Ask Blizz 4 'The Gnoll King' the same treatment as 'Taragaman the Hungerer' .

Tinkerton

Legend
As everybody and there dog knows, the bracket is unbalanced by the fact that 'The Gnoll King' is available at 20 instead of a level more in tune with the level requirements of the old Stockades Quests ie an higher level.



While some might rejoice at the fact that a how-to-gear guide for Alliance basically reads 'Do the Dungeon Quests and slot some Honor', it isn't good for the bracket, especially given the circumstance that Blizz changed the WSG graveyards to cater to the apparently short attention span of rated BG folk (or at least that's their official reason now) and the...forgiving nature of the Hunter class.



Given the fact that they raised the minimum level for 'Taragaman the Hungerer' (and the other RFC quests as well) from 10 at The Shattering to 13 now, and did so overnight, it might be an idea to pose to Blizz this simple solution to prevent further problems: raise the minimum level of 'The Gnoll King' a few levels as well like they did with the RFC quests.



As currently the only thing that stays with Trial players is that PvP sucks, and it sucks even harder for Horde.
 
Even if this would happen too many people would have it grandfathered.



lol.
 
or they can offer the quests to both factions? seems better.
 
Of course they could also open it up to Horde as well, but so far it has always been with 'low level' Dungeon Quests that each Faction had their 'own' Dungeons and giving a Stockades Quest to Horde would be a new thing, and then the RFC etc. quests would have to be opened up as well - meaning more work for Blizz.



It also holds the risk of potentially opening a new can of worms - if Horde gets Eyepatch as well, then 'Hero of the Horde' and Mail rewards in general might end up being a problem. I've been in one BG with 8 Pallies on one team just yesterday, and that situation gets really silly real fast.



More importantly, the most unbalanced item benefits the most unbalanced classes the most -more Eyepatches means more unbalanced classes.



The problem is not just the stats, but the ease of acquisition: currently you can spit out an over 1k Ally non-Cloth toon from creation to close-to-BiS (excluding AGM etc ofc) in case of Hunters in somewhat over 10 hours.



That's the problem: the bracket gets flooded by the most OP classes wearing OP gear, a random Ally is a Huntard with over 1k health, the random Horde a guy in a dress and 700 health.



Yes many people already have one, but eventually they generally get their Heirlooms and then get bored with BG's, sometimes even sooner. I 'meet' very few people from even last AB CTA for example, so it seems that at least EU wise people tend to get bored or otherwise retire their toons pretty fast.



In short:

- raising the level would stop or at least stimy the constant flood of new OP toons;

- it wouldn't affect levellers;

- it's really easy for Blizz to do;

- Blizz has raised minimum levels before (eg the post-Shattering RFC Quests, which originally were level 10+) so it seems to fit their design philosophy.
 
Cailith said:
Only if I can get a Goblin Surveyor.



This is also a reason why simply raising the level would help: less discussions



(and Surveyor Junior has a very minor impact on the bracket, for starters because she can be picked up by all Classes and so doesn't create the whole 'Hunter-twinky-in-a-can' issue the Patch brings)
 
If making the eyepatch unavailable would stop the flow of hunters in the bracket, I'd be all for it. Speaking as someone whose characters both wear it.



Let's be honest though. That alone is not going to bring hunters in line with other classes, and it would do nothing to actually address the hunter problem.
 
Since it doesnt affect p2p twink brackets, I doubt Blizzard would so somethin to fix this.Imo, the easiest way could probably be giving Stock/RFC quests for both Horde and Alliance
 
Ciroe said:
If making the eyepatch unavailable would stop the flow of hunters in the bracket, I'd be all for it. Speaking as someone whose characters both wear it.



Let's be honest though. That alone is not going to bring hunters in line with other classes, and it would do nothing to actually address the hunter problem.



Would it be more ideal if they balanced Hunters (and classes in general) for the early levels of the game better?



Of course, they could easily cut Hunter damage in half and the class would still be more than viable, but it's quite obvious Ghostcrawler c.s. are not going to do any general balancing this year, if they'll ever do it.



They even said (on the EU Fora) why: 'it's too difficult for us to do our paid job so we rather do nothing'.



(though no doubt they'll claim that the new Expansion will do it, and, if it invariably will fail, say that 'PVP is balanced around level 90, not lower' or whatever the level cap then will be)



Would increasing the level requirement help?



Of course, because besides making Hunters less appealing/an issue (as less gear for a Class means it is less appealing to create such a toon, and all those dress-wearing Hunters - 'hur dur fur da crit an big numberzzz lololol' - end up in a mush soon enough), it would bring more balance to the Factions in general.



Both sides are equally terrible in randoms, with people ignoring Flag carriers, leaving bases unguarded etc., meaning things get down to raw stats - and that's where an extra slot providing a truckload of Hit rating, Stam and AP has its impact, and why the sort of people that get off on such thing as camping end up playing Alliance in this bracket.



(and yes I know this sounds harsh but I have toons on both sides, and while I like my little Gnomes, Every.Single.BG. at Ally some git starts pleading to camp in chat, and 95% of the games Alliance is winning is either because of camping or ends up with camping, while e.g the whole WSG weekend only once did someone plead for it on Horde side).



So, in short, would it solve ''the Hunter issue'''?



