39 priest
- Thread starter NoOoO
- Start date
elesian
OG
Depends on how advanced or a player you are, and if it's WSG or arena oriented. If its WSG you will need a mix of disc/holy.
The World of Warcraft Armory - along these lines is your cookie cutter build. You need to be tough and durable - this is where Innerfire + glyph comes in. Improved PWS + glyph + Imp Renew take off the pressure somewhat, whilst still retaining good mana efficiency with absolution and 12% more intellect.
As a priest the key word is utility, you need to be heavy on dispells as well as playing offensively. You are never going to take the place of a holy paladin or resto druid in WSG - or arena for that matter, you are a support healer but provide great utility.
You can improve your healing through holy, but you just do not have the survivability, and apart from PS you have no peels on your own. The World of Warcraft Armory - this may work, it's a crit oriented build, with stronger heals, desperate prayer, greater range and improved mana efficiency on healing. With a bit of crit stacking you could be at 15% crit on Holy fire.
The other option is holy aggressive The World of Warcraft Armory - it offers some survivability, improved crit and sp, range on holyfire and increased damage on holy spells, as well as desperate prayer. Pretty viable.
Shadow. I think it can work for arena, i'm actually trialing it with my arena partner right now. The World of Warcraft Armory - mindflay, PS reduced cd, and silence as well as vampiric embrace, whilst retaining the survivability from disc. It also frees up some hit enchants. The downsides are the mana efficiency.
Syncosan is nicely geared from the EU pool. I would strongly recommend taking the glyphs of Innerfire + Renew/PW:S.
The World of Warcraft Armory - along these lines is your cookie cutter build. You need to be tough and durable - this is where Innerfire + glyph comes in. Improved PWS + glyph + Imp Renew take off the pressure somewhat, whilst still retaining good mana efficiency with absolution and 12% more intellect.
As a priest the key word is utility, you need to be heavy on dispells as well as playing offensively. You are never going to take the place of a holy paladin or resto druid in WSG - or arena for that matter, you are a support healer but provide great utility.
You can improve your healing through holy, but you just do not have the survivability, and apart from PS you have no peels on your own. The World of Warcraft Armory - this may work, it's a crit oriented build, with stronger heals, desperate prayer, greater range and improved mana efficiency on healing. With a bit of crit stacking you could be at 15% crit on Holy fire.
The other option is holy aggressive The World of Warcraft Armory - it offers some survivability, improved crit and sp, range on holyfire and increased damage on holy spells, as well as desperate prayer. Pretty viable.
Shadow. I think it can work for arena, i'm actually trialing it with my arena partner right now. The World of Warcraft Armory - mindflay, PS reduced cd, and silence as well as vampiric embrace, whilst retaining the survivability from disc. It also frees up some hit enchants. The downsides are the mana efficiency.
Syncosan is nicely geared from the EU pool. I would strongly recommend taking the glyphs of Innerfire + Renew/PW:S.
Alteffour
OG
Im gonna go out on a limb and state that priest builds without Improved Mana Burn are generally bad specs.
In fact Im pretty sure that all of the above specs are terrible, and that the "cookie cutter" build isnt cookie cutter at all.
Two that I use (within a point or two talent wise) would be
19/11 Arena
http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc...000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
and
28/2 general use
http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc...000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
Also.
Renew glyph is a must. Innerfire is kinda bleh imo unless you only play vs melee all the time. Renew + Dispell glyph are still your best overall glyphs. The heal from the PW:S bubble is nothing compared to the amount of heals you get from a game/arena worth of dispells. Speccing into Disc in all of those builds just to get imp innerfire is really hilarious though.
In fact Im pretty sure that all of the above specs are terrible, and that the "cookie cutter" build isnt cookie cutter at all.
Two that I use (within a point or two talent wise) would be
19/11 Arena
http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc...000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
and
28/2 general use
http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc...000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
Also.
Renew glyph is a must. Innerfire is kinda bleh imo unless you only play vs melee all the time. Renew + Dispell glyph are still your best overall glyphs. The heal from the PW:S bubble is nothing compared to the amount of heals you get from a game/arena worth of dispells. Speccing into Disc in all of those builds just to get imp innerfire is really hilarious though.
