Frost Dk.. Viable?

It is a very entertaining spec, both in PVP and PVE. You can singlehandedly win a SoTA for your team, and your DPS will be among the top 5 on trash, and very respectable on bosses. As with any kind of DK, you will rely on a good dispeller to get you out of novas (since everybody rolled a mage).



Check out the thread in my sig for BiS lists for PVE. I logged Satiná out in PVP gear tonight if you want to check out what my idea of BiS PVP gear is. Of course opinions differ, but I've had a good experience using that set (sometimes I swap out the Battlemaster trinket and use Berserker's Call).



Edit: Made a Chardev with Satinás PVP gear since I'll most likely log out in other gear sets in the future - link.
 
Dirtywork said:
Every one of those death knights is a two hander.



Here's me: Dwydread @ Kargath - Game - World of Warcraft



I still need the Sunwell legs and gloves, wish me luck on tonight's raid.



My question was about the spec though. I know there is only a little leeway on where we could adjust our points, but what do you think? Is there something better I could do with my spec?
Click to expand...





First of all I don't get your helm; Why not get the dps one?



Secondly aren't you supposed to use UP instead of Frost? - I'm talking about your boot enchant. (I there's one with 22 stam, and you get runspeed from unholy plus if you want to be frost presence you should take Imp FP) I don't know if your GCD capped at your level without Motfw.



I wouldn't take Rime, but instead Endless Winter and maybe another point in Merciless Combat (Dunno if it matters since most targets below 35% are dead or healed full.)



I don't know if you get kited alot, as I'd imagine you faceroll through anything but mages (And the unh. talent will be somehow less valuable)
 
Comparing the helms, both are very close, but the tanking one gives expertise. You might not think expertise is a huge deal, but when compared to straight up crit (which I have allot of, using agi weapons) it appears to be far better. Both can be reforged, and I've crafted both, but have been running with the tanking one for it's expertise.



Yes I am almost always in unholy presence. I went with the speedy boot enchant for flag carrying (when I usually go blood presence). That's not a big deal to change, buying a second set of boots is not biggie. This is a suggestion I will take.



I'm not sure if you've played a frost knight in the bracket, but howling blast is straight up amazing. My ranged dps (for those times when I am being kited) is actually quite good with howl and death coil. However, as I did come here for suggestions, I will try going without Rime. But if I took the points out of Rime I likely wouldn't go endless winter. I get lots of mind freezes off and seem to have an abundance of Runic Power.



If we are talking about classes that are hard to beat Paladins are right up there. And there are always a ton on horde. I'm lucky if there aren't at least 3. Prots with their shields make me thankful of my expertise. Busting down a Paladin can be crazy hard.



Mages without a doubt are pretty monstrous, but if I can get my hands on them I hurt them pretty bad. Being as strong as I am, and not being a terrible player, I am blessed by the healers by quite a few dispels.



The unholy talent for more death grips, in my opinion, even if it's a RNG (50%) can be pretty awesome. The deathgrip hungering cold combo is pretty wicked. When I go on a killing spree I find the deathgrip talent to be even more useful.



I do think it needs to be mentioned that so far this character has nothing to do with arena. Just random battlegrounds and lots of em. Also my gloves dropped tonight. One slot to go!



Edit: You didn't say anything about my glyphs. Are they what you would have chosen?
 
Alright. How's lvl 72 instead of 70 in DK perspective?



Good about the two sets, think I'll do the same - Maybe not only a few items, but everything where I feel there's a difference with the gemming and enchanting for either DPS or FCing.



Nope, I'm quite new to this bracket, so I'm still learning the hard way (QQ when I'm out of range of Obliterate or Frost Strike :D) But from what I've seen a HB only deals 1-1.5k damage, so I'm not sure if its a better alternatitive from Endless Winter. Also, I'm using imp FP which I think I better drop.



I always try avoiding a 1v1 with prot-palas, and if I get into combat just blow AMS early for their HoJ/AS. When I time HC and Strangulate correctly they are alot easier though.



Grats on the gloves! :D



About the glyphs; I've taken the same major and minor, but Ive went with imp FS instead of HB. You say that you always sit on alot of RP so that could devaluate the strength of HC (40RP/1Min only, too) and with 4.2 I'll probably go AMS instead of Dark Succor and maybe strangulate instead of HC.



Edit: Why do you use that glove enchant? (The 240 haste) I'd think either Synapse or one of the two rocket would be better.
 
The largest weakness of being 72 is the resilience. I wish I didn't have to stack it so much but the percentage really drops off. In the armory it says I have 34% but I believe it's 29% in game. I'm not exactly squishy, being a death knight and all. But I could be "thicker". My weapons are very nice though and sometimes an auto attack crit will really surprise me by how much straight up damage it'll do.



Imo the problem with two sets comes down to those BiS slots outside of PvP gear. Two sets of BiS gloves and legs would be a pain as they are SWP drops.



I swear I've hit resilience targets for 3k with howl, and the glyph is amazing. Slowing down multiple enemies with what is basically a spammable aoe (up to 4 of em) is pretty awesome. I'm not sure about the hungering cold glyph but I know of one situation where I was glad I had it:



In SotA my tank got the last hit on the gate, team mates dying left and right around the tank. As my tank drops I death grip the mage closest to the relic door, hungering cold 4ish enemies (including the mage) and rocket boots for the win into the relic room. There wasn't time for runic power, I'd have been dead as a doornail if that move wasn't as clutch and quick.



I may go AMS in 4.2 as well. Practice ranged dps with howl and death coil to get a good feel about how to manage your runic power. Being able to ranged dps can be important in some situations.



