80 arena vs. Twink arena (or pvp in general)

[Deadhed]

As an avid twinker in my latter days, i never got into end game at all. This changed with the release of BoA gear. Since the release, I have develooped an ever-growing addiction to both of my level 80 characters. The polls specifically say PvP, but if you do twink PvE and you would like to express that you enjoy level 80 more, you may do so.

 

[Sanit]

While the idea of jumping into 80 PvE or PvP really gets me excited, there are some flaws in Blizzards gearing system (at least that's what I'd like to call them.) If you're like me and take forever to get from 1-60, 70, or 80, you're going to be behind gear wise. While lagging behind with gear in 80 PvP you limit your partners and are really restricted to just playing for points for a few weeks. PvE is the same way. Really not sure of the names of alot of the early 80 PvE raids, so I'm gonna just use Naxx as an example. The only real chance to gear up for higher end content is going through the lower instances. With the growing amount of people looking for higher "gear scores" it makes it even harder for the fresh 80 to get into a group to get some gear.



All I'm trying to say is that you really have to be on top of leveling to stay current gear wise. With a twink it's much easier to jump right into things. There is no required gear score to jump into a PuG WSG or a skirmish arena. Now with the ability to halt XP gains it gives us the option of even running instances. It might just be me, but I'm not a huge fan of the constant gear grind. After a while it gets boring and redundant so I'd much rather play a twink where once it's geared, I'm done until new gear comes out or old gear is updated (e.g. Satchel of Goods, Spirit being turned into Hit or Crit etc)



Going to expand on the Gear Score topic...



I can understand people wanting geared players for their raids, really I can. However, when people with 2,485 Gear Scores are getting turned away because they don't have 2.5k I have an issue with it. It amazes me that some people are so quick to judge by the "score" of a persons gear. Some people are just blind to the fact that gear != skill. There are plenty of players that got carried through content and still can't pull a reasonable amount of DPS with gear from the highest end raids.



Another little reminder: My experience with 80s is limited and probably always will be. I was never a huge PvE fan to begin with so it might bias my opinion a bit. Statements I have made might be a bit broad, but that's only because I'm really pretty clueless when it comes to instance names, actual gear scores, average DPS for a well geared character etc.

 

[Falkor]

While the idea of jumping into 80 PvE or PvP really gets me excited, there are some flaws in Blizzards gearing system (at least that's what I'd like to call them.) If you're like me and take forever to get from 1-60, 70, or 80, you're going to be behind gear wise. While lagging behind with gear in 80 PvP you limit your partners and are really restricted to just playing for points for a few weeks. PvE is the same way. Really not sure of the names of alot of the early 80 PvE raids, so I'm gonna just use Naxx as an example. The only real chance to gear up for higher end content is going through the lower instances. With the growing amount of people looking for higher "gear scores" it makes it even harder for the fresh 80 to get into a group to get some gear.

ive always loved pve. like pvp in vanilla, but not in bc or lk b/c its all premades with glad gear against me (with a pug ofc) and my main is a pve boomkin, so not really the greatest experience....oh well.

for arena or pve though the system isnt flawed imo. for pvp you can get gear via badges, pve (voa), or honor/honor+arena pts. i think that is a lot of chances to get some starter gear, the rest is all skill imo.



for pve its super easy to gear up since everything drops conquest badges - and soon triumph - so then you can easily get into toc 10 if you just read the strats on wowhead/wowwiki and dont look like a noob. now a days you can completely bypass naxx/os/eoe/ulduar and just gear up off badges. its not as fun, but its possible. then you can always go back and do older instances when you out gear them if you want (or get upgrades in ulduar 25 hardmodes...rare but possible since thats ilvl 239 and toc 10 is only 232). in pve ask questions, use vent, make friends for raids/heroics, etc. raiding is ez mode. i have always really liked endgame pve and its never been easier to gear than now.

