BFA 70s in BfA

Discussion in 'Level 70-79' started by Shinela, Jun 13, 2018.

Share This Page

  1. Shinela

    Shinela Not your everyday tank Guardians of the 70s

    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Greetings!

    I have returned from work in Spanish Hell, and am here to update you with all my findings in the beta!
    I'd like to remind you that this will update steadily, so though it might start small, it can update to becoming a whole LotR book's worth of stuff! Probably not, it'll at least grow.

    Let's begin!

    TANKING
    We all know that I am first and foremost, a tank. So this is what I'll cover first.

    Threat has been redesigned (nerfed) in BfA, let's look into how:
    Legion: In Legion, a tank's threat is equal to 14 - 20 times their damage, depending on the ability. In BfA, this is only 4 times.

    As an example:
    - A DPS deals 500 damage: They gain 500 threat.
    - A tank (Legion) deals 200 damage: They generate 2800 to 4000 threat.
    - A tank (BfA) deals 200 damage: They generate 800 threat.


    In Battle for Azeroth, Taunt multiplies the Threat gained by the tank by an additional 5 times for the Taunt duration. This is consistent with how Taunt works in Legion.

    High Threat abilities will multiply the Threat gained by an additional 4 times.

    This means:
    - If a tank deals 100 damage to a mob, they generate 400 threat.
    - If the mob has taunt on it, they instead generate 900 threat. (4*base + 5 times additional by taunt)
    - If the ability was a High Threat ability, it generates 800 threat. (4*base + 4 times additional by ability)
    - If a tank deals 100 damage to a taunted mob with a High Threat ability, they generate 1300 threat. (4*base, 5*taunt, 4*High Threat)

    For those of you asking which is the best tank? Uhm... This is how I feel it's going for me personally:
    Paladin = Druid > Warrior = DK > Monk
    Do not believe these results. They are my personal testing alone on beta. A true line-up will only exist once live is up and everything's properly tested by more than one person.

    Warrior
    General
    Warriors are still quite versatile and strong. More than any other tank do they gain from Strength with their new passive "Vanguard".
    This will give you Armour equal to 40% of your Strength, and makes them beasts against Physical Damage.

    Gameplay
    Protection Warrior feels very similar to Legion. Except, it's better.
    You have more abilities than before, and your talents feel more impressive and impacting. All to all, a warrior has merely been upgraded. If you liked Warriors in Legion, you'll like them in BfA.
    Also, Spell Reflection! Hurrah!

    Talents
    These will still have to be tested in proper combat. They are impacting and interesting, but to name which ones are better than the others are hard to do right now. Mind you, talents are better than before (At least to me).

    Paladin
    General
    Paladins seem to be in the leading spot for as far as I can see. Numbers shouldn't be looked at in Beta, but Paladin seems to be in a really good spot.
    They have been given the needed quality of life changes whilst retaining almost all of their previous positives.

    Gameplay
    Protection Paladin feels very similar to Legion as well, except it's got rid of some clunk.
    An example will be Consecration. Previously it would go away faster with your haste, having you use it more often as a result. This is no longer the case. Additionally now, Consecration doesn't give benefits for yourself unless you're fighting in AoE, so it's no longer a dead GCD for your self benefits.
    Personally, Paladin is the most boring for me right now.

    Light of the Protector is now better on high health and worse on lower health. It heals for a fixed base amount (About 10% of your HP) and up to twice that amount on lower HP.

    Talents
    These again will have to be tested. Only the first row was truly interesting to me. The second row was all right though boring, the third and fourth row are boring.

    Death Knight
    General
    The DK is going to be a hit or miss on their position. Depending on the fight and the amount of enemies they can either be a beast or a pot noodle. Their health seems a little lower than other tanks, and their standard mitigation is on the low side. Though Blood has potential, I'm not too keen on them as a main tank for now.
    The cooldowns are a little weaker (Blooddrinker for the worst), but this is made up by the fact that we have more cooldowns now.

    Strength will give more armour on boneshield.

    This one will need a lot more testing.

