HairyTreeMan
Grandfathered
Please list what you know to be the best race/class/spec combination for each faction. Would love if you provided reasoning for each.
Best Race/Class Combinations For Each Faction?
- Thread starter HairyTreeMan
- Start date
Acann
Veteran
In a lot of cases it's a matter of preference.
Alliance
Druid: Night Elf (default)
Hunter: Night Elf (Shadowmeld to eat/drink, and Shadowmeld w/ stealth pet for flag defense is why I prefer them over Dwarfs)
Mage: Gnome (More int and escape artist)
Paladin: Toss up
Priest: Human/Dwarf > Night Elf
Rogue: Human (Bonus to sword skill) >= Gnome (Escape artist) > Night Elf (Better stealth, higher dodge)
Warlock: Gnome (See Mage explanation)
Warrior: Human (Bonus to sword/mace skill) > Gnome (Escape artist)
Horde
Druid: Tauren (default)
Hunter: Troll (Bonus to bow skill, Berserking)
Mage: Undead (WotF, Shadow resist)
Priest: Troll (HoW)
Rogue: Undead (WotF, Shadow resist)
Shaman: Tauren (Bonus health, AoE stun)
Warlock: Undead (WotF, Shadow resist)
Warrior: Undead (WotF, Shadow resist)
Bowner
Veteran
Some roles depend on Offense / Defense as well. Ill try n break that down
Ally
Druid - Duh
Hunter - Yes N Elf, also potential to reach most Agi / DPS for a hunter. ( 8 agi / tunic westfall etc )
Mage: Human Mage on Defense (Perception) And Gnome Mage on Offense.
Paladin: Dwarf gets Edge.
Priest: Pretty even, ( I mainly Horde / Run Horde teams but if i was prepping ally squad I would want a Nelf Priest on Defense, the Shadowmeld > Fear is a slick combo on those coming up Roof. Also negates enemy rogue possible to Sap your Priest before making push.
Rogue: Skill to weapons don't make a difference / matter. Human/Nelf rogues are easier to jump with, but i'd says Gnome > Nelf > Human. You always want at least 1 GNOME Rogue if running 2 Rogues on your Premade.
Warlock: Gnome/Human both fine, Locks are really squishy so Human might be bit better for a bit sustainability + as a Warlock most time you should be keeping your distance and shouldn't have to worry about immobilization or movement speed reduction effects on your much.
Warrior : Pretty even, Dwarf has extra Frost Res. Good for those mages spamming R1 FB.
Horde :
Druid - Tauren Duh.
Hunter: Troll. If you have a Hunter running IMP Wing Clip might consider keeping it on Defense is a solid choice. Also perhaps Tauren Hunter Imp Wing Clip would be very effective on Defense. But Troll = Master Race. Make Female Troll for smoother jumps.
Mage: Undead > Troll.
Priest: Undead on Defense, Troll on Offense preferred. https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=9035/hex-of-weakness Troll Exclusive.
Rogues: UD or ORC both solid.
Shaman: versatile class, depends on role IE DPS Shammy/Healing Shammy. Troll/Orc for healing, Tauren for Melee DPS Hybrid.
Warlock: Undead or Orc! UD lock> Other Locks. But Orc does have a 5% Increase Pet damage and Hardiness.
Warrior: Tauren or Orc fairly even. I don't think UD Warriors are that great, and WoTF doesn't make anything UD best.
Beachcomber
OG
I have often told folks this, and that is War Stomp wins games. The stamina boost is also nice. However, kiting as a male Tauren is rough so I will now always roll female for twinkage purposes.
Acann
Veteran
Rogues don't have any stuns at level 19.
Baseline Stuns at Lvl 19: Druid Bash, Paladin Hammer of Justice, and Warrior Charge.
Specialization Specific Stuns at Lvl 19: Improve Concussive Shot-Spec Hunter, Impact-Spec Mage and Blackout-Spec Priest.
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Outofspace
Sogeking / Deeps
Someone above noted that +weapon skills don't matter in BGs. Where are you getting your info from? Weapon skills are maxed and normalized for BGs yes, but +skill gets applied after that.
