Crilicilyn
OG
of course ls is better in arena dur. And fal pls corrct me if I'm wrong but ur ideal set is sf/tb w/ dual ls?
Oh question
- Thread starter Curley
- Start date
Falaris
OG
Crilicilyn said:
It 100% depends on the situation. I dont claim to know every situation, since Ive already admitted that I havent been active lately on my 19. Activity isnt relevant in alot of situations, such as Throwing Weapons being strictly better than Bows, always cap your hit, etc. However, when talking about what gear to use for certain matchups its definitely relevant to have some recent experience.
The one thing that I will say is that LS is better than fiery for most situations a rogue would be in in 19s. The one exception may be a 10v10, where the only thing a rogue would care about is having the most damage possible, sacrificing everything else.
Edit: Im aware that my post can be construed as contradictory.
iaccidentallytwink
Guild Master
Falaris said:
You've yet to rebute my post. The fact that the 5 AP adds more than .4 DPS to the mainhand makes CB the prime choice for offhand DPS because the dodge is highly negligible.
Falaris
OG
iaccidentallytwink said:
Ive yet to refute your post because as one poster in this thread so adequately pointed out, its impossible to win an argument with you. Youll keep coming up with retarded 'responses' which dont actually have any merit in a real discussion. Youre now talking like we werent discussing mainhand damage previously when we talked about the .4dps damage increase, implying that the reason you previously felt CB was better because it adds .4dps to your offhand weapon. If you truly feel that way then we really dont have anything left to discuss, youre pretty clueless
Crilicilyn
OG
I do miss LS greatly, but I find my guild is attempting to be more active in the premading scene so I need to get used to dual fierys ='(. I won't even get into an argument with you guys over OH's, I use 2 SF's its same weapon speed so i can be extremely lazy lol
i just want to clarify one thing about crit here.... just to make sure i am on the right track...
let's say you got 20% crit chances and you are hit cap...
wouldn'T that make 1/5 hit a crit ? wouldn'T that make 12 hit per minute being a crit, if you could hit every second, which is basically true because of the abilities you push every global CDs. with all this in mind i can't help but to find the 1PPM chants that does what 70 damage per minute quite basic compared to crits from all those moves.
just saying...
tell me if i'm wrong on this... simple math after all !
then again the bow gives not just hit rating but other stats as well thus making it better then thrown weapons.
as for offhands and mina hands, isn't it better to put the hard hitter in main hand and fastest weapon in off hand ?
thats what i had heard about back in TBC days and never relaly bothered in finding it true or not.
let's say you got 20% crit chances and you are hit cap...
wouldn'T that make 1/5 hit a crit ? wouldn'T that make 12 hit per minute being a crit, if you could hit every second, which is basically true because of the abilities you push every global CDs. with all this in mind i can't help but to find the 1PPM chants that does what 70 damage per minute quite basic compared to crits from all those moves.
just saying...
tell me if i'm wrong on this... simple math after all !
then again the bow gives not just hit rating but other stats as well thus making it better then thrown weapons.
as for offhands and mina hands, isn't it better to put the hard hitter in main hand and fastest weapon in off hand ?
thats what i had heard about back in TBC days and never relaly bothered in finding it true or not.
iaccidentallytwink
Guild Master
Falaris said:
Of course my responses have merit. Before, I was purely calculating the OH damage because I was attempting to dispel any allusion that TB does more damage in the offhand, as you suggested with your +1% crit argument. But after calculating in the MH additions, CB actually does give more DPS overall. TB may give you a minimal amount of Dodge, but CB contributes more needed additional DPS, especially in WSG. And in Arenas, that .36% - 1% dodge (won't argue the numbers now) provides little to no advantage over an additional .4+ DPS. And I'm fairly certain that the dodge gain is under 1%, but you're free to link me a toon that gains 1% dodge from 7 Agi, I'd like to know what his dodge beforehand was.
Falaris
OG
iaccidentallytwink said:
[char=Crushridge]Falaruss[/char]
Yes, Im well aware that he is well below-average geared. However, i gain 1.22% dodge from 7 agility with that character. Id still like to see your math on how you compute the .4 dps increase on CB vs TB. You said youve done the math, just a link will suffice.
iaccidentallytwink
Guild Master
Falaris said:
Will do. In the morning. It's 4AM and I don't have the strength to do anything but play GH3. G'Night.
iaccidentallytwink
Guild Master
Falaris said:
woah wtf 15 agi?
lol going to bed now.
iaccidentallytwink
Guild Master
Falaris said:
I released a DPS calculator for Fiery/LS/Crusader using Excel and it gives AT LEAST 2x as much DPS as 15 Agility after counting in miss rate.
Firetruckk
OG
"That's the beauty of argument, if you argue correctly, you're never wrong"
iaccidentallytwink
Guild Master
Throwed said:
Probably the first of your posts I've actually really liked.
Crilicilyn
OG
IMO vanilla twinking>lkwtfblizz twinking lol. Falaris it's completely understandable why you would argue your statement ad you did. Curley plays a heavy dps set up, I believe he even mentioned he just wanted the highest raw DMg out put possible in the start of the thread . You and IAT are arguing the best all around and that's an entirely different subject.
Falaris
OG
Rivfader said:
I didnt say that it didnt affect both weapons, it does. As for the TB comment, thats fine I have no problems being in the minority. I got the same response for quite a while on topics like: Throwing weapons vs Bows/Guns, Stealth to cloak vs well.. anything, 5 weapon damage on a mainhand dagger (29), etc. Things like this may seem common knowledge now, but it wasnt always that way, and I was at the forefront of advocating all of that.
Trespasser
OG
Kind of tired here as it's 3AM where I live but let me try to help you with this.
ArthurianKnight;123998let's say you got 20% crit chances and you are hit cap... wouldn'T that make 1/5 hit a crit ? wouldn'T that make 12 hit per minute being a crit said:Well lets see here lets assume like you said there is a enchant that does 70 damage and has a 1ppm proc rate. Normally without any special attacks that would indeed be 70damage per minute on average. However if we take the effect from special attacks into consideration we see this:
Lets say it's in it in your mainhand with a shadowfang. The proc rate is 4.5% per swing. But you aren't just doing normal swing but also sinister strike (as a rogue) and lets assume you don't have imp. SS so it's 45 energy or a sinister strike every 4.5sec. So that's 60/4.5=13.33 SS per minute. each of those also having a 4.5% chance to proc that enchant.
Now if we look at all the data (to tired to take hit into account at the moment but if you want I can do that later) you get 70damage of that enchant from your normal swing and 42damage from proc from SS per minute. (lets not take into account the extra procs you could get from using a BWTB offhand)
Resulting in not 70 but 112 damage per minute (1.866dps). Now if you would compare that to a enchant that would increase your crit chance by 1% and we assume that a 1% crit increase increases your dps by 1% that would mean that for the enchants to be equal your dps without the enchant would have to be 186.6 which is not even possible with all the buffs available.
However those 2 enchants don't exist which makes this entire post quite useless. But if you do the same thing with +15agi and fiery the results are the same but the difference is not that large as this example.
@IAT and Falaris:
If you guys want I could do a full scale calculation considering every enchant, piece of gear and talents and compare the dps gained from TB and from CB to be able to compare then. This will be done without my calculator and I will post the entire calculation here. However to do this you 2 would have to agree on the gear and spec for the comparison. And of course the armor, dodge chance, parry chance and racial passives of the target. (yes I even need this because of fiery procs and to calculate your actual chance to hit the target)
PS: I haven't been at the site a lot this vacation are there any problems with any theorycrafting that I might have missed besides this topic and the missing earthbind totem?