    Gameplay
    Blood DK feels similar to Legion much like the other tanks. Not many changes happened at all to standard combat, though your cooldown rotation will change. Blooddrinker is now barely a heal, and your Death Strike will be your main gain for health. Runic Power is now only used for Death Strike, and you'll need it.
    Though you have quite a few cooldowns under your belt, they are not as strong as you'll remember them to be. Panic moments will cost two cooldowns most of the time.
    Though fun to play, their abilities feel like they have less impact. A hit or miss tank at this point.

    Talents
    Admittedly the DK has the most interesting choices for talents. The first row perhaps the most obvious, the others really make it interesting. Lots of testing required for those, but talent wise the Blood DK is in a top spot.

    Monk
    General
    The Monk seems to be quite weak, lacking in passive mitigation. Though they do stagger damage, they will still take a lot more damage than the other tanks, making this the most healer intensive tank.
    The cooldowns they have are quite strong, but their cooldown is quite long as well.
    Though lacking on the defensive respect, they so far deal the most damage. (Beta numbers though, mind you. Subject to change.)

    Gameplay
    I have never been too keen on how a monk in general plays, and this hasn't changed here. As far as memory serves, the monk plays similar to how they did before. Unfortunately, I can't compare them to Legion very well as my gameplay with them has been minimal.
    Personally I still don't enjoy them, but I feel if you enjoyed them before, you still will.

    Don't let my personal dislike for them stop you from playing them. Like I mentioned, if you liked them before, you more than probably will still like them now.

    Talents
    Though a couple of interesting choices, they all feel very uninteresting to me. The first row being the most interesting, the others lack a little in terms of.. Spice.

    Druid
    General
    The Druid seems to be a gem. Unfortunately I am personally unable to copy over my own level 70 druid, but have instead been playing with the level 64 one that I did manage to copy over.
    I must say, Guardian Druid has interested me now in a way it didn't do before. Lacking in interesting talents, I have taken a liking to them that I didn't have before. I cannot point out exactly what this reason is, but I can point out that I like it.

    The Guardian Druid has a lot of potential ahead of itself.

    Gameplay
    The Druid plays and feels like it did in Legion, and yet it feels more complete to me personally. Again as a lack of true investment through Legion in Guardian Druids for me, I am unable to pinpoint what exactly has made me like them more now than before.

    Talents
    Unfortunately, these are disappointing to me. Your choices affect combat very little to almost not.

    HEALING
    Healers are hard to test as numbers are difficult to place. Testing a healer means overtuned healers will obviously feel better. To avoid this, I will focus myself purely on how your healing itself feels, and how many options you have before yourself.

    Which ones are the best? It's hard to say. I'll instead put them onto their respective fun level for me!
    Resto > Resto = Holy > Disc = Holy > Mistweaver

    Priest
    General
    With your return of a spammable Power Word: Shield, you're either overpowered or weaker than before. Though it doesn't shield a lot, with the right talent you will gain loads of mana back for it. You're in a very good position, much like before except better.
    Though you lack in any powerful heals for needed panic, this hasn't been in your toolkit before either.

    Gameplay
    You feel very much like you did in Legion when it comes to general DPS / Healing. You are a very strong member of the team, and much like before you aren't the main healer but by god will you be useful. The less healing intense a fight, the stronger you are. You're the reasons other healers can go DPS instead.

    You did lose your instant heal on a single target. This makes the following statement only more true:
    You're a controlled healer, not a reactive healer. Prevent damage as best as you can, and know what to expect when so you can catch up. If something happens that you didn't expect, you're in trouble, and you have no panic mode heal. Make yourself count. People who know the fight will be much much better than people who don't.

    Talents
    No changes.
    General
    What do you mean, Beta has changes? Not here. You're still a very good healer, and your AoE capabilities have been slightly improved.

    A holy priest will remain to be the very strong healer. With many versatile options between AoE and Single Target, you'll stand quite firm on your ground when it comes to filling a spot in the group.

    Gameplay
    Legion

    Talents
    There are some changes, but nothing too impressive to note on. Mind you, your choices are fun and do change your gameplay a little.

    Paladin
    General
    You're going to be okay. You seem a little quirky with how everything goes but your tank healing place is still up there. Your biggest use is that you make it easier for other healers as well. Lowering trouble within the whole group, you're a very good supportive healer who'll just reduce overall pressure whilst not being bored on downtime by having some dps abilities to go along with it. You're good, and useful.