Bowner
Veteran
Think your talking about me, basically self contradict your post. Yeah Weapon Skills are maxed and means nothing in BGs. Yeah their is exception from +Skill from items with +Skill / Racial Traits all that is doing for you is a very minor increase in your attacks being parry/dodged/hit.
So yeah doesn't matter in BGs, never in BG will you be like WOW if i didn't have that +5 Racial Trait I be screwed!
+1 Skill = around 0.4% x 5 Skill = 2% reduced chance for hit/dodge/parry etc.
''
Weapon skills are maxed in PvP combat. This means leveling a weapon skill for pvp is unimportant; when attacking an enemy player, your Weapon Skill will always be considered to be your level * 5, and your target's Defense will always be treated as their level * 5 (before any Defense Rating from your target's gear is added in).
Weapon skill does not affect your chance to hit other players in the battlegrounds or in the arena, but it still affects your hit chance against enemy players in world PvP or duels. ''
Outofspace
Sogeking / Deeps
Not really sure how to respond other than, 'No you're self contraditory!'
Reducing enemy avoidance means you hit them more, +skill also adds crit. If your numbers are right and we're talking 2% across the board, that means their chance to be missed goes from 5% to 3%, their dodge goes down 2%, parry down 2%, block down 2% and it should even give you 2% more crit. Show me someone who doesn't care about numbers like that and I'll show you a really bad twink.
Reducing enemy avoidance means you hit them more, +skill also adds crit. If your numbers are right and we're talking 2% across the board, that means their chance to be missed goes from 5% to 3%, their dodge goes down 2%, parry down 2%, block down 2% and it should even give you 2% more crit. Show me someone who doesn't care about numbers like that and I'll show you a really bad twink.
Bowner
Veteran
Did I not say that it will reduce chance for enemy to hit/dodge/parry? your just regurgitating what I'm saying. Also I made a typo in my post just before this (Rolled out of bed as I typed that) its 1 Weapon Skill = 0.04% so even a smaller difference. ( Note: In my OP that started this, I said Weapon Skill doesn't make a different/matter because it doesn't its not a game changer ).
Second. Your again just going based off what I'm saying, I made typo/mistake saying 0.4% instead 0.04% and you are going based off that number now instead off your own knowledge to back up any claims.
There is lots of threads on Weapon Skill, this one user does the calculations for and breaks down pretty good in one of the posts.
https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/weapon-skill-in-pvp/63365/3?u=omegaseoren-1237
This person breaks down as ''5 weapon skill in pvp equates to 1.3% hit and 0.2% crit''
Here is example of what is a difference maker in a BG.
Human Rogue vs Gnome Rogue
Enemy EFC Dies from DoTs/Ranged, the Flag is left standing. Druid/Mage Roots or Nova you from Behind ( Note your got distance for the Return ) this can also work vice versa on a rogue picking up the flag from your FC.
Human Rogue > Stuck in Nova/Roots. Enemy returns/picks up flag.
Gnome Rogue > Escape Artists and Picks up Flag or Returns.
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Outofspace
Sogeking / Deeps
Thanks for the clarification. I thought your numbers were inflated, and I suppose if you just don't take it into account because it's not important to you I get it, but I felt that your wording was misleading.
To anyone who cares about a little extra hit / crit chance, take note of racial weapon skills. They may tip you over to a particular race and they do still work in BGs. In particular I see human vs dwarf paladin being tipped towards human for the weapon bonuses (specially with the lack of poisons in the bracket).
To anyone who cares about a little extra hit / crit chance, take note of racial weapon skills. They may tip you over to a particular race and they do still work in BGs. In particular I see human vs dwarf paladin being tipped towards human for the weapon bonuses (specially with the lack of poisons in the bracket).
Acann
Veteran
You're assuming that the Gnome racial isn't on cooldown in that scenario, whilst the bonus weapon skill for Humans is always active.
Bowner
Veteran
Yeah no problem, I guess bad wording in my OP. Should of said it ''not that much of a difference maker''. And edge for Human also might be cause easier for Jumps than a Dwarf.
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Do you know EA cooldown? It's one minute. That shit better be up in situation like that. But yeah it's just an example bud. Im sure someone can pull a example about how that small % to hit or miss could be a difference maker in killing a EFC. But my example is a bit more realistic / common.