Druiddroid
OG
28/2/0 seems to be the FOTM (or FOTY..) spec for WSG priests
elesian
OG
The only thing that can burst you fast as a Priest is a Rogue or Arms Warrior. Hunter's you can invariably LOS, and the same goes for Mages. If a Warrior or a Rogue is nuking you, all you can rely on is your partner for a peel or PS. Improved Inner Fire is a MUST in 39 arena. With the glyph and talents your running around with 30-35% armour, with enough charges to last you most games.
Taking a disc build with out IPWS, or Mental Stength leaves you with more stress on your mana pool, and too much pressure to heal through times when PWS is not up. The glyph of PWS obviously compliments the talents and reduced CD. Reduced CD on PWS means the Rogue has more opportunities to vanish inside it.
Dispel glyph gives 3% of maximum HP, so on a 3k HP Rogue, that's 90HP per Dispel. Improved PWS shield + glyph gives 20% of 440HP. Which is 88hp. As for which is better is a preference. Dispel is going to give more overall healing HOWEVER, PWS is not consuming a GCD and is healing over a greater time range. An argument for PWS iS, the 20% is ALWAYS coming when you are under damage, where the dispel healing may or may not be occuring on damage taken. The converse is that Dispel is going to provide more overall healing.
Silent resolve is a talent which I'm not sold by at this level, in the same way I'm not fully convinced by the druid talent Subtlety. At 80 you can afford to take these talents, but at 39 there are better talents available which do not rely on RNG. (Mental agility should always be taken over absolution, unsure why i specced in those 3 points).
The first build I stick by, just with a switch in Mental Agility. Priest builds at this level are very dependant on the arena partner. I play rogue, so for us we play super aggressive, but at the same time if we do get counter CC'd i know he can last, as can I, with nearly 3400hp buffed. I might even consider The World of Warcraft Armory - Improved Mana Burn should be taken but generally our games go along the lines of either full CC control or getting the opposite healer to blow their mana pool healing. My Priest generally uses his mana to burst/dispel only. If you are running a more defensive setup, Imp Mana Burn is not optional.
The second build is a holy healing crit build. Generally we are using lesser heal where possible. It provides good mana efficiency, range and crit, with a good compromise in survivability.
Third build is aimed at max damage, range, crit, and casting speed on Holy Fire. It's purely an aggressive build.
The fourth build is great - it's something a little different to your normal builds. What you are looking at is a high survivability/CC build with the staples of mindflay, silence and reduced CD on PS. If you are good with co-ordinating CC it's a great build, but provides good survivability. The VI works as a weak renew, and it's an AOE heal.
The trick at 39 is to consider what you are playing with. The ideal partner for a Priest is a Rogue, and at 39 this is no exception. Very few teams can beat it if played properly, and the specs above are tailored to that. Please have more respect before you talk about 'terrible' builds without considering the thought process behind it.
Taking a disc build with out IPWS, or Mental Stength leaves you with more stress on your mana pool, and too much pressure to heal through times when PWS is not up. The glyph of PWS obviously compliments the talents and reduced CD. Reduced CD on PWS means the Rogue has more opportunities to vanish inside it.
Dispel glyph gives 3% of maximum HP, so on a 3k HP Rogue, that's 90HP per Dispel. Improved PWS shield + glyph gives 20% of 440HP. Which is 88hp. As for which is better is a preference. Dispel is going to give more overall healing HOWEVER, PWS is not consuming a GCD and is healing over a greater time range. An argument for PWS iS, the 20% is ALWAYS coming when you are under damage, where the dispel healing may or may not be occuring on damage taken. The converse is that Dispel is going to provide more overall healing.
Silent resolve is a talent which I'm not sold by at this level, in the same way I'm not fully convinced by the druid talent Subtlety. At 80 you can afford to take these talents, but at 39 there are better talents available which do not rely on RNG. (Mental agility should always be taken over absolution, unsure why i specced in those 3 points).