    Gameplay
    Just like every other healer (except shaman), you've almost no changes. Your use in the raid is the same as before, and you'll heal in a very similar fashion.

    Talents
    With a couple changes in your talent rows, it seems like you can have a little more fun and diversity in your choices on abilities.

    Monk
    General
    It seems like you're in a good spot. You'll still shine in small raid groups of 5 to 10 people but you're nothing too extraordinary.

    Gameplay
    You heal very much in the same style as you did before which makes you strong for groups between 5 and 10. Your damage abilities are still there, and you'll use them just as often. The rotation for dps is the most interesting of all the healers.

    Talents
    Unfortunately they seem quite uninteresting so far. So not much changed.

    Shaman
    General
    You've changed the most of all healers at 70. Your single target healing has improved, and you'll have the choice to change this improvement to AoE instead. Though strong, you need people to be at least somewhat stacked, making fights that have people spread out a little harder for you to put on with.

    Gameplay
    Perhaps I am biased because I love shaman in general, but gameplay wise the resto shaman is the most fun of all healers. You've had the most interesting changes at 70, mostly to thank to your talents.
    And though you're missing out on a cooldown as Healing Tide Totem is not available at 70, you'll still manage fine with your other cooldowns.

    Talents
    Your talents have changed quite a bit! A return to Earth Shield is probably my favourite. Your other talents choices are amazing in general, and I absolutely adore them! The first row changes your healing style, as does the second row. The third row is perhaps a little more simple but then the fourth gives you the option between three very strong talents, and these talents make up for losing out on the Healing Tide Totem!

    Druid
    General
    The Resto Druid seems to be in the worst position of all healers for now. Your role as a healer is comparable to that of the Discipline Priest: You are a controlled healer, not a reactive healer. Keep the fight under control, expect things before they happen. Prepare for things, don't wait for things.

    Though you may be quite strong if your numbers work out well, you still face a problem much like the Discipline Priest: You lack any strong panic heals. You hold Swiftmend in one hand, and a lack of Tranquillity in the other.

    Gameplay
    I always enjoyed the playstyle of a Resto Druid. Losing your Healing Touch leaves me feeling like there's a gap. Though as your playstyle is completely HoTs, I kind of understood why it is gone; it doesn't fit the rest of your playstyle.

    Still incredibly fun to manage all yours HoTs and watching the health of your tank dwindle back and forth everlastingly like a Windows XP trying to update Java, once the throughput of enemies is too much, you're just incapable of catching back up.

    You're not going to be the life saviour, you're the upkeeper. Control the fight, and let others take care of damage spikes.

    Talents
    I don't notice anything worthy of note. Mostly like Legion, the options don't change your gameplay by much. The first row is the best row.

    DAMAGE
    Working on this now. This'll take a lot of time.
    (This is written in a PvE-focused perspective)

    Just like the others, you can't go by numbers here. I will ignore all numbers by damage and will follow purely how it has changed and how it feels to play at level 70 in specific.

    Warrior
    General
    The arms warrior is basically an upgrade from Legion in terms of how it feels. Where you lost a reset on Colossus Smash, you gained a reset on a baseline Overpower instead. All in all, you're mostly just a better version of your Legion counterpart.

    Gameplay
    With the few changes you had, you still do feel completely different to Legion. Although your skills are mostly the same, you play it differently.
    With changes to your rotation, you feel a little more complete. Still with downtime every now and then, at least you feel like your kit is complete. You don't feel like you need those few abilities that endgame has. You don't need those talents that you can't get. Sure, it would be nice, but you're complete enough as it is. The Arms Warrior is very satisfying to play right now with what it's gained, and although it may not be the most intense, it is at least complete.

    Rotation
    You no longer focus yourself on getting resets on Colossus Smash. Your Colossus Smash still gives you a damage window but no longer resets itself. Instead, your Overpower is now a baseline ability that resets instead. Your gameplay changes quite a bit in result.

    You no longer have full controlled burst as you need to wait for Colossus Smash to be ready. If you wait too long to use it however, you'll lose out on DPS too. The window it gives is massive: 30% more damage for 10 seconds!

