Any point?

Zedqt

Grandfathered
Is there any point to twinking on retail anymore? The damage scaling is so ludicrous it feels like all my characters that I put so much work into just got shafted and the gear doesn't even matter anymore. Everyone dies so fast in every bracket that weapon enchants don't even get a chance to proc it seems.

My rogue who has a bunch of GF shit and really good gear just got absolutely shit on by a leveling mage in heirlooms because I got hit with arcane missiles and was too far away to kick it and I no longer have cloak to protect myself. Meanwhile my Eviscerate/Dispatchs hit for like 400 damage at 5cp and then a warlock chaos bolt just does 5k damage. Everything is so shit if you aren't one of the lucky classes that blizzard just decided not to give a fuck about when level squishing and damage scaling. The game just feels like shit to play now. It wasn't good pre-squish either, but a post-squish world is awful.

I'm now getting actual 29 queues, with my XP off (maybe it's f2p queues?), but it feels pointless. Everything and everyone is so fucking bursty now. I doubt wargames are any better, if not worse with huge amount of class stacking garbage.

Maybe I'll go 70 twink again when Classic Cata comes out.
 
We can only hope DF breathes life back into the 20 bracket.
I haven’t done any PvP for almost a month. It’s just so broken right now - when a Crit from an Aimed Shot can do 120% of ur health pool…… just not worth it…..
Oh please fix our beloved bracket Blizz……:FrogeConcern:
 
Get off these forums and join the fight.
  • Beta/PTR bug reports
  • In development wow forum postings
  • “Billing problem” support cases and ask them to remove newly created starter edition accounts.
 
I don't really feel its much different that it was at 20. Premades still ruined almost all of the 20s games (I don't know what the delusion is of denying this is), pocket hunters still were the issue, just like they are now at 29. None of the core issues went away, and most of them are exactly the same/better than they were at 20.

However at 29, all of the non S tier melee have more abilities that let you actually play... it feels like you can actually play monk/ret/enhance etc. (as far as them having actual pvp mobility and not just lumbering around) without just hoping you are on a carry team or paying 4mil for speed gear. It's actually not that bad.

Yeah it sucks to wait 20 minutes at 29 and then find out you are just facing some premade nerd squad as opposed to the 6 minutes you had to at 20, but when the games are good... they are 100% better than they were at 20. But, the result is usually the same, at 20 sometimes you just had all levelers or FTP that did not want to get real gear and they were just 1 shot fodder anyway.

If the queues were still 6 minutes I don't think anybody would be complaining as much.. the 20s just replaced the levelers as the cannon fodder.
 
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JadeFire said:
I don't really feel its much different that it was at 20. Premades still ruined almost all of the 20s games (I don't know what the delusion is of denying this is), pocket hunters still were the issue, just like they are now at 29. None of the core issues went away, and most of them are exactly the same/better than they were at 20.

However at 29, all of the non S tier melee have more abilities that let you actually play... it feels like you can actually play monk/ret/enhance etc. (as far as them having actual pvp mobility and not just lumbering around) without just hoping you are on a carry team or paying 4mil for speed gear. It's actually not that bad.

Yeah it sucks to wait 20 minutes at 29 and then find out you are just facing some premade nerd squad as opposed to the 6 minutes you had to at 20, but when the games are good... they are 100% better than they were at 20. But, the result is usually the same, at 20 sometimes you just had all levelers or FTP that did not want to get real gear and they were just 1 shot fodder anyway.

If the queues were still 6 minutes I don't think anybody would be complaining as much.. the 20s just replaced the levelers as the cannon fodder.
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I come from 70s. I didn't play that 20s garbage because it was just 1 shot garbage, and now it's even worse. If you aren't a mage, hunter, or warlock you basically may as well not play. Outlaw does absolutely nothing and sub has some utility, but I can't even get someone down to less than half health before they just turned around and 1 shot me. Maybe rogues are just underperforming, but 70s used to have actual fights with actual strategy and not just be "who gets to 1 shot first?" Even back before the squish 20 hybrids were able to heal through the burstiness and now you die from the burst if you even have 1 second of CC on you, even maxing versatility/stamina.

