dungeons for BiS gear while only having to level to 49. I think it’s a strong argument.
Edit: I’m also only calling the Hatse/Versa (aurora) gear BiS as that’s what I’ve had the most success with, but as mentioned elsewhere, sky is the limit for stacking different stats. Also weapon drop rates for me: Runeblade took 35 runs to drop, was very painful. Sul’thraze took 6 runs.
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/character/illidan/Genral
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Fx
Unnecessarily Rude
Does it really, though? Is there not just a BiS item for every slot the same as every other bracket?
For me it doesn't really matter which dungeons I'm getting boosted through for my gear. They're both normal dungeons so you can spam them to your heart's content all the same.
I wouldn't know either, but I do know that alongside the gemslots, a couple of classes gain defensive abilities (Ice Block is a big one for example).
You get 1 or 2 abilities which is kind of the same thing as unlocking a talent I'd imagine, and why is including players that enjoy DK a bad thing?
From my perspective, 50-59 would include more types of players, with those who'd like to do organized PvE being able to do Vanilla raids and those who want to play DK can do so. Including more players means a more active bracket.
My two cents. I don't intend to derail the thread, everyone is free to write their thoughts and cast their votes.
Edit: because I was curious I went and made a list of defensive abilities learned between 50-59:
Druid: Ironbark
Mage: Ice Block, Cauterize, Cold Snap
Monk: Fortifying Brew, Touch of Karma
Paladin: Blessing of Sacrifice, Lay on Hands, Ardent Defender, Blessing of Kings (kind of counts?)
Priest: Rapture, PW:Radiance (when paired with PvP Talent), Focused Will rank 2, Silence
Shaman: Astral Shift, Tremor Totem, Spirit Link Totem
Warlock: Unending Resolve, Soul Link
Warrior: Shield Wall
Mage: Ice Block, Cauterize, Cold Snap
Monk: Fortifying Brew, Touch of Karma
Paladin: Blessing of Sacrifice, Lay on Hands, Ardent Defender, Blessing of Kings (kind of counts?)
Priest: Rapture, PW:Radiance (when paired with PvP Talent), Focused Will rank 2, Silence
Shaman: Astral Shift, Tremor Totem, Spirit Link Totem
Warlock: Unending Resolve, Soul Link
Warrior: Shield Wall
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Tzvetan
Veteran
No, there isn’t. In 59s, the BIS piece will be the one that has three gem slots and a primary stat gem bonus pretty much across the board, with a few set pieces being a possible exception. At 49, let’s say I’m playing a mage. Let’s look at the head slot. If I’m looking for a balanced build with a healthy percentage of Vers, I want circle of flame. Balanced, but with an emphasis on int/SP? Eye of flame. Am I planning to run the postmaster’s set for the int bonus and utility? Postmaster’s Band. What about pure glass cannon? There’s always Imperial Red Circlet. What if I want to stack haste, but feel I give up too many secondaries by using postmaster’s? I can use a dungeon blue that gives haste and another secondary. I use these examples because I know players who use or have used all of those items.
Compared with 59s, where your options are limited due to the incredible power of the PvP gems available to int/agi classes, and the considerable power of the +6 str gems (and let’s be honest—if you want to be competitive, you have to stack as many gems as you can), the number of viable pieces increases dramatically in nearly every class at nearly every slot in 49s.
So no, I think that for 49s, more than any other bracket, there’s more flexibility in gearing. I hope that’s helpful.
wam
Veteran
Very true, but as in any bracket there is an optimal set-up. It’s fun to try to builds and theory-craft, but when they under perform it’s just a bore. The thing about 49s that’s disconcerting (just as the other lower-level brackets) is the limitation on viable spec. Playing a rogue? Gotta go outlaw. Playing a mage? Gotta go arcane. Playing a warlock? Gotta go destro.
And before you all start saying you play other specs I’m sure you do but I mean competitive.
