Special Unit Puggers - brainstorming thread

Izac

Izac

Legend
A lot of f2p's want to premade but we just don't seem to ever get around to it. When we do we take it way too seriously and it takes way too long to organize. A premade doesn't have to be 10 people or even 5 people. 2 people group queueing and working together can make a game of WSG a lot more competitive.

I've had an idea for a while now that I think would work well for the f2p bracket and I wanted to get people's thoughts. I call it Special Unit Puggers

The idea is to get WSG 2v2s, 3s, 4s and hopefully even some 5v5s going and to keep a rankings/leaderboard thread updated on TI. It would have a points system and you'd get points for wins, flag caps and the overall p2p/24 differential. All you'd do is take a screenshot of the start and end of the game, and an agreement between the teams that it is a ranked match.

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The Rules:

1. First rule is there are no rules.

2. Second rule is there's actually 5 rules that I've thought of so far.
- minimum 2 people (duh)
- equal # of teammates both sides
- no arcane intellect buff for horde
- f2p restrictions on gear/chants/level etc.
- no glitches

Everything else is fair stinkin' game. No comp rules! Way too much debate to be had over comps for it to be worth it.

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There would be rankings for individual scores and for each team bracket (and the same person could be on multiple teams). Losses/flag caps against would earn negative points. Bigger premades would earn more points with less risk (more points to win, less to lose). There would be 2-3 month "seasons" and top players/teams would be given honorary titles and have their names etched onto the Special Unit Puggers thread, first post right at the top. If there's enough interest there could eventually be prizes as well.

It would be for US and EU -- probably all combined onto one leaderboard. It's the f2p bracket dangit it's alright if it's messy.

I wanted to get people's thoughts on this and see how many people would be interested. Any questions? Concerns?
 
Now that I think of it Special Unit Puggers sounds really dumb. I'd probably go with F2P Special Units or something. The idea behind "Special Units" is that your duo/trio etc. goes in and does the dirty work for your pug-mates. You adapt according to your team's needs.

Games would involve some luck with who your teammates are but that's what makes it exciting. Having a rankings system just adds a little extra reason to find premade opponents rather than just premading vs pugs etc.

It wouldn't be hard. Just open two wow windows and time your WSG queues with your opponents (or use skype). Use the Special Units thread or take screenshots to announce that you're about to play some ranked matches. Post before/after pics (or send them in private message) and all the score-keeping will be done for you and the page updated regularly.
 
Example of how scoring might work:

50 Points for 2v2 win, -50 points for 2v2 loss
70 Points for 3v3 win, -60 points for 3v3 loss
90 Points for 4v4 win, - 70 points for 4v4 loss
110 points for 5v5 win, - 80 points for 5v5 loss

20 points per flag cap, -20 per cap against

-10 points for each p2p/24 on your team that isn't matched by a p2p/24 on the other team (whether or not you win or lose).
 
The idea seems interesting in concept, here are a few of my trainer tips if this does become a thing, from the perspective of a casual observer:

First off, I'm not a big fan of taking points away, so:
- no "negative" points for having flags capped against you, considering a flag being run might be completely out of the control of the people involved in the ranked system, i.e., having opposing hunters nipping your heels (in reality severing your Achilles tendon with conc. shot) as you try to intercept.
- no "negative" points for having 24s on your team; rather give additional points to the opposition for every unmatched 24.
- In general, don't take away points from losing teams, just give them a percentage of what the winners would receive (10-20% maybe?), I think that people should be rewarded for participating regardless of if they win or lose. Especially if a team gets stuck with a string of losses and sees their points total get obliterated.

Other objectives that could reward additional points could be:

- Winning the game in under (x) minutes (7, 10, 15).
- Points for flag returns as well as caps!
- Points for the % of the pugs in the team hailing from Hell-Thalas (or other Latin realms akin to a F2P short bus).

/2cents
 
Waterworks said:
I'm not a big fan of taking points away, so:

I think that people should be rewarded for participating regardless of if they win or lose. Especially if a team gets stuck with a string of losses and sees their points total get obliterated.
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Hmm, yeah this one is a pretty tough call. I want people to be rewarded for participation but I also don't want the scoring to be about whoever has the most time on their hands to get ranked games in. Don't want people to break even on wins/losses and still have a ton of points just for playing a lot.

Maybe there's a middle ground.. Could reduce the amount of negative points a bit.

