How important is armor right now?

Discussion in '20s (Shadowlands)' started by glancealot, Jun 7, 2021.

Share This Page

  1. glancealot

    glancealot Member

    Messages:
    2,661
    Likes Received:
    276
    Trophy Points:
    83
    I am using the prot artifact as holy paladin, because at i34, it offers a lot of armor and block. (85-64=21 more armor before talasite is ~1.8% more reduction)

    I would think that given the hunter meta, this is a decent choice?

    The idea is that, when you go for a heavy survivability build, every 1% of "other" kind of reduction in addition to vers is worth more than 1%, because when numbers multiply, there is a compounding effect.

    [​IMG]

    Looking for thoughts.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. BANKONE

    BANKONE Member

    Messages:
    288
    Likes Received:
    155
    Trophy Points:
    43
    I think that, in current meta as a mid focused team healer (which may or may not be you) - trying to stack mitigation stats on a non mitigation role will just hamper your healing output even more.

    regardless of how much mitigation you might have, hunters just pump damage and it’s not going to matter . Your best defense against hunters IMO, is a strong team to keep them down. focus on healing DPS and proper positioning as the best way to keep hunters off your back.

    that said, some classes/specs do have some flat damage reduction pvp talents that might be exploring, in conjunction with versatility.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  3. Dragpz

    Dragpz Grandfathered

    Messages:
    597
    Likes Received:
    284
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I agree w/ this 100%, survivability isn't as important as healing output. Talasite stacking on a healer is pretty bad, ngl (I have one myself). So if you really care so much about surviving, maybe mix in a few Talasites or +2 Int/+2 Sta, but giving up that much Int for maybe 2% flat Phys Reduction ( Think 2% of 3k HP pool = 60 HP, and the true damage reduction of your block is 0.6% reduction (6.5% diff x 10% chance to block)), is probably not worth it. 17 int is around 34 spell power I believe.

    You'd probably have to crunch the numbers with a duel or something, calculate total damage done to you, minus what's mitigated by your extra armor, then compare that to the healing per second you lose from running the prot arty
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Hennelorix

    Hennelorix Member

    Messages:
    76
    Likes Received:
    60
    Trophy Points:
    18
    What
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  5. Dragpz

    Dragpz Grandfathered

    Messages:
    597
    Likes Received:
    284
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Yes, that's my rule of thumb, in terms of healing output anyways. I forget the calculations that were done, they go way back in some thread I forget about. But, generally, for healers, your Healing Spellpower is affected by Int x 2, changes based on the spell modifier. Not very accurate for raw calculations, I know, but thats typically my rule of thumb when trying to measure out any stats for 20s
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. toskosa

    toskosa Veteran

    Messages:
    596
    Likes Received:
    445
    Trophy Points:
    63
    17 int = 17 sp guys.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  7. Chey

    Chey Grandfathered

    Messages:
    376
    Likes Received:
    227
    Trophy Points:
    43
    I think he is talking about your actual heal, say you heal a FoL for 400 then you add 17 int you now heal for 433-434ish.

    So 17int adds 34ish to the spell.

    Not the way I would say it but..... he is not far off
     
  8. Katrex

    Katrex Member

    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    32
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I personally would not use the Prot artifact as Holy. As much as having survivability is good, Hunters will output large damage constantly no matter what, and plenty of the damage sources from Hunters (Mainly DoTs) are not blockable/reduced by armor. As such, I think you are best off to just go with the Essence+Shield option. Or any other Intel 1H + Shield option, the amount of armor you gain from the Prot artifact does not make up for the fact that you will heal others and even yourself less.
     