I can understand people wanting geared players for their raids, really I can. However, when people with 2,485 Gear Scores are getting turned away because they don't have 2.5k I have an issue with it. It amazes me that some people are so quick to judge by the "score" of a persons gear. Some people are just blind to the fact that gear != skill. There are plenty of players that got carried through content and still can't pull a reasonable amount of DPS with gear from the highest end raids.

totally agree here. as a boomkin ive been out dps'd by mages with lower gear scores. and im not a noob, i have my rotation down pat, 4700 gear score. but still just cant compete with mages @ the t9 lvl. most raids i go with prefer a certain score (ex. 10/25 toc - but a lot of the time we take ppl with lower gs and just see if they can pull their weight). i definitely dont just judge off of gs, i know 1st hand that gear =/= skill. the only reason i downloaded the gs addon in the 1st place was so i could message ppl forming raids who look for stupid shit like that and not have to respond 'uh idk my gs...tell me?' also it gives me an eboner when i see people with lower gs XD

 

[Falkor]

As an avid twinker in my latter days, i never got into end game at all. This changed with the release of BoA gear. Since the release, I have develooped an ever-growing addiction to both of my level 80 characters. The polls specifically say PvP, but if you do twink PvE and you would like to express that you enjoy level 80 more, you may do so.

for pvp definitely prefer 49 pvp. no dks. balanced. fun. 80 sucks, especially as a moonkin and i refuse to go resto for arena or anything.



pve at 80 is fun, but its like heroin...always gonna be chasin that dragon - gear - and never quite catchin it.

 

[Ohnooz]

Where are the 60/70 twink arenas? ^.^







I'm serious, even tho 29 arena is fun and all, I've never had much more fun than outside of 3v3s in the 60s, complete with Demo Locks blowing up Ret Pallys to a Rogue then 1shotting the lock with a premed -> Ambush -> Evis to a Elem Shaman Flame Shocking -> LB -> CL -> Elem Mastery -> LB the Rogue all within 2.3sec (Haste is sexy fyi), and then their Warrior charge -> MS -> HSing the Elem shammy before he Thunderstorms, then Intersepting and poping BS, leaving it to a 1v1 of Priest Healer v Arms War with BS on CD.



TD:LR - 60 arena is awesome.

 

[Powerglove]

theres nowhere to go with 39s. at 80 theres always a ton of people that are better than you

 

[Deadhed]

Where are the 60/70 twink arenas? ^.^







I'm serious, even tho 29 arena is fun and all, I've never had much more fun than outside of 3v3s in the 60s, complete with Demo Locks blowing up Ret Pallys to a Rogue then 1shotting the lock with a premed -> Ambush -> Evis to a Elem Shaman Flame Shocking -> LB -> CL -> Elem Mastery -> LB the Rogue all within 2.3sec (Haste is sexy fyi), and then their Warrior charge -> MS -> HSing the Elem shammy before he Thunderstorms, then Intersepting and poping BS, leaving it to a 1v1 of Priest Healer v Arms War with BS on CD.



TL;DR - 60 arena is awesome.

fixed and about how many queues you get in a year?

 

[Hurpdurp]

Where are the 60/70 twink arenas? ^.^







I'm serious, even tho 29 arena is fun and all, I've never had much more fun than outside of 3v3s in the 60s, complete with Demo Locks blowing up Ret Pallys to a Rogue then 1shotting the lock with a premed -> Ambush -> Evis to a Elem Shaman Flame Shocking -> LB -> CL -> Elem Mastery -> LB the Rogue all within 2.3sec (Haste is sexy fyi), and then their Warrior charge -> MS -> HSing the Elem shammy before he Thunderstorms, then Intersepting and poping BS, leaving it to a 1v1 of Priest Healer v Arms War with BS on CD.



TD:LR - 60 arena is awesome.

You're talking about 60 arena? Lava Burst is 75.