    Generally speaking, you'd use Colossus Smash as it comes off cooldown and only then should you use trinkets or other items that increase your damage. After that, you use Mortal Strike on CD and keep rend on the target if you play it. Then comes Overpower which you should use on proc too, though prioritise Mortal Strike more. Slam comes in as a last filler for when you're out of other things, but only when above 50 rage.

    Talents
    Your talents have changed a little bit. The first row impacts your playstyle the most whilst having the most changes to what it used to offer. The third row also changes your playstyle a little. The talents are interesting, especially compared to some other classes.
    General
    Fury looks like it'll be boring, but it very definitely is not. It lacks a lot of buttons to press when it comes to dealing damage, but as it comes to it.. Well, you don't actually need more buttons anyway. Your rotation feels smooth and fun, perhaps a little boring after a long stretch of time but as most people don't play 70 forever and only 70, especially not on one spec alone, this is not something to worry about.

    You are quick paced, and you'll love it.

    Gameplay
    The Fury Warrior right now is all about speed. Satisfying, rampaging speed. Start the fight and start slashing away. Buttons will be pressed, and you'll -always- have something to press. If you don't, you're wrong.

    Quick decisions are your friend. Don't press a button for 1 second, you're playing it wrong. Don't use Bloodthirst on CD, you're playing it wrong. Don't use rampage as soon as it's up, you're playing it wrong. Look at your cat, you're playing it wrong. This spec, though lacking many spells, is very quick and satisfying to play.

    Your gameplay is all about being enraged and keeping that going as best you can.

    Rotation
    Bloodthirst is used on CD unless you recently used Rampage. Raging Blow is used on CD when enraged or when bloodthirst is on CD already.
    If you play Sudden Death, prioritise it over everything except Bloodthirst (if you didn't use Rampage recently).
    If you play Furious Slash, use it as a filler between everything else, but make sure you always keep your stacks!
    If you play Inner Rage, always have 1 Raging Blow on cooldown and try to abuse your enrage damage bonus as much as you can with it.

    Talents
    Though talents are mostly passives, it's easy to say that your choices in talents will sooner or later be definite. By this I mean to say that one is better than the other and you'll just have to deal with it. Mind you, row 3 is amazing at impacting how you play!

    Warlock
    General
    From what memory serves, affliction feels a lot more complete to me now compared to BfA. Maybe it's a bias because of the changes, but I feel like my rotation against the target is complete. I have something to do all the time, and I don't feel like I lack anything detrimental. There's a dps cooldown, a defensive cooldown, a filler, things to maintain, everything's there to make me like it.

    Gameplay
    Dots. Yes, that's no surprise to anyone here. And even though you can choose to play full dots (By running Drain Soul), I kind of like having Shadow Bolt instead whilst I'm managing my dots on the target.

    Your rotation is complete, and even though numbers on the PTR are very weak right now, that's bound to change soon. You're very nice to play!

    Rotation
    In simple terms you place dots on your enemies and manage them properly whilst sending out your cooldowns and fillers on well timed moments so you don't lose out on any single dot damage.

    Talents
    Your talents are incredibly interesting! Changing playstyle on every row, it looks like your talents are more a choice of how you'd like to play at 70 and less on "which is better for dps". Mind you, eventually it falls down to "hey this does more dps" anyway, but at least every talent choice changes how you play!
    General
    I remember saying, when Legion launched, that I really liked the idea of the Demonology Warlock, but that it just felt... incomplete. But now in BfA, they've done it right.

    Demonology was my biggest surprise on the fun factor. Your spec feels well rounded. Sure, you're missing that spice, a strong cooldown to complete your feeling as a full spec. But maybe you just don't need that to have fun! After all, the rotation of the Demonology lock is.. Surprisingly good!

    Gameplay
    You take some time to get used to. Having to learn all the subtle things that make this spec fun. At first it seems a bit overwhelming but once you get the hang of it, it's really not that bad. Like I mentioned earlier, this spec was a very big surprise on how fun it turned out to be for me.

    What more, you feel like you actually control the demons, and you're commanding them to annihilate your opponent! Now let's just hope the numbers go to your favour as well. Every time you cast a spell, you know it'll do something positive for your future casts, and that's a beautiful feeling to have.

