Best DPS Pvewise?

Troopz

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    • Hey guys im jsut planing on doin a 80 char just für fun but i want to get some good stuff that i may can take not good geard 85 place in recound or skada.
    When i playd my shamn for example (ele) i pwned much at 80 cuz i lvled alchie and got trinket back than. So i want some nice classes for my but i wish im at leat in the top 3-4 speccs =P Thy for hlp
     
    hoping english isnt your first language, but i think most OP class i have seen at 80 pve wise was a mage, they can mash one button and do tons of dps.
     
    If you can pull of Combustion right, I think Fire > Arcane. Unlike Arcane, Fire actually benefits from the t10 2 piece bonus. I almost never cast Arcane Missiles. I've hit 52k as Fire single target.

    Edit: It might be because I'm a troll, with Berserking and Bloodlust I can clear 150% haste, giving me a lot of extra ticks. I usually save Combustion for after 2 FB Crits and a Pyro Crit. I've seen it tick for over 40k. I don't know if that's normal for Fire mages.
     
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    Although Awesomeyo came close, I've never seen a fire mage do as much damage as an arcane mage.

    Yes, if the arcane mage was using the correct "rotation" he'd probably lose to a good fire mage, but with the spec currently broken and able to spam its main nuke for a whole fight, I don't see how fire could beat it.

    I've also never seen a fire mage in full cata gear, bar myself. And I'll admit I'm kinda crappy at playing it.

    So yeah, I agree with Aelo, single target = Arcane mage and due to crazy ass chain lightning spam, Ele Shammy takes it on AoE fights.
     
    Highest DPS I've ever heard of Arcane Mage hitting is 56k and I know they can't sustain that for 3 minutes. It's simple math. Even in BiS gear, AB is going to average to about 50-60 per crit in ICC. Even with a 100% crit rate that's only 40-50k damage. They spike very high due to Volcanic Potion+t10 4 Piece + Arcane Power + Berserking, but so does Fire if you stack Combustion right.

    Edit: I'm not the best with simulcraft, but simming my mage in 251 t10 for a 200 second fight is getting 23k to an arcane mage in BiS gear getting 22k. The combustion damage for the sim was crap because it's using level 85 tactics and not my own. At 65% FB crit I can wait to get 3-4 FB crits before I blow Combustion instead of doing it right after a HS Proc which leads to a MASSIVE damage increase.
     
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    Amaya said:
    Edit: I'm not the best with simulcraft, but simming my mage in 251 t10 for a 200 second fight is getting 23k to an arcane mage in BiS gear getting 22k. The combustion damage for the sim was crap because it's using level 85 tactics and not my own. At 65% FB crit I can wait to get 3-4 FB crits before I blow Combustion instead of doing it right after a HS Proc which leads to a MASSIVE damage increase.
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    I'm not sure why you simmed 251 gear, as part of the reason arcane spec is so broken (at least at 80) is due to the insane scaling from Cata gear. The mana pool, regen and mastery make it possible to just spam Arcane Blast for the majority of the fight, so did you edit the action list to account for the change in rotation?
     
    Aelobin said:
    I'm not sure why you simmed 251 gear, as part of the reason arcane spec is so broken (at least at 80) is due to the insane scaling from Cata gear. The mana pool, regen and mastery make it possible to just spam Arcane Blast for the majority of the fight, so did you edit the action list to account for the change in rotation?
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    I'm pretty sure simcraft already does this. It counts for using arcane missiles if you have less than 93% mana, which is reasonable. I don't see how it would differ, since arcane at 80 stays at really, really high mana levels for the entire fight. Perhaps it needs fixing for 80% or so? Not sure when mastery starts becoming less effective.
     
    Aelobin said:
    I'm not sure why you simmed 251 gear, as part of the reason arcane spec is so broken (at least at 80) is due to the insane scaling from Cata gear. The mana pool, regen and mastery make it possible to just spam Arcane Blast for the majority of the fight, so did you edit the action list to account for the change in rotation?
    Click to expand...

    I simmed Fire /w 251 4 piece + Cata. The Arcane Mage was in 277s/Cata.

    If you're not using 4pT10 you're gimping yourself. 18% damage bonus for 30 seconds trumps the small amount of mastery you get for replacing those pieces with Cata gear.

    edit: Using Umadbro's profile, 4357 Spellpower, 30.7% Haste, 27% Crit, 34 mastery for 500 seconds is 24k dps and that is spamming Arcane Blast for 90% of the damage. I get 20k as a Fire Mage with simulcraft, using Combustion incorrectly, and missing 277 t10 and what I think may be a better trinket.
     