Not in general but it would be a simple fix that Blizz has shown to do in the past that would greatly help at making the Factions more balanced - which leads to less unsocial behaviour and require people to step up their game.
 
I'm just curious, do you feel that The Hunter Problem is strictly an Alliance hunter problem? Do you think that the Horde doesn't have a problem with hunters?
 
Ciroe said:
I'm just curious, do you feel that The Hunter Problem is strictly an Alliance hunter problem? Do you think that the Horde doesn't have a problem with hunters?



horde has too much blood elf and tauren pallies :(
 
Simple solution (easy to say, not quite as easy to actually implement, but...), give Horde something on par with the eyepatch that's relatively easily obtainable. Let's face it, the Lucky Fishing Hat is nice, but it's a bitch to get, and it's the only realistic option for the Horde. WB Fishing Hat or the goggles ain't even close to the eyeptach.



wildo said:
Since it doesnt affect p2p twink brackets, I doubt Blizzard would so somethin to fix this.Imo, the easiest way could probably be giving Stock/RFC quests for both Horde and Alliance



Unfortunately for f2p'ers, this is the truth.
 
lolItsMutank said:
or they can offer the quests to both factions? seems better.



Alternative helm choices pre-BoA across the board is something Blizz needs to add BADLY. I really think Blizz needs to do what I suggested in my blog and give rare mobs 2+ unique items; this way we'd have more gear across all brackets and helms with stats at lower levels isn't so ground breaking anymore. I say every slot on a character should be filled by at least level 15 with non-BoA gear. I remember when decent Shoulders and Rings were unheard of on characters level 25 or lower, now you craft rings at a low level for yourself and get shoulders from quests and instances at a low level as well.



~Zuty
 
Possible changes to address some issues with F2P twinks:



Change primary profession cap to 150 (gives casters Spidersilk Boots and 8 stamina/7 spirit engineering googles among other things.).

Lower the item level and stats on quest rewards from Stockades to be on par to iLvl 25 items.

Give horde mirrored equivalent items to Stockades rewards.

Allow mail to function across characters on the same WoW account/server/faction (I don't mean sending P2P heirlooms to F2P accounts on the same battle.net account).

Increase trial level cap to 24.

Allow purchases only from AH for trials.

Add a chat channel that allows F2Ps to communicate to each other.

Allow invitations to group from F2P to another F2P if both are on each other's friend's list.
 
IMHO opionion they should just take the restriction of only 100 Prof. Skill points away like they had it in BC and early to mid WotLK trials 'cuz we're able to get through Engineering stuff like:

Goblin Mining Helmet - Item - World of Warcraft (LFH for Mail Warrior/Pally less people at Fishing Tourney aye?)

Goblin Mortar - Item - World of Warcraft (Nice thing for added burst damage for not so powerful specs or classes who has no Defensive CDs who rely on their damage to win the fight)

Gnomish Rocket Boots - Item - World of Warcraft (Rocket Boots PHUN! :D Also for Goblin Engineering avaible as Goblin Rocket Boots)

Bright-Eye Goggles - Item - World of Warcraft (Obtainable Healing/Caster Headpiece which gets in range of the Eye Patch and also nearly LFH TBH IMO.)

Iron Grenade - Item - World of Warcraft (Grenades who doesn't love 'em to get some quick heals/fears or w/e done)



Ya, I know the damage seems rediculess we could put out with a nice combo just using those Items but you shouldn't forget that everything in this Bracket is about bursting ...
 
Jeralulz said:
IMHO opionion they should just take the restriction of only 100 Prof. Skill points away like they had it in BC and early to mid WotLK trials 'cuz we're able to get through Engineering stuff



Engineering and constantly farming your own mats for it may become expected to compete in battlegrounds. 225 seems like too much and might hurt the bracket in the long run.
 
Ciroe said:
I'm just curious, do you feel that The Hunter Problem is strictly an Alliance hunter problem? Do you think that the Horde doesn't have a problem with hunters?



Ease of acquisition.



Like many balance problems in WoW (in short: accessibillity is good for PvE, bad for PvP - much like XP rewards btw), this is the cardinal issue:



- because of the Dungeon Quest rewards (and eg The Battle of Darkshore), you can spit out a Blue gearded-enough Alliance Huntard (or Sub Rogue/Feral for that matter) from creation to fielding in about 11 hrs or so.



- a geared-enough Horde Rogue/Huntard is far more depending on Boss Drops and longer Quest Chains giving lower iLevel rewards, meaning it takes much longer to create a geared one.



The result is that while random Hordies may be Hunters/Rogues, they tend to be terribly geared (hence my jibes of 'dress-wearing', a lot of them wear dresses 'for the crit'), making them much less of an issue.



If Alliance had to rely on the same type of gear, random Alliance Hunters/Rogues would ALSO be cross-dressing pansies, and hence much less of an issue.



Would the impact of changes be large on the completely artificial environment of War Games/self-created Arena ?



Probably not, although the whole gear/class stacking-issue for those is completely artifical to begin with (you can have War Games etc. in Whites, and No Homers...er, Hunters is a completely valid option).



Would a change have a beneficial impact on the din of war in the actual Battlegrounds/health of the bracket?



Yes, as those Battlegrounds are filled with random people, the demographic on which Ease of Acquisition has such an impact.
 

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