    Rotation
    Your rotation runs mostly around gathering crystals and using Hand of Gul'dan to summon more imps. And keep yourself in a beautiful rotation with this.

    You open a fight with a full-cast Demonbolt, call in dreadstalkers, summon imps with Hand of Gul'dan, and spam Shadow Bolt. Eventually you get Demonic Core procs, making Demonbolt instant, allowing you to summon more imps with Hand of Gul'dan, allowing you to get Demonic Core more often, and.. You get it. Really fun spec.

    Implosion is an ability that at first feels like it should be used once the imps start run out, but you shouldn't. It's purely for AoE. It removes all your imps in general and in a good rotation, you'll have them coming constantly. Killing them off would be painful for your dps.

    Talents
    Meaningful and interesting in choices, this follows the same path as Affliction.
    General
    Compared to the other specs, you've changed the least. And the changes you did get have been for the worse. It felt really bad to play Destruction compared to the other 2 specs. I suppose that is a good change for once, seeing as I always preferred Destro before.

    Gameplay
    You feel like a fire mage felt for me when I was leveling one back in the burning crusade. I liked playing it back then, but my mind has shifted since to liking other things.

    When I played Destro now, to me it felt as if it was incomplete. I take 15 minutes against a dummy and one dungeon for every spec to learn it and form an opinion. I just felt like I was playing my spec wrong the entire time with Destro, but I wasn't? Despite not having many changes at all, I didn't like it like I used to.

    I'm sure some people will like this spec though, so let me point out the good things:
    Every spell you cast does genuinely bring impact. No spell feels worthless, even your filler feels like it does at least do -something- for your future casts, not just an empty filler.

    Rotation
    Well let's just say, the rotation falls down to an actual real rotation. You're all about managing a perfect rotational feeling with your class and forgetting all about procs and other minorities.

    You have a well rounded rotation in your hands to play with, from gathering your crystals with incinerate to managing your dot with immolate and using conflagrate as a way to speed up chaos bolt.

    Talents
    At least here you can choose for the spells and fill your bars with something. Warlock does talents right, at the very least.

    Priest

    General
    If there's one thing the Shadow priest does right, it's ramping up the damage. From as low start into a menacing machine and starting over again.

    Gameplay
    You haven't changed a lot compared to Legion, but honestly you didn't have to. The few changes you did get, were for the better. These are talent changes. Well, apart from losing Shadow Word: Death, anyway.
    Your abilities feel more impacting with their new animations and sounds, and generally speaking you -feel- very strong. Numbers will determine whether you actually -are- or not.

    If you enjoyed the Shadow Priest before, you'll like it even more now.

    Rotation
    Much like before, you keep your dots on your target with your Mind Blast (or talented version of it) used on cooldown, and mind flay as a filler.

    Void Form is not as strong as it was before when talking endgame, but for us it's still very strong as Void Bolt in its own is such a strong spell at this level. (Mind you, this can change! Just don't think it will very much. If anything, it will get buffed as it's so weak in endgame.)

    Talents
    With the changes to your talent tree, I can easily say I love them. Though I advice to play Shadowy Insight to change up your rotation a little, it's definitely only because I enjoy having a proc. All in all, your talent tree is interesting.

    Mage
    General
    Similar to Legion in almost every respect, I feel that's because you were in a good spot where you were anyway. You're a little more interesting now that you have the Pheonix Flames ability, which I recommend you pick that talent if you want to enjoy fire a little bit more but even if you don't, at least you've a complete rotation.

    Gameplay
    Like I mentioned, you're very similar to Legion. In fact, in your general rotation literally nothing has changed unless you pick the Pheonix Flames talent which changes up your rotation just a little bit. No matter your choice there though, you're just like how you were in Legion. It would be nice to have some more cooldowns, to have Meteor and or Living Bomb, but you can't have everything. Good place, nothing too much to hype over, but definitely good.

    Rotation
    cast Fireball;
    if Fireball crit;
    cast Fire Blast; then
    cast Pyroblast;
    if Pyroblast crit; then repeat line above​
    if Fire Blast on CD; cast Fireball
    if second Fireball crit;
    cast Pyroblast​
    if no crit, repeat​

    When playing Phoenix Flames, -always- have one charge on cooldown and replace it with Fire Blast unless all charges are on cooldown.
    When playing Alex's Fury, use it over Fire Blast to get the second Hot Streak buff.