I just queued for a bg, went to a 20 f2p (non-vet) druid. Opened on them with my sub opener, entire shadow dance combo, etc. He got tickled. My damage was so little it was pathetic, but there was literally no other buttons I could press. I was tapped out. Mage comes from behind me and kills me in a single missiles proc. The squish ruined low level pvp, pve, fucking everything. Classic it is.
 
Zedqt said:
I come from 70s. I didn't play that 20s garbage because it was just 1 shot garbage, and now it's even worse. If you aren't a mage, hunter, or warlock you basically may as well not play. Outlaw does absolutely nothing and sub has some utility, but I can't even get someone down to less than half health before they just turned around and 1 shot me. Maybe rogues are just underperforming, but 70s used to have actual fights with actual strategy and not just be "who gets to 1 shot first?" Even back before the squish 20 hybrids were able to heal through the burstiness and now you die from the burst if you even have 1 second of CC on you, even maxing versatility/stamina.

I just queued for a bg, went to a 20 f2p (non-vet) druid. Opened on them with my sub opener, entire shadow dance combo, etc. He got tickled. My damage was so little it was pathetic, but there was literally no other buttons I could press. I was tapped out. Mage comes from behind me and kills me in a single missiles proc. The squish ruined low level pvp, pve, fucking everything. Classic it is.
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Why do I feel like I'm arguing with myself :p.

Well I mean, that's how the levelers felt and even worse. I'm not gonna lie, sure its just pocket healed back and forth, but I mean, again, that's all it was at 20s... it was who had the most hunters/pockets (the rule, there are exceptions) and not levelers... not its just who has the most hunters and not 20s.

Was just in 3... hunters back and forth... horde had more heals for 2... then an EotS and ally had 2 giant heals, carried the hunters... ally won. All the games are just that way... but that was not any different back at 20.

If you don't want to make a 29, sure... the option is just grind it or delete, or wait for Blizzard to give a shit.
 
JadeFire said:
Why do I feel like I'm arguing with myself :p.

Well I mean, that's how the levelers felt and even worse. I'm not gonna lie, sure its just pocket healed back and forth, but I mean, again, that's all it was at 20s... it was who had the most hunters and not levelers... not its just who has the most hunters and not 20s.

Was just in 3... hunters back and forth... horde had more heals for 2... then an EotS and ally had 2 giant heals, carried the hunters... ally won. All the games are just that way... but that was not any different at 20.

If you don't want to make a 29, sure... the option is just grind it or delete, or wait for Blizzard to give a shit.
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I'm just upset that my 70s have basically been completely obliterated. Unable to even do TBC raids IIRC (at least, they were at level 30 when the squish first happened, don't know if that has changed). My rogue has a bunch of GF stuff, glaives, sunwell gear, heroic gear, you name it. I had fun both pveing and pvping, I had fun doing 2s at 70, I had fun dueling outside org/stormwind. The game feels hopeless now, at least for this bracket and I doubt Blizzard cares enough to make it better in Dragonflight and wants to just focus on shoving people to endgame.

I even went to the trouble of getting the heart of azeroth unlocked and the 3 ilvl64 head/chest/shoulder armor, and I logged in a few days ago to realize that the gear I had equipped was patched and no longer giving me stats.
 
Zedqt said:
I'm just upset that my 70s have basically been completely obliterated. Unable to even do TBC raids IIRC (at least, they were at level 30 when the squish first happened, don't know if that has changed). My rogue has a bunch of GF stuff, glaives, sunwell gear, heroic gear, you name it. I had fun both pveing and pvping, I had fun doing 2s at 70, I had fun dueling outside org/stormwind. The game feels hopeless now, at least for this bracket and I doubt Blizzard cares enough to make it better in Dragonflight and wants to just focus on shoving people to endgame.

I even went to the trouble of getting the heart of azeroth unlocked and the 3 ilvl64 head/chest/shoulder armor, and I logged in a few days ago to realize that the gear I had equipped was patched and no longer giving me stats.
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I'd just wait, because it is what it is. Or you can level up your 27 to 29 like tons of people did and then just get the better gear.
 