Waterworks said:
Other objectives that could reward additional points could be:
- Winning the game in under (x) minutes (7, 10, 15).
- Points for flag returns as well as caps!
- Points for the % of the pugs in the team hailing from Hell-Thalas (or other Latin realms akin to a F2P short bus).
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- Hm that's possible... help to prevent farming
- Yes good idea.. 10 points for each flag return one of your teammates has (and those points could go toward the team score but only to the returner's individual score...)
- Pft! My homie Destruidorr would take offense to that. there's some QT pros out there. but yeah, don't want to overdo it with analyzing your teammates. Adjusting to them is part of the Special Units game
 
KainUFC said:
Dont care who its vs all I do is pug. And enjoy the challenge of playing well win or lose.
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Hm.. well maybe we can find a way to incorporate solo players into the scoring. Mainly just need to find a way to make the scoring quality > quantity and keep people honest about when their games will be ranked or not. Maybe just take the 10 best solo games you've had for the season and count caps/returns as bonus points.

But something to think about: I've heard that if one horse can pull 1,000 pounds, two horses can pull like 3,000 pounds. It's not just simple addition of 1000 + 1000. Two or more players can do exponentially more than just one. Would love it if every warlock (like yourself) had an Hpally following them around... HoJ/fear chains, rogue poison cleanses. So much more could get done.
 
Maybe there can be prizes. Like if you have 500 points you can buy a can of vanilla coke or an unlimited subscription to the Trial Journal

I really like whats happening here. If it kicks off we can merge it with the premades weekend thread and have a way we can collectively be appreciating games. The way it's happening in the thread now just doesn't seem to do justice to what happens in games. It would be great to have a more specific, systematic approach
 
Cheesetoast said:
Maybe there can be prizes. Like if you have 500 points you can buy a can of vanilla coke or an unlimited subscription to the Trial Journal

I really like whats happening here. If it kicks off we can merge it with the premades weekend thread and have a way we can collectively be appreciating games. The way it's happening in the thread now just doesn't seem to do justice to what happens in games. It would be great to have a more specific, systematic approach
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Yeah hey man, you have a good thing going with your thread! It was one of the things that showed me there would be interest in small group premades.

I just think there would be even more interest with some kind of rankings system or like you said prizes. Used to love waking up every Tuesday morning back in Vanilla and seeing how far up I went in the honor rankings.

One thing we can look into is seeing if we can get the mods to hand out exclusive TI titles to the top scorers each season. Like "F2P Warlord" or something. [MENTION=10938]Broken[/MENTION] [MENTION=7986]Livingforce[/MENTION] is that something we can make happen?
 
Would Poison Extraction Totem trick be against the rules? Not that I have a Druid or anything.

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Pooh said:
Would Poison Extraction Totem trick be against the rules? Not that I have a Druid or anything.
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Nope! If you got it use it. Wild wild west. Queue up with the commanding shout quest buff if you want. Only lasts at max a minute and a half anyway. Only not too wild. The 60 int thing that horde can get is the only thing I can think of that's way too big of an advantage to be reasonable. The idea is to be as much about resourcefulness and creative uses of your characters as possible.
 
And what about class limitations? Will you add a rule about limiting the numbers of the same class? (For rule #2 )

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Pooh said:
And what about class limitations? Will you add a rule about limiting the numbers of the same class?
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Nope! Even comp design would be part of the game. In fact I would encourage people to keep their comps a secret when queueing with each other so that the other team wouldn't have the option of backing out.

But if people start catching on they may decide not to face you anymore so keep that in mind B)

From my experience having multiple classes are a bigger issue in pugs vs pugs than they are with pugmades/premades. It only takes a little coordination to counter multi-class ganking squads. Even with some classes being stronger than others in DPS I still believe balance is ultimately the best way to go.

We'll see! It can be an experiment.
 
Won't it be a problem that Horde wins more than Alliance? And is this like.. real WSG's or skirmishes? Because it sounds like the former.
 
Upswag said:
Won't it be a problem that Horde wins more than Alliance? And is this like.. real WSG's or skirmishes? Because it sounds like the former.
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I think having 2-5 players focused on winning each game will help the Alliance bridge the gap. If not then we can separate Alliance/Horde rankings. (However I'm planning on giving the option to combine your scores among characters of the same class. If you have an alliance rogue and a horde rogue, you could combine all your points)

And yes they would be real WSG's. If you have really bad luck with your pug-mates then you'll just have to do some damage control and prevent some caps
 
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