Tzvetan
Veteran
Disagree. One of the coolest things about 49 is that it’s where the other specs that just don’t hang in the lower brackets finally come into their own. Sure, fire and frost lack the consistent damage that comes from missile spam, but missile spam is a lot easier to heal through than a sudden 3k burst from fire. I’ve played all three specs pretty extensively at 49, and feel pretty confident in saying that fire and frost do just as well as arcane. They might not have quite as much raw damage in the end, but usually more KBs and a lot more control over the battlefield.
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Buckshotbob
Creepygoat
My Affliction DoT’s would have something to say about that.
But thats a topic for another day...
I thought of this yesterday, as it seems the top three brackets of choice are 49’s, 59’s and 70’s...
What if the leadership of each bracket organized some try before you buy Wargames? Maybe not get too crazy with the enchants or gear, sort of like a test drive.
If we are going to 70’s you would have to get to 49’s first anyways.
If its not your cup of tea, then level up to the next one. If anything we would get some short term activity at least.
Just thinking out loud here...
poppabear
Grandfathered
gotta agree to disagree on the limited viability of off specs for 49s. Most in the 49s brackets know that I have messed with a TON of specs other than outlaw/arcane/destro and have had great success at both topping dmg meters and focusing objectives. Frost mage, sub rogue, and demo lock are 3 of my favs at 49s. Very fun (relative) to play. Brewmaster monk is pretty fun too! I started to go 59s, but when i saw the socket grind, i lost a little interest. Having said all this, i dont care what bracket we end up in, if we have enough to make bgs pop, i will roll and play that bracket! 150 viewers now on this thread....if even a 3rd of that all goes and queues in one bracket, we should have plenty of xpoff bg pops and some really fun gear grinding and bg games together!
Adub
Veteran
I'm going to sound a little biased here, but looking at the poll #s VS who's actually putting in effort to get games, I think 59 has it by far... I'm not counting anything out as I also have 49s and 70s but as far as I know we're the only bracket doing daily games (besides 19 who can apparently get actual bg pops), so for what it's worth I think you all should try our bracket out and hop into the war games one of these nights. We're also pushing everyone to have a char on both sides that way we can try to keep team comps as even as possible. We already have a battle net community, multiple discords, etc. to help make it as easy as possible to log in, form your group, and get right into it.
Here's a thread with more details on it; https://xpoff.com/threads/59-daily-war-games-on-us-horde-vs-ally.84145/#post-1153463
Here's a thread with more details on it; https://xpoff.com/threads/59-daily-war-games-on-us-horde-vs-ally.84145/#post-1153463
wam
Veteran
I understand you are all fond of your specs and I understand the idea of claiming viability, BUT if you’re talking wargames you’d be hard pressed to pull out non-meta specs and be successful. Sure you can top damage, have burst, or have good CC but it’s about more than being a 1 trick pony. I’ve proved this time and time again. With people wanting to ban MM from wargames after using mine. And let’s not even bring my resto Druid up.... I understand all the 49s want to win this vote and I totally understand , but as someone who plays BOTH 79 and 49 (BisBis, not half-assing) the 70s bracket is just more fun. More talents, more cc, more abilities, more gearing , mastery. It just makes the most sense as a twinking experience. Huge disparity between twink and non-twink allowing true potential of a spec to be unleashed. 49s just don’t bring the challenge to me personally.
[doublepost=1553188362,1553188096][/doublepost]Also, to add one thing : it’s really hard to get BiS on 49s...and I’m not talking about dungeon gear. I mean real BiS. Feathermoon headdress, basilisk hide legs, PCB with incendiary , these are not easy and super expensive. For the dedicated twinks out there who want BiSBiS it’s more concrete on 79. It may take time to farm, but it is garaunteed in due time.
[doublepost=1553188362,1553188096][/doublepost]Also, to add one thing : it’s really hard to get BiS on 49s...and I’m not talking about dungeon gear. I mean real BiS. Feathermoon headdress, basilisk hide legs, PCB with incendiary , these are not easy and super expensive. For the dedicated twinks out there who want BiSBiS it’s more concrete on 79. It may take time to farm, but it is garaunteed in due time.