PVE TIER LIST
- Thread starter Geras
- Start date
Leek
Legend
At lvl20: (note other than resto and disc i do not solo dungeons as healer) ooze usage not included. I leave out specs i havent played.
S tier
-Guardian druid
-Prot pally
-Prot warrior
-Destro
-Demonology
-Survival
-BM
-Resto sham
A tier
-Shadow priest (fade and mind soothe allows sneaking past mobs in some frequently farmed dungeons)
-Ret paladin
-Enh shaman
-Ele shaman
-Affliction
-Vengeance dh
-Disc Priest
B tier:
-Unholy Dk
-BM monk (damage and tankiness is on the mediocre side but you can solo every boss)
-Arms warrior (talent for leech, fueled by violence) Good damage but survivability can be a bit iffy on certain hard hitting bosses. Very good on bosses that summon adds. Has oh shit button Die by the Sword which can activate Second wind for extra healing.
-Fury warrior (can solo just fine, but damage output is very low, so you may struggle on bosses like Rammstein)
-Blood dk (This spec straddles B and C tier. It can solo every boss ive tried but it requires ALOT of talent swapping depending on bosses. Poo poo dps)
C tier:
-Arcane mage (Can solo the whole of Iron docks with alter time to eat burst damage but that's about it.) Extremely good burst but once you run out of mana you are toast. DO NOT bring to Stratholme.
-Ww monk (can solo some bosses especially those that summon adds but utterly fails if bosses hit hard. Your healing output affects your damage output negatively
-Frost dk (same weaknesses as ww monk, just play unholy or blood)
-Balance druid (nothing much to say, just kinda meh when soloing bosses)
-Feral druid (just play guardian man, but same weakness as ww monk)
-Havoc (with some leech gear you can probably solo some bosses but your survivability relies on lesser soul drop healing rng)
D tier:
F tier:
-ALL ROGUE(however if running ooze they go up to A tier) poor sustained dps. Poor survivabilty. Outlaw can solo certain bosses like first iron docks boss.
-Fire mage (arcane just does everything better)
-frost mage (bosses are mostly immune to cc and freeze so thats also some of your damage gone.)
S tier
-Guardian druid
-Prot pally
-Prot warrior
-Destro
-Demonology
-Survival
-BM
-Resto sham
A tier
-Shadow priest (fade and mind soothe allows sneaking past mobs in some frequently farmed dungeons)
-Ret paladin
-Enh shaman
-Ele shaman
-Affliction
-Vengeance dh
-Disc Priest
B tier:
-Unholy Dk
-BM monk (damage and tankiness is on the mediocre side but you can solo every boss)
-Arms warrior (talent for leech, fueled by violence) Good damage but survivability can be a bit iffy on certain hard hitting bosses. Very good on bosses that summon adds. Has oh shit button Die by the Sword which can activate Second wind for extra healing.
-Fury warrior (can solo just fine, but damage output is very low, so you may struggle on bosses like Rammstein)
-Blood dk (This spec straddles B and C tier. It can solo every boss ive tried but it requires ALOT of talent swapping depending on bosses. Poo poo dps)
C tier:
-Arcane mage (Can solo the whole of Iron docks with alter time to eat burst damage but that's about it.) Extremely good burst but once you run out of mana you are toast. DO NOT bring to Stratholme.
-Ww monk (can solo some bosses especially those that summon adds but utterly fails if bosses hit hard. Your healing output affects your damage output negatively
-Frost dk (same weaknesses as ww monk, just play unholy or blood)
-Balance druid (nothing much to say, just kinda meh when soloing bosses)
-Feral druid (just play guardian man, but same weakness as ww monk)
-Havoc (with some leech gear you can probably solo some bosses but your survivability relies on lesser soul drop healing rng)
D tier:
F tier:
-ALL ROGUE(however if running ooze they go up to A tier) poor sustained dps. Poor survivabilty. Outlaw can solo certain bosses like first iron docks boss.
-Fire mage (arcane just does everything better)
-frost mage (bosses are mostly immune to cc and freeze so thats also some of your damage gone.)
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Cleatuss
Royal Member
I agree with most of this. Blood dk geared can solo anything it just takes for ever as damg is really low. survivability is high so i would say its C - D + your spot on on everything else. And probably right on DK now that I think about it
Geras
Member
BM really better than MM?
Leek
Legend
I don't play MM, so it's not there but from glancing at it i would put it in S or A tier. The hunter specs in general are really strong because of Misdirect allowing your massive damage to retain aggro on pet which boosts survivability.
Geras
Member
example of a BM build ?
CroyeTchor
Member
Tbh your tiering is great, I would only disagree on a few spots
Surv/MM Hunter, Resto Shaman and Guardian Druid are far ahead of the pack. As good as the other S tier are, they can't compare to these 4. I would say aither they get to have an S+ tier or all others go down a tier.
Lemme argue :
Surv is arguably the best spec at 20, crazy damage, can move all the time, top utility with Misdirection, Feign Death, Aspect of the Cheetah/Turtle and great survivability.
