Classic lvl 19 Twink Tier List

Discussion in '19s (Vanilla)' started by Jrugs, May 30, 2019.

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  1. Jrugs

    Jrugs Veteran

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    Thanks to the support of this community and the Classic Twinking discord I've managed to stockpile and average out a tier list based on YOUR thoughts & opinions. This tier list is based on the overall strength of each class as this could get pretty messy if we did a specific tier list for each class in terms of duels, premades, solo que, world pvp, etc. Additionally, classes like druid, paladin, shaman, and mage all have different "specs" that could argue their own spot among the list. For this reason, I've chosen to include those results in an honorable mentions section below.

    Screen Shot 2019-05-30 at 1.50.51 PM.png

    S+

    • Hunter
    S
    • Priest
    A
    • Druid
    • Rogue
    B
    • Shaman
    • Paladin
    • Mage
    C
    • Warlock
    • Warrior

    Honorable Mentions:
    >FC Druid (S)
    >Resto Druid (D)

    >FC Paladin (A)
    >Holy Paladin (C)

    >CC Mage (A)
    >Spell Power/Fire Mage (C)

    >Resto Shaman (D)
    >DPS Shaman (A)

    As I said, this tier list could get messy as we use so many different sets & strategies depending on what we're doing in that moment. Let's continue the discussion below!

    *This list is subject to change with the release of Classic and further input.
     
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  2. Bowner

    Bowner Member

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  3. Symandria

    Symandria Veteran

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    Why is Bear FC good?

    Druids won't have cat or travel form at 19, so about the only thing I can think of is immune to polymorph.
    Compared to something like Lay on Hands, Blessing of Freedom, and a couple paladin bubbles that can top you up by bubble bandage right before you pick up the flag it seems like druids have the short end of the stick? And if we want to add bash we have to add hammer of justice, so no gain for druids there. I am aware Paladin is Alliance only but this is a Tier list.
     
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  4. Bowner

    Bowner Member

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    I personally think Druid is the better option for FC, LoH is a 1 Hour CD and BoF which can be Purged by Shamans. While Druids can shape shift to remove movement impairing effects (Which Can't Be Purged) if spec'd into Natural Shipshifter this reduces the Mana Cost of shape shift. Nature's Grasp is also a very handy spell for a Druid to go along with Bash to get up to 2 Targets off of you, along with even possible 3rd if can position for a Quick Root or on target coming off a bash. While paladin only has Hammer of Justice which can buy them distance from a Enemy. Also not to mention Paladin is Alliance only so they have to deal with some Orcs 25% Stun Resist, Along with their Kryptonite in Shamans.

    And if a Horde Druid than you're Tauren which adds a War Stomp along to your arsenal allowing for similar combination with BoP + Bandage. Also you'd be surprised how much Paladins fail those BoP + Repicks. Lul.
     
  5. Iild

    Iild big pwner never small pwn

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    Powershifting is effectively a permanent blessing of freedom if you could somehow have unlimited mana, also freedom isnt self-cast exclusively so you could partner with a paladin or two and call for freedoms if you can't shift safely (with the enemy team nuking you/low mana).

    Lay on Hands is negligible as it has a 1 hour CD with no means to lower it at 19, so typically can only be used every 1-2 games, and again isnt self cast only so you could take a paladin with you and get LoHed by him while he plays a more healer-role to your superior FC kit.

    You're right about polymorph immunity but you also forget you can't sap beasts in vanilla, so effectively the only CC you're vulnerable to at 19 is stuns and fears (both of which are covered by the druid pvp trinket).

    Stun List:

    Warrior Charge (avoidable with moonfire, not dispellable)
    Blackout (dispellable)
    Hammer of Justice (dispellable)
    Imp Concussive Shot (dispellable)
    Impact (never used, not dispellable)
    War Stomp (horde only, not dispellable)

    Fear List:

    Scare Beast (shiftable in the sense of immune if you shift out of bear, dispellable)
    Psychic Scream (you shouldnt really be in positions where priests can get in range unless blackout proc into psychic scream, dispellable)
    Fear (dispellable)

    Sleep List:

    Hibernate (shiftable in the sense of immune if you shift out of bear, dispellable)

    Polymorph List:

    Polymorph (who wouldve thought, also shiftable in the sense of immune if you shift into bear, dispellable)

    Incapacitate List:

    Gouge (not dispellable)
    Sap (shiftable in the sense of immune if you shift into bear, not dispellable)

    So looking at the list of CC (ive probably missed a couple) you can see a lot of CC is avoidable by druids and nearly all of the ones unavoidable are dispellable.