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    If someone can tell me how to use combustion correctly, I'll be glad to do a real test on the dummies with my Cata gear?

    Currently, I start with Pyro, get it's dot up, Living Bomb and if there's already an ignite up, I use combustion. If there's not already an ignite up, I just cast Fireball till there is one.

    If someone would be so kind as to correct or confirm that, I'll test out fire/arcane on single target, self buffed on an 80 dummy.
     
    Downloaded some magic pixie addon called combustion helper and ran a few tests so far.

    With my limited experience with fire, with my cata gear + 4pc 264 T10, no mirror images, just combustion.
    9797767 damage, 18182.1 dps.

    Arcane in the exact same gear, so no where near optimal, also using fire's reforges... And only mana gem + arcane power.
    3332898 damage, 18553.2 dps.

    Obviously these are preliminary tests, but I can tell so far that unless I get lucky with pyro procs, fire's gonna lose.

    My other issue is, I can't evocate on the dummies because arcane has no dots and the game auto-magically removes me from combat. So I can only run arcane down to completely no mana and that's the test over.
     
    if you had 277/bis fire might scale better, especially using all ur CDs

    chuckled that "best mage eu" needed an addon for fire rotation though
     
    Results I got.

    Arcane with Arcane Reforges. (Cata gear)
    3 mins 37s
    21996.2 dps
    4790339 damage

    Arcane with Arcane Reforges. (4pc T10 264)
    3 mins 37s
    22302.2 dps
    4829760 damage

    Fire with Fire Reforges. (Cata gear)
    3 min 36s
    17593.6 dps (18162.9 dps)
    3923191 damage

    Fire with Fire Reforges. (4pc T10 264)
    3 mins 36s
    21995.0 dps (22441 dps)
    4847268 damage

    The 2pc T10 is fucking powerful for fire, useless for arcane.
    4pc is pretty insane for both, I'll need to test it further, probably in ICC this coming Saturday to see the real difference.
    The dps for fire in brackets, is what I concluded to be the real dps, not recounts bastardised version of it, took the overall damage and took my own timer into account to work out dps.

    Overall they're both really close to each other, but remember one thing, I couldn't get a full evocate off which killed my dps as arcane, nothing like 17k normals to make ya QQ.

    With full buffs etc, I'd still say arcane comes ahead slightly, fire would probably win if Blizzard hadn't nerfed it

    PS. Best Mage EU uses addons because he's the best. Bad mages don't use addons.
     
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    Zmirnøff said:
    Results I got.

    Arcane with Arcane Reforges. (Cata gear)
    3 mins 37s
    21996.2 dps
    4790339 damage

    Arcane with Arcane Reforges. (4pc T10 264)
    3 mins 37s
    22302.2 dps
    4829760 damage

    Fire with Fire Reforges. (Cata gear)
    3 min 36s
    17593.6 dps (18162.9 dps)
    3923191 damage

    Fire with Fire Reforges. (4pc T10 264)
    3 mins 36s
    21995.0 dps (22441 dps)
    4847268 damage

    The 2pc T10 is fucking powerful for fire, useless for arcane.
    4pc is pretty insane for both, I'll need to test it further, probably in ICC this coming Saturday to see the real difference.
    The dps for fire in brackets, is what I concluded to be the real dps, not recounts bastardised version of it, took the overall damage and took my own timer into account to work out dps.

    Overall they're both really close to each other, but remember one thing, I couldn't get a full evocate off which killed my dps as arcane, nothing like 17k normals to make ya QQ.

    With full buffs etc, I'd still say arcane comes ahead slightly, fire would probably win if Blizzard hadn't nerfed it

    PS. Best Mage EU uses addons because he's the best. Bad mages don't use addons.
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    You also don't count Molten fury. It's quite likely they'll be even closer, if not fire being ahead because of that. It's the same reason MM hunters have retardedly high dummy dps.
     
    Fire sit arounds 18.7k for 3-4 minutes for me, Arcane at 18.4. 4530 SP 34% Haste 46% Crit as fire 4530 32% Haste 27 mastery as Arcane.

    Fire burst was pushing close to 40k, Arcane only around 30k. and that's with me getting 70-80 AB crits. /shrug
     
    Splosion said:
    Ok, so after playing with some simulationcraft (I love this program), and chardev 9 for fire and chardev 9 for arcane, I get the following numbers:

    Fire: 27029.4 dps
    Arcane: 31282 dps

    Pretty much sums it up right there, I didn't even change the action priority for arcane.
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    Do fire again with the witching hourglass instead? Just because of the big difference in spell power between the 2 BiS gear lists. And it's not like it's a bad trinket for fire.
     
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