Lebaidin
Veteran
Alliance:
Druid: Night Elf
Hunter: Night Elf > Dwarf
Night Elves have Shadowmeld, higher base Agility, 1% extra Dodge and 10 Nature Resist. Higher Dodge is amazing for dodging physical slows and getting Mongoose Bite procs (if you're real sweaty). For Dwarves, 10 Frost Resist is really nice but Stoneform and Gun Specialization are basically useless (no diseases in 19s, Serpent Sting does laughable damage, and bleeds are pretty rare).
Mage: Gnome (in all cases) > Human
Gnome Mage is an absolutely insane race/class combo. Higher base Intellect, 5% bonus to Intellect, Escape Artist, and 10 Arcane Resistance (gives you about a 7% chance to resist Polymorph). You will be targeted by so many Pollies that the 10 Arcane Resist will come in handy. Escape Artist is good in so many situations.
Perception on Humans is nice for Mage, but you can usually just spam Arcane Explosion around where you think a stealthed Rogue is anyway.
Paladin: Human > Dwarf
With every poison/bleed being a joke in 19s (and Paladins having Cleanse), Stoneform is borderline useless. 10% Armor may sound nice, but armor has diminishing returns, so the bonus usually only translates to a 2-3% physical damage reduction bonus.
Perception is incredible for Paladins. In general, Horde despise Pallies and their Blessings, so you will almost always be targeted by Saps, Polymorphs, and other CCs. With rogues always trying to Sap you, you can use Perception and spam Judgement while SOTR is up and almost always get Rogues out of Stealth. Once you get them out of Stealth, they will probably Gouge you which means they can't Sap at all and can't Gouge again for 10 seconds. That's a win for the Pally in my book.
Priest: See Bowner's post
Rogue: Gnome > Night Elf > Human > Dwarf
I've never played a 19 Rogue, so I can't provide much insight here. That being said, Rogues are very one-dimensional (scary when not CC'd, but laughably easy to CC). With slows/snares being some of the most common CC in the 19 bracket, Escape Artist is almost never useless. Gnome just always seems like the best. The 10 Arcane Resistance is great for resisting Polymorphs as well.
I will say Night Elf Rogue looks at least somewhat viable. Being able to Shadowmeld immediately after a Sap is very useful and Night Elves are known for being better jumpers as well.
Warlock: Gnome > Human
This is actually kind of a close one I'd say. As a Warlock, you'll be targeted by tons of Polymorphs, so 10 Arcane Resistance is definitely nice. Escape Artist is also great as you are already vulnerable enough and slows/snares oftentimes seal your fate.
That being said, Bowner definitely makes a good argument for Human Warlock. The higher base Stamina is very useful. Also, Perception is incredibly useful as Rogues can completely destroy Warlocks if they have the opener (Kick Fear and Gouge if the Kick was juked).
Warrior: Gnome > Dwarf = Night Elf > Human
Like Rogues, Warriors can be pretty one-dimensional. My brother mains a 19 Gnome Warrior and I can't even tell you how many times Escape Artist was the deciding factor in whether he survived and/or we returned a flag.
Bowner is definitely right about the Dwarf's Frost Resist being really useful. Mages (especially Frost Mages) are going to be one of your major annoyances as a Warrior and being able to resist a Frostbolt / Frost Nova / Frost Armor / Frostbite can put a lot of situations in your favor.
That being said, I hate RNG and will reduce reliance on RNG whenever I can. I would personally go Gnome as you have a slow/snare break on a 1 min CD.
Night Elf is an interesting race for Warrior. The 10 Nature Resistance is useful for resisting Entangling Roots and Nature's Grasp (something I see Warriors get hit by a lot). Shadowmeld is also incredibly useful for getting Charges and avoiding a lot of ranged CC (while you're still out of combat).
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Horde:
Druid: Tauren
Hunter:
Melee: Orc
Ranged: I can see a good argument for any of the three.
I personally prefer Orc. Although the 5% pet damage bonus doesn't make that much of a difference, the 25% Stun Resist is absolutely insane. You won't see a ton of Blackout and Impact stuns, but you will see a ton of Improved Concussive Shots, Charges, and HoJs. Even though you should almost never get charged by a Warrior as a Hunter, being able to resist a Charge usually leads to you being able to get away unslowed. I should also mention that Blood Fury goes really well with Raptor Strike.