The first build I stick by, just with a switch in Mental Agility. Priest builds at this level are very dependant on the arena partner. I play rogue, so for us we play super aggressive, but at the same time if we do get counter CC'd i know he can last, as can I, with nearly 3400hp buffed. I might even consider The World of Warcraft Armory - Improved Mana Burn should be taken but generally our games go along the lines of either full CC control or getting the opposite healer to blow their mana pool healing. My Priest generally uses his mana to burst/dispel only. If you are running a more defensive setup, Imp Mana Burn is not optional.
The second build is a holy healing crit build. Generally we are using lesser heal where possible. It provides good mana efficiency, range and crit, with a good compromise in survivability.
Third build is aimed at max damage, range, crit, and casting speed on Holy Fire. It's purely an aggressive build.
The fourth build is great - it's something a little different to your normal builds. What you are looking at is a high survivability/CC build with the staples of mindflay, silence and reduced CD on PS. If you are good with co-ordinating CC it's a great build, but provides good survivability. The VI works as a weak renew, and it's an AOE heal.
The trick at 39 is to consider what you are playing with. The ideal partner for a Priest is a Rogue, and at 39 this is no exception. Very few teams can beat it if played properly, and the specs above are tailored to that. Please have more respect before you talk about 'terrible' builds without considering the thought process behind it.
Alteffour
OG
"Improved Inner Fire is a MUST in 39 arena. "
no wrong
"Taking a disc build with out IPWS, or Mental Stength leaves you with more stress on your mana pool, and too much pressure to heal through times when PWS is not up. The glyph of PWS obviously compliments the talents and reduced CD. Reduced CD on PWS means the Rogue has more opportunities to vanish inside it."
bad priest is bad
"PWS is not consuming a GCD "
lol
"Silent resolve is a talent which I'm not sold by at this level"
gl vs other priests or shaman teams
"I play rogue, so for us we play super aggressive, but at the same time if we do get counter CC'd i know he can last, as can I, with nearly 3400hp buffed."
this is why 19/11 and not those terrible builds you posted is probably the best for Rogue/Priest arenas...you get boss survival and good DPS.
"The trick at 39 is to consider what you are playing with. The ideal partner for a Priest is a Rogue, and at 39 this is no exception. Very few teams can beat it if played properly, and the specs above are tailored to that. Please have more respect before you talk about 'terrible' builds without considering the thought process behind it. "
I play a LOT of priest/rogue arenas...with some of the best arena players in the game...please...
I have no respect for your awful information. I understand why you think you know what you are talking about...but you are wrong.
no wrong
"Taking a disc build with out IPWS, or Mental Stength leaves you with more stress on your mana pool, and too much pressure to heal through times when PWS is not up. The glyph of PWS obviously compliments the talents and reduced CD. Reduced CD on PWS means the Rogue has more opportunities to vanish inside it."
bad priest is bad
"PWS is not consuming a GCD "
lol
"Silent resolve is a talent which I'm not sold by at this level"
gl vs other priests or shaman teams
"I play rogue, so for us we play super aggressive, but at the same time if we do get counter CC'd i know he can last, as can I, with nearly 3400hp buffed."
this is why 19/11 and not those terrible builds you posted is probably the best for Rogue/Priest arenas...you get boss survival and good DPS.
"The trick at 39 is to consider what you are playing with. The ideal partner for a Priest is a Rogue, and at 39 this is no exception. Very few teams can beat it if played properly, and the specs above are tailored to that. Please have more respect before you talk about 'terrible' builds without considering the thought process behind it. "
I play a LOT of priest/rogue arenas...with some of the best arena players in the game...please...
I have no respect for your awful information. I understand why you think you know what you are talking about...but you are wrong.
Druiddroid
OG
sounds like a case of the metagame allowing for different playstyles to work for different cases
from what i've seen, 28/2/0 is the main spec people use in 39 US priest specs.
however, just because a lot of people use it doesn't mean it's the best everywhere, including inside US.
i've experimented with new builds myself a few times (29/39 arcane mage, 29 fury warrior FC, 0/13/17 FC druid) and hey, they are very suitable specs for me. i'm not saying you have to be original, but it really isn't "bad" to be different from others. just try out different specs (ones you speculate will be good through research) and see what works out for you.
from what i've seen, 28/2/0 is the main spec people use in 39 US priest specs.
however, just because a lot of people use it doesn't mean it's the best everywhere, including inside US.
i've experimented with new builds myself a few times (29/39 arcane mage, 29 fury warrior FC, 0/13/17 FC druid) and hey, they are very suitable specs for me. i'm not saying you have to be original, but it really isn't "bad" to be different from others. just try out different specs (ones you speculate will be good through research) and see what works out for you.