JadeFire said:
I thought you were wearing trash. I mean some i37s are better, BUT you should not be having trouble killing dudes. Seen plenty of rogues do work with less.
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I'm hitting like 100 damage cp builder crits and 500 evis/dispatch. This does not feel right. Also my energy in anything other than sub is starved all the time. Without a good roll the bones I can't even build 5cp to kidney off of a cheapshot while playing outlaw.
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Warglave said:
:kekD:

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There have been 1 shots yes, but there were ways around most of them. Like playing well. Also it requires buff stacking and trinket nonsense and tazik/synapse springs and whatever other nonsense existed back then. Nothing can stop the OP classes now. Mage just keeps hitting missiles. Hunter just keeps hitting aimed shot. Warlock just keeps shadowburning and casting uninterruptable chaos bolts.
 
Zedqt said:
I'm hitting like 100 damage cp builder crits and 500 evis/dispatch. This does not feel right. Also my energy in anything other than sub is starved all the time. Without a good roll the bones I can't even build 5cp to kidney off of a cheapshot while playing outlaw.
[doublepost=1665365654,1665365541][/doublepost]
There have been 1 shots yes, but there were ways around most of them. Like playing well. Also it requires buff stacking and trinket nonsense and tazik/synapse springs and whatever other nonsense existed back then. Nothing can stop the OP classes now. Mage just keeps hitting missiles. Hunter just keeps hitting aimed shot. Warlock just keeps shadowburning and casting uninterruptable chaos bolts.
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I'll be honest, you are talking to the wrong person. I hear you and yes that damage is balls. But, I have seen some people pull off 80k+ games with a rogue. I don't know the details of what they were doing... maybe it they were just games where they were on a hard 20s FTP farm.

On average Rogue is not going to be spectacular in the damage department... it was a class that did not gain much from the 20>29 leap raw damage wise. You just have to do more "rogue" stuff.
 
JadeFire said:
I'll be honest, you are talking to the wrong person. I hear you and yes that damage is balls. But, I have seen some people pull off 80k+ games with a rogue. I don't know the details of what they were doing... maybe it they were just games where they were on a hard 20s FTP farm.

On average Rogue is not going to be spectacular in the damage department... it was a class that did not gain much from the 20>29 leap raw damage wise. You just have to do more "rogue" stuff.
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Rogue I feel got super gutted with the squish. Lost their energy regeneration passives for all 3 specs (sub is okay because you have a 30 or 45 second cd that gives you energy), lost cloak of shadows, blind, wound poison, crippling poison, and their sprint is on a longer CD. Sub lost shadow blades, outlaw adrenaline rush, etc. Once I've used vanish and evasion I basically have nothing to protect myself from the onslaught of hunters. Those 80k games were definitely against f2p and probably with a pocket healer or two.
 
If current rogue is not for you then maybe reroll something else. It takes less than a day, more or less.

Just dont hop on the wagon of "X class beat mine so that's what I'll play" that brought you here whining about it. Hell, there's even a 50% XP buff going on now.... but if you're set on rogue, try not lumping every other class in with it. Lots are actually ok.

Or just hop over to wrath classic until DF launches cuz that's included with your sub. Good for some killing time.
 
Warglave said:
If current rogue is not for you then maybe reroll something else. It takes less than a day, more or less.

Just dont hop on the wagon of "X class beat mine so that's what I'll play" that brought you here whining about it. Hell, there's even a 50% XP buff going on now.... but if you're set on rogue, try not lumping every other class in with it. Lots are actually ok.

Or just hop over to wrath classic until DF launches cuz that's included with your sub. Good for some killing time.
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It's not just rogue to be fair though. There is a clear divide between the S tier classes and the rest of the stuff. There has always been "tiers" in 70s (and every bracket), but it's never felt like such a complete waste of time other than 1v1ing healers. Why play anything but the classes that can consistently do 3k+ damage with 1 ability?
 
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