Tauren also works really well with Hunter. Higher Stamina is always a plus (although you should be taking less damage in general than other classes). War Stomp is insane on so many levels (creates a gap for Pallies and Rogues on you) and allows for easy flag passes. The 10 Nature Resist is also great for resisting Entangling Roots and Nature's Grasp.
Mage:
CC Mage: Highly debatable
Spell Damage Mage: Troll
99% of people (some of which are incredible Mage players) will tell you to go Undead hands down. Will of the Forsaken and 10 Shadow Resistance will obviously be amazing against Warlocks and Priests.
However, I don't fall in this 99% category. I actually prefer Troll and argue that you should almost never be hit by a Fear or a Psychic Scream as a Mage. I'm making this sound easy and it isn't, but if you have decent awareness then it's a lot easier than it sounds.
Fear is a 20 yard range and Polymorph/Frostbolt is a 30 yard range. This creates so many opportunities where you can Polymorph but they can't Fear. As for Psychic Scream, try and keep a 30-second timer going in your head when a Priest uses it. Avoid standing really close to Priests and try playing around with the max range of Frost Nova. There are many times where I've seen a Mage be able to Frost Nova a Priest before they can get a Psychic Scream off.
The only real benefit that Trolls have over Undead is the Berserking racial. This ability is underrated as hell and can help you get Polymorphs on other Mages (even if you both cast at the same time). The other thing I love about Berserking is that you can use it when you're at half health or so (I can't remember the optimal %) and then throw out Frostbolts and Fireballs like no tomorrow. I also don't know whether this affects the GCD, but if it does, more power to Trolls.
Priest: Undead > Troll
I've never played Priest on Horde, so I'm not going to be able to provide great insight here. Will of the Forsaken is much more useful Priests than Mages as you can't really stand way in the backfield like a Mage can. Also with Psychic Scream being short range, you'll find yourself in range of Alliance players' Fears and Psychic Screams pretty often.
However, Hex of Weakness (Troll Priest Racial) seems objectively better than Touch of Weakness (Undead Troll Priest Racial) and I'm not sure how the Blackout Talent works with them. Berserking is also OP for getting tons of heals off.
Rogue: Undead > Orc > Troll
This is also a really interesting question, but probably comes down to whatever comp the Alliance has. Undead Rogues hard counter Alliance Warlocks and Priests which makes them incredibly OP on offense.
That said, Rogues can already Trinket out of Fears (but not Stuns) which makes Orc Rogues shine a bit. As someone who has played 19 Paladin a bunch, I absolutely hate Orc Rogues (especially as when flag carrying). Many times an Orc Rogue resisting HoJ can be the difference between life and death for a Paladin FC. Blood Fury is also nice in burst situations, but they generally won't have as much melee Attack Power as a Enhancement Shaman or a Warrior.
Shaman:
Restoration: Troll
Enhancement: Orc
Flag Carrying: Tauren
I could definitely go into depth about how each race excels in each of these three roles, but this post is already long enough lol. Berserking is great for getting off heals.
Blood Fury is amazing on an Enhance Shaman with high melee AP (they get 2 AP for every 1 Strength). Hardiness (stun resist) also makes you hard counter Paladins.
Tauren's War Stomp creates for amazing CC (especially against casters when paired with Earth Shock) and opportunities to pass the flag. The higher Stamina is always nice too.
Warlock: Orc > Undead
Like the mage situation, if you truly have good awareness, you should almost never be getting hit by a Fear or a Psychic Scream.
I played a 19 Orc Warlock and absolutely loved having Hardiness. There are so many times when a HoJ or Improved Concussive Shot would be the cause of death for a Warlock.
Warrior:
Flag Carrying: Tauren
Offense: Undead > Orc
Taurens are hands down best for FCing (see above).
As for offense Warrior, this is highly debatable and also depends on the Alliance team's comp. Like Shamans, Warriors get 2 AP per point of Strength, making Blood Fury incredible. Hardiness will also help you stay right on Paladins.
I'm surprised I don't see a lot more Undead Warriors. The Warrior trinket doesn't break fears, making Will of the Forsaken really valuable.