    In addition to bash, you will also be speccing for Nature's Grasp which when talented fully has a 100% chance to proc entangling roots on a melee attacker (1min cd, 45sec buff duration. 1 charge.) cant remember if it counts as Entangling Roots' 1 enemy limit, meaning you could root two at a time with it.

    As mentioned in the post above Freedom/BoP are both purgable which further puts paladin below druid in terms of pure fc.

    I think the most appealing part of druids is the ability to shift/unshift to remove slows/roots to do some stupid jumps on demand which all classic twinks seem to hype for unknown reasons.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2019
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  6. Bowner

    Bowner Member

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    Idk how I forgot to mention about that you can't get sapped in bear form. Good one on pointing that out, good post.

    Also another thing, Druid FC will have more health then a Paladin along with Mana. Esp if Paladin isn't running 22 Int and Agi/LS/Crusader instead. Druid's can also utilize Furbolg Pouch more effectively as they don't lose out on the bonuses of having a Shield equip as paladins do.

    (Sure you can say a Paladin can use Pouch till CD is down but they lose out on a lot)
    Where even Pouch on CD the 10 Stamina from it benefits the Druid still.

    And yes you can time Paladin freedoms together, but Tier List is based of Solo Q + Premades so you limit to X2 Paladin Class limit and your wasting having another Paladin being used to Support FC Paladin instead of BoF'in Rogues on Offense etc.

    Along with that if your not running a FC Druid on Ally and FC Pally instead, most likely you won't be running a Resto Druid so you miss out on MoTW for buffs as long with Roots. While Having a Paladin out on Offense instead provides +Armor to team / Buffs ( BoW / BoM ) and ofc Freedom.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2019
  7. Symandria

    Symandria Veteran

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  8. Bowner

    Bowner Member

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    Yeah that's actually correct, was referencing based off Vanilla PServers. Still best Off Hand for Druid for +10 Stam alone, since can't equip Shields.

    Edit: Source : https://web.archive.org/web/20070102103440/http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?witem=16768
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
  9. inoobupro

    inoobupro Grandfathered

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    what is this therorycraft shit

    i love good theorycraft but this is so wrong on many levels
    Paladins are god tier ...they LITERALLY shit on horde if you are playing with competent warriors and there isnt really a way to outplay freedom

    also dispel protection in the form of trash scrolls/trash buffs works wonders

    you literally OOM in 2 druid shifts but pallies can heal for like 30-40 seconds nonstop

    also just a headsup Bowner is known as the afk king in the 19s community btw(games get too hard he just afks and sits afk in orgimmar)

    well I dont 100% agree with this

    put a alliance warrior w/ a shield for max tankage(warriors are super fucking tanky) on hamstring duty and hamstring all enemy priests/shamans and BoP/freedom can never be dispelled which automatically makes pallies god tier fcs

    idk why you guys underestimate almost permanent blessing of freedom...you as an FC literally cannot be CC'd
     
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  10. Bowner

    Bowner Member

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    Kek, you can Shift Lot more than ''2 times'' Especially with natural shapeshifter spec'd and if you're not a Noob druid spamming shift when getting WC by a Hunter and instead letting him burn his mana. Also yes i'm known as THE king in the 19s community, only time I afk is when your thrash guild (Hunter Guild)+Pocket Priest is just farming levelers in Mid and letting EFC's roam right past y'all. Idk why you kiss my ass ingame but trying put up a front here. Half the shit in your post made no sense, your trying say Paladin is ''God Tier'' with a Warrior support ? We are talking about each class individual strengths not how they perform with X and Y support etc. Overall Druids have lot more tools in there arsenal.