Bromrotama
OG
o shutup DD, think you know what your talking about
IM ORIGINAL LOVE ME
Edit: alrite im done being dumb for the day. Let me go make myself some herbal tea
IM ORIGINAL LOVE ME
Edit: alrite im done being dumb for the day. Let me go make myself some herbal tea
Alteffour
OG
"sounds like a case of the metagame allowing for different playstyles to work for different cases"
just because it "works" doesnt mean it is working optimally or the best for the class/bracket.
I could heal you specced as shadow if I wanted to, it would "work" but it would also suck.
just because it "works" doesnt mean it is working optimally or the best for the class/bracket.
I could heal you specced as shadow if I wanted to, it would "work" but it would also suck.
Xailter
OG
I'll break this down for you bit by bit eles cos I think you're missing a few key points:
The extra armour is indeed nice, it must be said. You're dropping a glyph slot though to get that kind of armour and 312 of it is negated by rogues anyway due to talents. You'll survive ~6% longer with the glyph against melee damage or it's equal to ~180 health before heals. The dispel glyph restores 3% health a go or ~90 health so 2 dispels = your extra armour. The dispels affect a much larger number of classes though that have magical effects.
IPW:S is a 15% damage absorb increase or 57 health. That's a poor amount for 3 talent points it has to be said. That's like a pet hit from a hunter. Mental Strength is a very good talent and I highly recommend it though; less mana spent means you last longer. PW:S glyph is terrible and should never be used - an ~80 heal every 15 seconds is not amazing and you're dropping another glyph slot. I also want to point out that Soul Warding reduces the cooldown of PW:S by 4 seconds (so it has no cooldown) but does not affect weakened soul. You can still only PW:S the same target every 15 seconds. Also the effect does not mean a rogue can successfully vanish with dots on last time I tried.
PW:S is on the GCD I'm afraid.
I would assume this means it's also better. Truth be told, if you're dispelling your partner it's so they can get back into attack range either from a root or a CC spell. While getting rid of these effects, while not supply a small healing boost as well? PW:S does not remove these effects.
A priest's healing is 60% 'heal on the run' and 40% 'direct burst'. Shielding and renewing is a big part of the priest's usefulness and absolutely anyway to prevent your heals (and buffs) being dispelled is worth it. Example, you may start off with Fort, Shadow Res, Shield, Spirit, Renew. You want to keep these as long as is possible, and if your enemy has to expend a few extra GCD to get them off you or your partner, so be it! Not to mention it prevents locks healing so much with felhunters.
Mana Burn is the sole reason priests are so f'ing powerful at this level. They can burn a mana user dry while keeping themselves up with non-castable (instant) heals. Only 2 classes do not use mana, and it's entirely viable to outlast rogues and warriors (sort of). Not taking this talent should be punished with fire! I won't comment on the builds, each to his own.
I just want to ask if you have a 39 priest, because some talents are more worth it than you state. Obviously you play with one, but have you asked his opinions on his talent build or gearing decisions?
-X
elesian said:
The extra armour is indeed nice, it must be said. You're dropping a glyph slot though to get that kind of armour and 312 of it is negated by rogues anyway due to talents. You'll survive ~6% longer with the glyph against melee damage or it's equal to ~180 health before heals. The dispel glyph restores 3% health a go or ~90 health so 2 dispels = your extra armour. The dispels affect a much larger number of classes though that have magical effects.
IPW:S is a 15% damage absorb increase or 57 health. That's a poor amount for 3 talent points it has to be said. That's like a pet hit from a hunter. Mental Strength is a very good talent and I highly recommend it though; less mana spent means you last longer. PW:S glyph is terrible and should never be used - an ~80 heal every 15 seconds is not amazing and you're dropping another glyph slot. I also want to point out that Soul Warding reduces the cooldown of PW:S by 4 seconds (so it has no cooldown) but does not affect weakened soul. You can still only PW:S the same target every 15 seconds. Also the effect does not mean a rogue can successfully vanish with dots on last time I tried.