MM is a bit lower for me since you have to stand still for Aimed Shot but other than than, same as Surv, only ranged.
Guardian can stealth, this is good. They have the best AoE at level 20, no argument there. Good single target still, quite a bit less than Hunters or Shamans but still better than Prot Pallies/Warriors. Great healing although you don't need it once geared and awesome damage mitigation. Also Brambles can save you from a death when DCed.
Resto Shamans. Ghost Wolf, Stormkeeper, BIG Lightning Bolts and Lava Bursts, crazy healing. Only weakness is the lack of mobility and reliance on Bloodthorn ring for stealth.
I would have def put Destro lock up there but they lack good threat management in WoD dungeons.
From my experience BM damage is inferior to the other two specs but I may just be playing it wrong.
Brewmaster Monks are litteraly auto pilot. Gift of the Ox heals you plenty enough and Staggering Strikes clears Stagger. And by autopilot I mean you litteraly just use whatever damaging ability is off-cooldown and you'll auto-heal and clear Stagger. Damage is meh, you need crit but I don't see how Prot Pallies are S and BM Monks are B. BM Monk is just as good, maybe a bit worse in AoE but not by much.
Also Ret Pally is better than Prot when you get better gear. Especially once you get Rivendare's Blade. Go for Prot early on as you'll die too fast as Ret but when you hit ilvl 70 or so, go for Ret. Prot Pally was top tier in SL but now it's just decent. Would rate it A, lower than Ret
For other healers :
Holy Priest is about as good as Disc, just a little inferior in terms of raw bulk but still plenty tanky enough. Disc is the tankiest class at 20, you can clear instances without taking any damage which no other class can do. Being less tanky than Disc is hardly shameful for Holy. Would rate it low A tier (also, Fade is awesome)
Holy Paladin is worse than Prot but is funny nontheless. If you want efficiency go for Prot while low geared and shift to Ret when you get better gear.
Resto Druid is good. You're surprisingly resilient in Moonkin form but you have meh AoE and you lose DPS by healing. Once again, fun but not optimal, go Guardian.
Mistweaver is meh, you lose too much time healing, thus losing too much DPS. Still fun tho
Okay so now for my take on the list (the first name is the best in the tier, the last is the worst) :
S+ : Surv Hunter, then MM Hunt, then Guardian Druid ex aequo with Resto Shaman
S : Prot Warrior, Destro, Demonology,
A : Disc/Holy Priest, Ret Pally, Enhancement Shaman single target), Ele Shaman (AoE), Shadow Priest, BM Monk, Prot Pally, Vengeance DH, Arms Warrior
B : Unholy/Blood DK, Resto Druid, Holy Paladin, Fury Warrior, Mistweaver, Feral Druid (last 2 are squishier tho) Also Frost DK would qualify for B but is wholly outclassed by Unholy
C : Arcane Mage, Balance Druid, WW Monk
Unviable : Rogues, non-Arcane Mages, Havoc DH (way too squishy)
Haven't classed BM Hunt, haven't played it enough but I would put it in A or low S
P.S. : If we take in consideration how fun Infernal Strike is, Vengeance is S++
Surv/MM Hunter, Resto Shaman and Guardian Druid are far ahead of the pack. As good as the other S tier are, they can't compare to these 4. I would say aither they get to have an S+ tier or all others go down a tier.
Lemme argue :
Surv is arguably the best spec at 20, crazy damage, can move all the time, top utility with Misdirection, Feign Death, Aspect of the Cheetah/Turtle and great survivability.
MM is a bit lower for me since you have to stand still for Aimed Shot but other than than, same as Surv, only ranged.
Guardian can stealth, this is good. They have the best AoE at level 20, no argument there. Good single target still, quite a bit less than Hunters or Shamans but still better than Prot Pallies/Warriors. Great healing although you don't need it once geared and awesome damage mitigation. Also Brambles can save you from a death when DCed.
Resto Shamans. Ghost Wolf, Stormkeeper, BIG Lightning Bolts and Lava Bursts, crazy healing. Only weakness is the lack of mobility and reliance on Bloodthorn ring for stealth.
I would have def put Destro lock up there but they lack good threat management in WoD dungeons.
From my experience BM damage is inferior to the other two specs but I may just be playing it wrong.
Brewmaster Monks are litteraly auto pilot. Gift of the Ox heals you plenty enough and Staggering Strikes clears Stagger. And by autopilot I mean you litteraly just use whatever damaging ability is off-cooldown and you'll auto-heal and clear Stagger. Damage is meh, you need crit but I don't see how Prot Pallies are S and BM Monks are B. BM Monk is just as good, maybe a bit worse in AoE but not by much.
Also Ret Pally is better than Prot when you get better gear. Especially once you get Rivendare's Blade. Go for Prot early on as you'll die too fast as Ret but when you hit ilvl 70 or so, go for Ret. Prot Pally was top tier in SL but now it's just decent. Would rate it A, lower than Ret
For other healers :
Holy Priest is about as good as Disc, just a little inferior in terms of raw bulk but still plenty tanky enough. Disc is the tankiest class at 20, you can clear instances without taking any damage which no other class can do. Being less tanky than Disc is hardly shameful for Holy. Would rate it low A tier (also, Fade is awesome)
Holy Paladin is worse than Prot but is funny nontheless. If you want efficiency go for Prot while low geared and shift to Ret when you get better gear.