    Also to go along with wanting have a Warrior to Support a Paladin FC, you sacrifice now most likely not Having a Druid on the team. Depending if running x2 or 1 Warrior then the only Warrior On Defense. And with having a Paladin FC instead of Support/Flag Runner you miss out on having a BoF on your O less running X2 Pallys. This takes out valuable options for a team comp, cause now with possibly running X2 Warrior / X2 Pally. Now this means your most likely only gonna be running one Rogue. less you do run 2 now you're just running a super heavy melee comp that is going get demolished 9/10 vs any good players.



    But yeah this tier list is based off the classes individual strengths which Druid does get the Nod/Edge as superior FC in 19 bracket.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
  11. inoobupro

    inoobupro Grandfathered

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    Let me get 2 points straight right away

    -you were the one begging for me to join your guild

    -I never kiss anyone's ass in game rofl

    with that said

    You are basing you gameplay on random shitters instead of organized gameplay you fkin ape.

    And we sort of dont care if we lose I have come with one mission and one mission only-that is to send all you group queing, buffed twinking emoting fotm'ing ego tripping kids back into the gy. (incase you havent noticed idc much about levelers but god damn they constantly get in the way)



    also btw

    there's alot more i cba to scroll down that should be enough proof

    https://i.imgur.com/D1yxlMF.jpg

    sit down already
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
  12. Symandria

    Symandria Veteran

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    wow, this got heated fast ( : I'm glad to hear there are differing perspectives and I look forward to seeing them both utilized in the field. History will be glad to judge the meta over time for us : )
     
  13. Bowner

    Bowner Member

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    Lol yeah I get peoples panties in a bunch. Also I'm basing my reasoning's of actual organized gameplay did you forget I run a Guild and I've planned Weekly 10v10 (Pleb/Pugmades) and Guild vs Guild Premades for nearly past 2 years steady? While like I said earlier your guild is just farming GY/Mid Levelers for HK's? You make no sense still, I can pull out screenshots too
    http://prntscr.com/nw701h http://prntscr.com/nw70kq . Your making this thread about me instead of debunking your reasoning on why Paladin is so much better then Druid individually and not with a Warrior or theoretical support dream team. I'd tell you to sit down too but your always already on your Knees.

    Kek.


    (Sorry to Staff if this banter isn't allowed, I'm trying keep it on Topic still as possible)

     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
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  14. Druiddroid

    Druiddroid Member Moderator

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    As Druid you can also spec only 1 talent point into Nature’s grasp. The buff lasts for 1 minute as long as it doesn’t proc and has a 35% chance with 1 talent point.

    Maybe for premades, you would want the full 100% just for the garauntee and so no one can dispel it.
     
  15. Livingforce

    Livingforce Member

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  16. Bung

    Bung Gnometastic

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  17. Dramatized

    Dramatized Grandfathered

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    Northdale
     
  18. Bowner

    Bowner Member

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    Yeah OFC they are both good classes still doesn't dismiss that Druid individually is better and with the right support. I'm not ''technically'' right cause I'm not bring any theoretical classes/support into the situation I'm basing of the classes INDIVIDUALLY.

    This Tier List is based of peoples opinions so some will think differently =/

    (Also you can shift Up to 10's on a BIS Druid with 22 Int on Weaponj)
    This is in a row without giving any time for mana regen.

    Druid FC BiS 1600~ HP / 1800 In Bear.
    1300~+ Mana.

    Paladin FC BiS 1400~ HP
    700~ Mana (900~ if 22 INT)

    Something to take into consideration as well.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
  19. Beachcomber

    Beachcomber Member

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    Warrior was a cc magnet back then but when I played pally I would just dump a Hand of Freedom on a buddy of mine and he would destroy people. Hopefully people don't forget the synergy of working with other classes.

    Hand of Freedom was game changing in twink brackets and I don't recall when it was available but that would be fun indeed.
     
  20. Symandria

    Symandria Veteran

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    I don't know who is better, but I believe those numbers are misleading. To make the HP comparison valid you'd need to include damage reduction % from armor, and I believe Paladin wins out by a fairly thick margin on that?

    And the mana count isn't the key thing it's how many useful casts of various types you can get off with the mana pool, and as I recall Paladin has a much higher mana efficiency per point because paladins are intended to have smaller base mana pools.

    Please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong : )
     

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