PW:S is on the GCD I'm afraid.
I would assume this means it's also better. Truth be told, if you're dispelling your partner it's so they can get back into attack range either from a root or a CC spell. While getting rid of these effects, while not supply a small healing boost as well? PW:S does not remove these effects.
A priest's healing is 60% 'heal on the run' and 40% 'direct burst'. Shielding and renewing is a big part of the priest's usefulness and absolutely anyway to prevent your heals (and buffs) being dispelled is worth it. Example, you may start off with Fort, Shadow Res, Shield, Spirit, Renew. You want to keep these as long as is possible, and if your enemy has to expend a few extra GCD to get them off you or your partner, so be it! Not to mention it prevents locks healing so much with felhunters.
Mana Burn is the sole reason priests are so f'ing powerful at this level. They can burn a mana user dry while keeping themselves up with non-castable (instant) heals. Only 2 classes do not use mana, and it's entirely viable to outlast rogues and warriors (sort of). Not taking this talent should be punished with fire! I won't comment on the builds, each to his own.
I just want to ask if you have a 39 priest, because some talents are more worth it than you state. Obviously you play with one, but have you asked his opinions on his talent build or gearing decisions?
-X
Druiddroid
OG
Alteffour said:
all depends man, 39 frost mages and 39 warrior fcs were non-existant in reckoning but we come to nightfall and it's different
not saying being different is better, just saying if you don't give it a chance in the hands of a skilled player then you're just being dumb calling it bad
Alteffour
OG
39 frost mages are a relativly new thing ill agree, although in the past they were used as well so its more of a comeback than totally new, fire just got popular I guess cause it makes people go boom.
Warrior FCs have been pretty common in the other BGs I played pre 3.2 so I think thats more of reckoning just not getting the message for whatever reason.
The difference is in WHY these changes come about. They dont really just happen because somebody decides to try out something "new." They generally happen when a patch changes something. In the case of the warrior for example, the addition came just after 3.0 or whenever and was due partially from Prot wars getting buffed and through druid and pally FCs getting slight nerfs which brought warriors up to par and even beyond what the others could bring.
The reason my post wasnt as detailed as xail's is that all of what I said and what Xail said should be really obvious to pretty much anybody with 39 priest experience.
You cant come on here as rogue with no 39 priest experience then get butt hurt because a priest tells you your information is not based on any realistic information. Just because you play with a priest doesnt make you an expert on priest specs.
You might think im being closed minded or whatever...but do you really believe that I dont try out other specs as well? My re-spec stats have me at almost 2000g worth of respecs on my 39 priest (not to mention trying things on the PTR). Ive tried everything I could think of. I played Holy for ages, I understand its pros and cons, Ive played full shadow and even disc/shadow and holy/shadow hybrids, ive played disc/holy in a few variations and many many full disc builds.
Warrior FCs have been pretty common in the other BGs I played pre 3.2 so I think thats more of reckoning just not getting the message for whatever reason.
The difference is in WHY these changes come about. They dont really just happen because somebody decides to try out something "new." They generally happen when a patch changes something. In the case of the warrior for example, the addition came just after 3.0 or whenever and was due partially from Prot wars getting buffed and through druid and pally FCs getting slight nerfs which brought warriors up to par and even beyond what the others could bring.
The reason my post wasnt as detailed as xail's is that all of what I said and what Xail said should be really obvious to pretty much anybody with 39 priest experience.
You cant come on here as rogue with no 39 priest experience then get butt hurt because a priest tells you your information is not based on any realistic information. Just because you play with a priest doesnt make you an expert on priest specs.
You might think im being closed minded or whatever...but do you really believe that I dont try out other specs as well? My re-spec stats have me at almost 2000g worth of respecs on my 39 priest (not to mention trying things on the PTR). Ive tried everything I could think of. I played Holy for ages, I understand its pros and cons, Ive played full shadow and even disc/shadow and holy/shadow hybrids, ive played disc/holy in a few variations and many many full disc builds.