Druid: Night Elf
Hunter: Night Elf > Dwarf
Night Elves have Shadowmeld, higher base Agility, 1% extra Dodge and 10 Nature Resist. Higher Dodge is amazing for dodging physical slows and getting Mongoose Bite procs (if you're real sweaty). For Dwarves, 10 Frost Resist is really nice but Stoneform and Gun Specialization are basically useless (no diseases in 19s, Serpent Sting does laughable damage, and bleeds are pretty rare).
Mage: Gnome (in all cases) > Human
Gnome Mage is an absolutely insane race/class combo. Higher base Intellect, 5% bonus to Intellect, Escape Artist, and 10 Arcane Resistance (gives you about a 7% chance to resist Polymorph). You will be targeted by so many Pollies that the 10 Arcane Resist will come in handy. Escape Artist is good in so many situations.
Perception on Humans is nice for Mage, but you can usually just spam Arcane Explosion around where you think a stealthed Rogue is anyway.
Paladin: Human > Dwarf
With every poison/bleed being a joke in 19s (and Paladins having Cleanse), Stoneform is borderline useless. 10% Armor may sound nice, but armor has diminishing returns, so the bonus usually only translates to a 2-3% physical damage reduction bonus.
Perception is incredible for Paladins. In general, Horde despise Pallies and their Blessings, so you will almost always be targeted by Saps, Polymorphs, and other CCs. With rogues always trying to Sap you, you can use Perception and spam Judgement while SOTR is up and almost always get Rogues out of Stealth. Once you get them out of Stealth, they will probably Gouge you which means they can't Sap at all and can't Gouge again for 10 seconds. That's a win for the Pally in my book.
Priest: See Bowner's post
Rogue: Gnome > Night Elf > Human > Dwarf
I've never played a 19 Rogue, so I can't provide much insight here. That being said, Rogues are very one-dimensional (scary when not CC'd, but laughably easy to CC). With slows/snares being some of the most common CC in the 19 bracket, Escape Artist is almost never useless. Gnome just always seems like the best. The 10 Arcane Resistance is great for resisting Polymorphs as well.
I will say Night Elf Rogue looks at least somewhat viable. Being able to Shadowmeld immediately after a Sap is very useful and Night Elves are known for being better jumpers as well.
Warlock: Gnome > Human
This is actually kind of a close one I'd say. As a Warlock, you'll be targeted by tons of Polymorphs, so 10 Arcane Resistance is definitely nice. Escape Artist is also great as you are already vulnerable enough and slows/snares oftentimes seal your fate.
That being said, Bowner definitely makes a good argument for Human Warlock. The higher base Stamina is very useful. Also, Perception is incredibly useful as Rogues can completely destroy Warlocks if they have the opener (Kick Fear and Gouge if the Kick was juked).
Warrior: Gnome > Dwarf = Night Elf > Human
Like Rogues, Warriors can be pretty one-dimensional. My brother mains a 19 Gnome Warrior and I can't even tell you how many times Escape Artist was the deciding factor in whether he survived and/or we returned a flag.
Bowner is definitely right about the Dwarf's Frost Resist being really useful. Mages (especially Frost Mages) are going to be one of your major annoyances as a Warrior and being able to resist a Frostbolt / Frost Nova / Frost Armor / Frostbite can put a lot of situations in your favor.
That being said, I hate RNG and will reduce reliance on RNG whenever I can. I would personally go Gnome as you have a slow/snare break on a 1 min CD.
Night Elf is an interesting race for Warrior. The 10 Nature Resistance is useful for resisting Entangling Roots and Nature's Grasp (something I see Warriors get hit by a lot). Shadowmeld is also incredibly useful for getting Charges and avoiding a lot of ranged CC (while you're still out of combat).
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Horde:
Druid: Tauren
Hunter:
Melee: Orc
Ranged: I can see a good argument for any of the three.
I personally prefer Orc. Although the 5% pet damage bonus doesn't make that much of a difference, the 25% Stun Resist is absolutely insane. You won't see a ton of Blackout and Impact stuns, but you will see a ton of Improved Concussive Shots, Charges, and HoJs. Even though you should almost never get charged by a Warrior as a Hunter, being able to resist a Charge usually leads to you being able to get away unslowed. I should also mention that Blood Fury goes really well with Raptor Strike.