 

[encorebroz]

if it was 70 maybe id say yes but 80 now is soo bad

 

[ArthurianKnight]

thats why people need the emblem system, its easier to gear yourself in PVP by the emblem system by running heroics then trying to get groups for anything else.



lots of 80 like myself and a few friend are not doing raids due to their higher gear specification. and the fact that we run heroics makes it easy for us to support lower geared level 80. also with the coming of 3.3 heroics will get farmed again and again for new tier 9 gears and that means it will be time for those new 80 to follow thru heroics and actually get geared.



i like the fact that PVP and PVE can both be geared by the heroic farming of emblems. and i think it just gives a whole new way of getting geared if you dont want your ranking to go down that fast at first. i also like the fact that blizzard is now forcing people into 3v3 and 5v5 instead of just the 2v2 with no real strategies. 2v2 was cool and all, but it was too hard to begin with because some combos were just better then others, while 3v3 and 5v5 actually asked you to think before the fight and whatever the combo you choose there is another combo that is at least better at taking you down.



i love how PVP has become, and it seriously was about time. blizzard have started with 3.1 to bring back balance and have not stopped since then. thats what i'm talking about. wrath killed the pvp, but since 3.1 PVP has become more and more balanced again. now its fun seeing how far one can go.



the only thing i deplore the most is that back then... a PVE geared DPS had a chance against a PVP geared guy, but today if you dont have minimum 900 resillience you are just fish food. i think blizzard system should change to let resillience be less and less necessary and let it become a personnal choice instead of a necessity !

 

[Eliot]

Why would we play twinks if 80 PvP was better?



Well...maybe you're just lazy like I am.

 

[Deadhed]

i was always into twinking but ever since blizz fucked us over, end game has been all i do on WoW.

 

[Falkor]

i was always into twinking but ever since blizz fucked us over, end game has been all i do on WoW.

samesiez



lvling my 65 pally and 70 warrior atm for more faceroll dps @ 80

 

[Evade]

Level 80 PvP for sure. Skill > Gear. I have recently began doing arena on my priest and I'm loving every minute. When I started in full savage gear, I managed to get a 1250 2s rating. If I can do it, then you can do it. What I found is that sometimes a UI overhaul is what you need. Just that alone as helped me bunches.



Having said all of that. I still love twinking. Mostly level one twinks. It puts more emphasis on player movement than anything.

 

[Falkor]

"skill > gear"



BAHAHAHAHA. WHAT?!



definitely gear > skill which is why people in sick pve gear can still smash people not fully glad geared....its all about the resil which is the one stat i hate the most. wtb vanilla pvp! you would have done better in ulduarish gear compared to savage imo.

obviously if gear is equal than skill (or RNG) is the deciding factor, but gear gives a definite edge.



2s sucks anyways, which is why blizz is putting the focus on 3s and 5s soon.

 

[Ohnooz]

You're talking about 60 arena? Lava Burst is 75.

Lightning Bolt

 

[Falkor]

you talkin bout practice?!



[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exOxUAntx8I&feature=related[/ame]

 

[Falkor]

delete this double post?

 

[Evade]

umm no. savage is better than pve gear at that time. Remember when the match starts I am target #1. I need all the survivability I can get.

 

[ArthurianKnight]

Why would we play twinks if 80 PvP was better?



Well...maybe you're just lazy like I am.

i can easily answer you that one, because there are way too much abilities at 80 and you dont want to lose a fight by having forgotten that you had such an ability against that one ability that killed you.



seriously 80 is also twinking dude.

and in everything... SKill is better then gears. of course gears have their place, this is an RPG after all, but i easily saw people one season behind being still able to win against the all mighty. in arenas, i got owned back then by a bunch of tier dungeon 3 geared players in arena and i was full season 1. i really sucked that day so my skills were lacking badly.



without skills... and by that we mean knowing your class well and how to react in certain situation, will and is better then how the guy is geared. exemple...

a shaman comes and starts by flame shock, he will do lava burst next, i silence him with my DK during his cast... in this exemple is the gear really doing a difference ? not at all, i stopped his lava burst because i know my class. if only gears were important, this game PVP wouldn'T even have started to begin with.



character dont move by themselves or dont act by themselves. unless its a bot playing at your place.



so to your question the answer is quite easy, its the same as why i started playing twinks to begin with... lot less abilities to watch for, easier time PVPing.