Make sure to read the engineering sticky. My discovered tinker was the quickflip deflection plates, and being that you only get one, the haste is far better. +240 haste is nothing to scoff at as a dual wielding DK with such hard hitting weapons. Plus I've macro'd to use the haste, pillar of frost, and speed potions when I have em.



One important note, when summoning your ghoul you want to have as many buffs up as you can, cause the ghoul takes your current AP at it's "birth". So if you can time it so that Fallen Crusader proc and Pillar of Frost is up he's much stronger.



Last note: versus paladins don't be afraid to kite a bit. Annoy him with your chillbains disease (howl glyph ftw here) and chains of ice till he blows freedom, grip him, hurt him, silence him, hurt him some more, as your silence comes off it's AMS time. Then you've usually forced the bubble or LoH.
 
@dirty wouldnt the str tinker be the best, that or tazik. haste is nice, but str is weighted higher afaik



also doesnt the game check your ap like every 30seconds and apply that to your ghoul, vs checking at "birth" and staying the same the whole time. like if you're uh and making the ghoul go all crazy then it takes your current AP (so use all procs and stuff before you use that CD), then after it fades it rechecks it. thats how i remember reading it worked at least
 
It is my belief (admittedly the stuff I've read was old, and I've chosen to believe it and it appears true in practice although hard tests have not been performed (lol)) that Unholy's ghoul works completely different than the standard dummy ghoul we get.



As the ghoul stays up for a very short time for a non-unholy dk I believe it's just a snapshot of your current attack power and stamina and stays that way for the short term duration of the dummy pet. I do believe the unholy pet can check again and adjust to your points, but as I never plan to play unholy and as this is my only DK I honestly don't really care.



Would I love the Tazik or the Synapse Springs? Hell yeah. Am I going to re-level engineering to get it, only to likely be rewarded with something like the mana gulper? Hell no! I've been considering trying engineering just one more time for a better tinker after I get the BiS legs. Quickflip deflection plates aren't even used by max level tanks, I suspect it'd get a buff someday but I won't hold my breath.
 
Well yeah, frost or blood ghoul takes snapshot, and ive macroed it to Pillar (if I use pillar every 3 minutes, it lines up perfectly.) and will probably to the same with Synapse if I get them (leveling engineering atm, cba changing too many times.)



Unholy ghoul updates all the time, so there's nothing important about it, just make sure that you get Timmy empowered soon.



(You can check Sonofalich.com for mechanics, theres a live chat with pro DKs too.)
 
i just noticed you were talking about expertise like its good. expertise is not good for pvp...everyone has too much of fluctuating values to make it worthwhile, not to mention if an enemy is casting or turning his back to you he cant dodge/parry anyways. oh and a pally holding a shield doesnt change anything - granted a prot pally will almost likely have more parry n dodge % than a ret or holy pally, but the shield itself doesnt change anything (unless it adds parry/dodge).



n yea the ghoul stuff makes sense now. i forgot blood/frost ghouls are only temporary, so yea i get that it takes a snapshot when its raised then. had it confused with uh's perm pet
 
I remember when I first came here and how you felt about expertise, Falkor. I guess the only fair thing to do is to try it some more. In my experience the small amount of more stamina and the bonus expertise was more valuable than crit when you're fighting targets like anything that stacks agility or a prot paladin.



I guess testing on a dps dummy won't be accurate though.
 
any expertise would be better as crit, haste, etc



like i said, if your enemy is casting or if you just attack from behind, you just negated all their dodge/parry. in practice you arent gonna be attacking from behind 100% of the time against another melee class esp in a 1v1. but you can actually jump around and get attacks in from their back arc, plus the vast majority of fights in battlegrounds are not in fact 1v1s and you get ample chances to attack from behind. plus youre a DK with hybrid style attacks like some ranged abilities that dont rely on exp, dots, etc
 
Hmm.



I just got Synapse Springs and when I turn that on, followed by Pillar i get 1599 strength (Up from having about 800). My Obliterates crit for 8k when both are on. Would you try to get the Tazik Shocker still? (Don't haev Borderland Paingrips yet)
 
i think springs are better for pve, and nice for you guys in pvp since you can pop it with pillar for an uberbuffed ghoul + the added dps for you. tazik provides nice burst for arena tho, and general fun in bgs. id prolly stick with the springs just in case rng in redoing engineering fucks you around
 
Yeah. I read on some other topic that you'd get 3 tinkers as Goblin Engineer. How does that work?



Edit; Gnome as a race, not gnomish engineering. lol.
 
aye 3 for being a gnome since they have +15 engi racial

id be happy with the synapse springs tho
 
Hey again. Now that I got started on my dk and been rolling frost for some time I want to start doing some arenas. I've been playing a few nights with some different healers (One Disc one Rdruid).



Edit: Please also comment about frost >< Unholy in these setups.



Playing with a resto was good, cause I would always take the first hit and he could be far behind me, or Pouncing their healer or something.



Playing with a Disc seems to me to be better, seems to me like the priest must be more skilled to be able to accomplish something. Doing the right mindcontrols, manaburns, fears, hymns, fiends. DoTs, Smite/Holy Fire and SW:Death makes it seem very good to me atleast.





Now. Resto shamans never go oom, and can kite better than the two others, imo. (Earthbind and Frost Shock, maybe ghostwolf).





I really don't know about holy paladins. They seem to be the worst at this level.



Which would you say is the best?
 
Yea most people don't like 70+'erz cuz people want a fair 70's only , can just roll paladin 72 Wingz and hammer boom headshot 9k in ya face xD gf :( dudu has cyclone and stuffz :p but yea you lower some stats aswell but DW those archeo weapons and u go RAWR -mode
 
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