Tauren also works really well with Hunter. Higher Stamina is always a plus (although you should be taking less damage in general than other classes). War Stomp is insane on so many levels (creates a gap for Pallies and Rogues on you) and allows for easy flag passes. The 10 Nature Resist is also great for resisting Entangling Roots and Nature's Grasp.
Mage:
CC Mage: Highly debatable
Spell Damage Mage: Troll
99% of people (some of which are incredible Mage players) will tell you to go Undead hands down. Will of the Forsaken and 10 Shadow Resistance will obviously be amazing against Warlocks and Priests.
However, I don't fall in this 99% category. I actually prefer Troll and argue that you should almost never be hit by a Fear or a Psychic Scream as a Mage. I'm making this sound easy and it isn't, but if you have decent awareness then it's a lot easier than it sounds.
Fear is a 20 yard range and Polymorph/Frostbolt is a 30 yard range. This creates so many opportunities where you can Polymorph but they can't Fear. As for Psychic Scream, try and keep a 30-second timer going in your head when a Priest uses it. Avoid standing really close to Priests and try playing around with the max range of Frost Nova. There are many times where I've seen a Mage be able to Frost Nova a Priest before they can get a Psychic Scream off.
The only real benefit that Trolls have over Undead is the Berserking racial. This ability is underrated as hell and can help you get Polymorphs on other Mages (even if you both cast at the same time). The other thing I love about Berserking is that you can use it when you're at half health or so (I can't remember the optimal %) and then throw out Frostbolts and Fireballs like no tomorrow. I also don't know whether this affects the GCD, but if it does, more power to Trolls.
Priest: Undead > Troll
I've never played Priest on Horde, so I'm not going to be able to provide great insight here. Will of the Forsaken is much more useful Priests than Mages as you can't really stand way in the backfield like a Mage can. Also with Psychic Scream being short range, you'll find yourself in range of Alliance players' Fears and Psychic Screams pretty often.
However, Hex of Weakness (Troll Priest Racial) seems objectively better than Touch of Weakness (Undead Troll Priest Racial) and I'm not sure how the Blackout Talent works with them. Berserking is also OP for getting tons of heals off.
Rogue: Undead > Orc > Troll
This is also a really interesting question, but probably comes down to whatever comp the Alliance has. Undead Rogues hard counter Alliance Warlocks and Priests which makes them incredibly OP on offense.
That said, Rogues can already Trinket out of Fears (but not Stuns) which makes Orc Rogues shine a bit. As someone who has played 19 Paladin a bunch, I absolutely hate Orc Rogues (especially as when flag carrying). Many times an Orc Rogue resisting HoJ can be the difference between life and death for a Paladin FC. Blood Fury is also nice in burst situations, but they generally won't have as much melee Attack Power as a Enhancement Shaman or a Warrior.
Shaman:
Restoration: Troll
Enhancement: Orc
Flag Carrying: Tauren
I could definitely go into depth about how each race excels in each of these three roles, but this post is already long enough lol. Berserking is great for getting off heals.
Blood Fury is amazing on an Enhance Shaman with high melee AP (they get 2 AP for every 1 Strength). Hardiness (stun resist) also makes you hard counter Paladins.
Tauren's War Stomp creates for amazing CC (especially against casters when paired with Earth Shock) and opportunities to pass the flag. The higher Stamina is always nice too.
Warlock: Orc > Undead
Like the mage situation, if you truly have good awareness, you should almost never be getting hit by a Fear or a Psychic Scream.
I played a 19 Orc Warlock and absolutely loved having Hardiness. There are so many times when a HoJ or Improved Concussive Shot would be the cause of death for a Warlock.
Warrior:
Flag Carrying: Tauren
Offense: Undead > Orc
Taurens are hands down best for FCing (see above).
As for offense Warrior, this is highly debatable and also depends on the Alliance team's comp. Like Shamans, Warriors get 2 AP per point of Strength, making Blood Fury incredible. Hardiness will also help you stay right on Paladins.
I'm surprised I don't see a lot more Undead Warriors. The Warrior trinket doesn't break fears, making Will of the Forsaken really valuable.