Resto Druid is good. You're surprisingly resilient in Moonkin form but you have meh AoE and you lose DPS by healing. Once again, fun but not optimal, go Guardian.
Mistweaver is meh, you lose too much time healing, thus losing too much DPS. Still fun tho
Okay so now for my take on the list (the first name is the best in the tier, the last is the worst) :
S+ : Surv Hunter, then MM Hunt, then Guardian Druid ex aequo with Resto Shaman
S : Prot Warrior, Destro, Demonology,
A : Disc/Holy Priest, Ret Pally, Enhancement Shaman single target), Ele Shaman (AoE), Shadow Priest, BM Monk, Prot Pally, Vengeance DH, Arms Warrior
B : Unholy/Blood DK, Resto Druid, Holy Paladin, Fury Warrior, Mistweaver, Feral Druid (last 2 are squishier tho) Also Frost DK would qualify for B but is wholly outclassed by Unholy
C : Arcane Mage, Balance Druid, WW Monk
Unviable : Rogues, non-Arcane Mages, Havoc DH (way too squishy)
Haven't classed BM Hunt, haven't played it enough but I would put it in A or low S
P.S. : If we take in consideration how fun Infernal Strike is, Vengeance is S++
toskosa
Grandfathered
Gonna go ahead and say resto shaman is s+ its impossible to lose as this spec if you come from a civilization that has discovered fire. Amazing damage, solid aoe, good movement with ghost woof a ranged short cd kick, The highest burst in the bracket, strong armour thanks to mail+ shield and finally really good healing. Half the time when I do a dungeon run on my shaman solo mobs dont even require me to do more then earth shield and riptide.
Enzi
Grandfathered
usually yes, but for very, very hard hitting mobs is BM the king and for everything else, SV > MM in my opinion
Dragonstormy
Member
Never played shamy, but more Burst Dmg than a Glass Cannon, Lone Wolf MM Hunter with critical hits? Hold up now I'm listening! Seems like I should start a shaman.
I don't know much about the Dmg Output of BM Hunter compared to the other specs, but I think they lost a Burst with the DF Talentrees (Bestial Wrath - I don't know how well the new gained passive %dmg abilities on the trees compensate for), but it's definitly the tankiest spec, so you can even clear the hardest Bosses.
About MM Hunter... Well you can say their dmg output is kinda bursty since DF, because in long fights (Boss or big pulls) you lack a bit on focus regeneration, as your steady shot doesn't recover focus automatically. Survival is much better in that term, you can spam attacks most of the time.
Let's not talk about survivability, all specs are more than you could wish for. As MM you just can't pull that much, but in that case you have to be careful with all three specs I guess (with SV having the biggest pull capacity tho)
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Cleatuss
Royal Member
My resto Sham is hitting 6K Insta cast crits and I’m not fully geared the way I want to be not even closeNever played shamy, but more Burst Dmg than a Glass Cannon, Lone Wolf MM Hunter with critical hits? Hold up now I'm listening! Seems like I should start a shaman.
I don't know much about the Dmg Output of BM Hunter compared to the other specs, but I think they lost a Burst with the DF Talentrees (Bestial Wrath - I don't know how well the new gained passive %dmg abilities on the trees compensate for), but it's definitly the tankiest spec, so you can even clear the hardest Bosses.
About MM Hunter... Well you can say their dmg output is kinda bursty since DF, because in long fights (Boss or big pulls) you lack a bit on focus regeneration, as your steady shot doesn't recover focus automatically. Survival is much better in that term, you can spam attacks most of the time.
Let's not talk about survivability, all specs are more than you could wish for. As MM you just can't pull that much, but in that case you have to be careful with all three specs I guess (with SS having the biggest pull capacity tho)
Leek
Legend
Could be, the three of them should be a walk in a park as long as not all 3 of them are attacking you.
Firstly you want to stack mastery on survival (the mastery scaling for raptor strike is busted and mastery grants you a passive hp regen that can be significant to your survival.
Next, the order you attack matters. Your biggest threat is Makogg, so take him out first. When starting your pull, use Kill Command on Makogg to at least get some aggro going on your pet. When you are ready to burst, use misdirect and do your burst damage, the threat on your pet should be high enough to last you till misdirect comes off cd.
Once Makogg is dead, aim for Ariok next, she's the second biggest threat casting blood bolts for ~190 damage. You want to kill her first because depending on your damage she may begin to cast a blood shield on the lowest hp person (normally shouldn't happen because surv damage is busted).
Finally kill the little shit, she barely does any damage.
Dragonstormy
Member
Ok wow, I'm also not fully geared, missing some WF and gems, but if use mastery trinket (only one) my crit aimshot is 3 - 3.1k, and even with 2/2 Careful Aim (I usually use Rapid Fire) I would have only 3.7k aimshots.