Druiddroid
OG
Alteffour said:
frost mages were non-existant, why? cause fire and arcane ones were the FOTM.
it's not because frost mages are necessarily bad, but because they are not popular specs and therefore most people will not choose them. heck i have said frost sucked for 39 but after coming to nightfall and realizing its potential i know how dumb i was for assuming that.
right, noone hopped on the bandwagon, so it just kind of got thrown to the side and was never used
when i rolled my 39 arcane mage (which was the first of its kind in reckoning as far as i can tell), after about 6 months there were a bunch of 39 arcane mages running around with similar specs. you just need someone to start the bandwagon and then it goes from there.
how do you know elesian only has a rogue
all i'm saying is, don't be disrespectful even if someone sounds stupid. you need to refute them with sound arguements, not "it's terrible". the reason people read this site isn't just to show off their knowledge of twinking, but also to learn about twinking as well. and with how subjective and random different playstyles are, as well as how the metagame works in different areas, you have to be willing to respect different specs. no spec is bad until you have thoroughly proven them to be
Druiddroid
OG
Weiland said:
in my twinks (on the left), bearforceone
Alteffour
OG
he said something along the lines of "I play a rogue...but my partner is a priest"
Mana Burn and Dispell are probably good in any metagame dont you think?
If you dont like the way I state things in regards to the bad information he was posting thats fine, but there is nothing I stated that was so clearly bad and wrong like what he was posting. I will offer intelligent responses to intelligent posts, the point imo needed to be made that elesians information was mostly wrong.
Also, tbh your equating FOTM builds to the builds that were posted arent the same imo. There are pretty plain reasons why a lot of the talents are chosen, there are reasons why 28/2 and 19/11 (and some 30/0 disc and slight variations) work. Saying 10/10/10 fury/arms/prot warrior builds are cool they just arent FOTM would be blatently bad/wrong.
Arcane mages or Frost mages and Prot warriors are FOTM because they are legitimate builds. They might not have been popular but with patch changes and some other factors they became used again. You might have been the first to run Arcane in reckoning but do you really think you were the first mage to run Arcane in the bracket?
I never stated that Holy builds cant work for priests...they can be effective in Premades still. My problem is with the way those particular builds were put together. They placed WAY too high of a priority on Inner Fire and Glyphed Inner Fire making them non-optimal builds. The choice in Glyphs also was bad, and I did state why I felt they were bad. I also covered Imp Mana burn and the fact that that terrible Disc build he had failed to include imp mana burn which makes it terrible. Not speccing into Mana Burn when you are full disc shows a complete lack of priestly knowledge, be it elesian the rogue that posted it or his partner who seems to be missing out on a signifigant amount of what it takes to play a Priest.
So you can say "well Holy just isnt flavor of the month" but thats never been my issue. Anybody can spec a full holy build whenever they like, and will be at least somewhat successful with it if they arent bad. The point is that if you play Holy dont use those builds.
Druiddroid
OG
i don't know, never played in europe : /
specs are not black and white
besides, be the better man. if their posts aren't intelligent then explain why, don't just say amg ur bad because that's just being pretty hypocritical imo, or being egotastic or whatever. i mean that's something i see on the WoW forums a lot -_-
all i'm saying is prove it, don't be like AMG obv blatently bad/wrong. until you have throroughly proven that one build is bad then it's not necessarily bad.
is 10/10/10 bad? i don't know, never seen it, never tried it, so maybe it's good. i wouldn't know.
i don't think i was the first to run arcane, no, but what i do know is that i rolled arcane and many followed in my footsteps. the point is that before i reached 39, many people were wondering why i wouldn't be a fire mage FC, why should i roll arcane, it's not as good as fire, but then i play in a few games and people realized that it was a legitimate build
there are plenty of legitimate builds that aren't FOTM too, there are just so many different playstyles from player to player and there is the metagame to consider too.
if your opponents pillar kite the shit out of you and one (or both) is a rogue then imp mana burn really isn't going to be incredibly effective.
again, all i'm trying to say is that you're just assuming his posted specs are terrible, while the reality is that because of varying playstyles and the metagame it's hard to actually tell which specs are bad.
as long as you thoroughly prove it, and he cannot refute the arguement, then sure i'll agree