  9. Greenmtnboy

    Greenmtnboy Member

    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    28
    It only matters if your name isn’t greenmtnboy.

    the rest of you…. See you with my 20 Surv while you question if I’m the one that just laid down the law.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  10. OP
    glancealot

    glancealot Member

    Messages:
    2,661
    Likes Received:
    276
    Trophy Points:
    83
    After reading all the comments, I am sticking to my socket shield and speed weapon then.

    pretty happy with my current set-up, (on average) 20%+ secondaries across the board, and a lot of stamina/armor thanks to stacking https://www.wowhead.com/item=33782/steady-talasite

    I don't care about low int because

    1, i have a lot of https://www.wowhead.com/spell=25129/brilliant-wizard-oil

    2, i have a lot of mobility and all it takes is one extra heal once in a while to make up the smaller heals. (4*300 is the same as 3*400)
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2021
  11. JadeFire

    JadeFire Member

    Messages:
    481
    Likes Received:
    234
    Trophy Points:
    43
    You've asked this too many times :p you want people to be able to relate to what you are doing/build, but they can't... all they know is "stack main stat... duuuuuurh maybe add versatility duuuuuuh". I don't care if the guy has been twinking since 1952, that is what they know, luckily most of the time that just happens to be correct.

    Hunter damage currently makes any "theory crafting" pointless. If you get lucky and are in a game with no hunters you get to post in the hipster DPS thread with your trash classes top dps meter... great fun! But, that is it... build to deal with hunters.

    If there were no hunters, yes armor would matter... I've posted about it before on Enhancement Shaman, storm strike loses almost 30% of its tool tip damage when you hit a target dummy with standard armor... its pretty bad. On the flip side, things like "Crusader" and "Hunters do mega damage" overcome that, you just have to play one of the classes that benefit.

    Armor is just in a place where it does not matter at 20.

    The only place where Talasites should be used is using +3+3+Talasite instead of 3x +2mainstat+2stam... that is pretty much it. If you want to run a flag or whatever sure.. do that.
     
  12. Crystalpall

    Crystalpall the F2P PvEr

    Messages:
    3,467
    Likes Received:
    799
    Trophy Points:
    163
    Sorry for derailing the thread but I just remembered how the BiS F2P cloak in Cata was Firebane Cloak (5 Stamina, 5 Fire Res) just because of explosive shot and I got nostalgic
     
  13. Sunwatcher

    Sunwatcher Grandfathered

    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    36
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Armor is pretty much useless as the most concerning sources of damage are all magic. No one should be even remotely concerned with armor.
     
  14. BANKONE

    BANKONE Member

    Messages:
    288
    Likes Received:
    155
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Don’t get me wrong, I can theory craft all day. And I know that there’s more than viable alternatives than just stacking main stat.

    but as someone said, hunters just negate even any viable non main stat stacking builds.

    in my experience. Speed against (surv) hunters is the best defense in a 1:1 scenario.... assuming their cheetah aspect is on cd....

    In a team scenario, having your dps alive to apply pressure is really the only way.
     
  15. toskosa

    toskosa Veteran

    Messages:
    596
    Likes Received:
    445
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Speaking of cloaks, seen a lot of ppl running the 7 vers cape from Sm when there is a 9 vers cape from a quest in feralas. 1 less int on it though but it can upgrade. ( caster only cape)
     
  16. Greenmtnboy

    Greenmtnboy Member

    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Don’t forget about the vers cloak from pvp vendor in sw, no int or main stat but still.
    --- Double Post Merged, Jun 8, 2021, Original Post Date: Jun 8, 2021 ---
    And if you can, what quest chain is that cloak from?
    --- Double Post Merged, Jun 8, 2021 ---
    Nvm I see it’s horde. My bad, don’t quest really
     
  17. toskosa

    toskosa Veteran

    Messages:
    596
    Likes Received:
    445
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Rescue OOX-22/FE! - Quest - World of Warcraft (wowhead.com)

    quest is in a cave with yetis, you escort the chicken then get the second quest from it to turn in to booty bay.

    Its not horde only its both factions.
     
  18. Greenmtnboy

    Greenmtnboy Member

    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    28
  19. OP
    glancealot

    glancealot Member

    Messages:
    2,661
    Likes Received:
    276
    Trophy Points:
    83
    wowhead says quest is obsolete...but also, cloak has no socket so it is just a socket-less version "of adaptable"
     
  20. toskosa

    toskosa Veteran

    Messages:
    596
    Likes Received:
    445
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I just did this quest yesterday so its 100% completable. Also its something you can grab while you farm/ look for an ilvl 28 cloak.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1

Share This Page