    Talents
    Some of your talents have changed around, and personally for the better. I missed the old Blast Wave ability, the way it was during the Burning Crusade. We have that back now, which I just love.
    General
    Just like Fire, you've made almost no changes compared to Legion. In fact, you've changed even less. Sure, Arcane Missiles acts a little different now and that's about it? I'm sure someone will correct me on this, but.. As much as I can tell, you've changed very little.

    Gameplay
    Let me put it this way: Arcane Missiles doesn't grant, use, or interact with Arcane Charges any more. Even more so, you can now spam it. And that's exactly what you're doing. Currently the numbers are in such a way that spamming Arcane Missiles does more damage than Arcane Blast at max charges, for less mana. These are numerical values though. If it stays this way, you'll be the most simple class: Arcane Missiles till you're out of mana, evocation, and spam Arcane Missiles again. Though boring to me, I'm sure some people will love this playstyle a lot.

    Rotation
    Depends on the numbers here. If 4 charges of Arcane Blast does more damage than Arcane Missiles:
    Spam Arcane Blast, cast Arcane Missiles on proc (to save mana), use Evocation when low on mana and Arcane Power only after evocation and having 4 stacks.
    When low on mana with evocation on CD, spam Arcane blast till you can't any more, use Arcane Barrage, and repeat. Keep using Arcane Missiles on proc.
    Presence of Mind will be used on CD.

    If Arcane Missiles does more damage than 4 charges with Arcane Blast:
    Spam Arcane Missiles and use Arcane Barrage on CD. Evocation on low mana, use Arcane Power after evocation, spam Arcane Missiles.
    If no Evocation and low on mana, cry a lot and spam Arcane Barrage on CD till you have mana. Also cry.

    Talents
    If any of them changed, then they changed something that nobody noticed into something that nobody will notice.
    General
    Your AFK Ray of Frost days are over! ... You time on being incredibly strong, however, isn't. Right now your numbers are really strong on the PTR and on the Beta. But like I mentioned, I don't go by numbers on here as they're the subject most likely to change, so I'll digress that entirely and focus on gameplay.

    Gameplay
    Mostly similar to Legion, you've gotten a few changes. With a couple changes in your talents, you've actually lost some spice. Your loss on Ray of Frost has actually hurt you more than you might first think. It changed things more than even I realised at first. @Dreams has been kind enough to point things out for me here, so i shall let him take over for me here!

    Rotation
    Cast Frostbolt
    Cast Ice Lance on proc
    Cast Flurry on proc
    Always use Ice Lance procs before flurry procs
    Use Ice Lance right after Flurry​

    Talents
    A few changes but not an entire overhaul. Still, I enjoy the changes quite a lot. They impact your playstyle, and I like it.

    Shaman
    General
    What once was considered a laughable spec has actually turned out to be quite all right. Numbers wise you aren't on the top, but we both know numbers are subject to change. Like.. A lot.

    If this isn't what you care about though, what about this. "YOU HAVE MASTERY!"
    That's right, you have mastery.

    Now, despite showing disabled on the character stats, it is actually active as shown here:
    without Mastery vs with Mastery
    (tested on gems as well)

    Gameplay
    Well, despite being mostly like you were in Legion, you do have some things going for you in BfA. First of all, you're not worse than a Restoration Shaman any more in terms of dps. Second of all, Earth Shock now deals its highest damage at 60 Maelstrom, making it a little easier to manage at a lower level where Maelstrom is maxed at 100.

    Rotation
    Keep Flame Shock up, cast Lava Burst on CD or proc, filler with Lightning Bolt. Use Earth Shock after 60 maelstrom but prioritise Lava Burst procs still unless they keep proccing after 90 maelstrom.

    Talents
    With quite a few different talents under your wing, it feels like your choices do change your playstyle a little. Not much, but at least you can feel it. Consider your talents more of a support row. Either supporting yourself or your team.
    General
    You're still a top notch hybrid. Sure, you lost Healing Rain, but you got Earth Shield instead (if you like to use it). On top of that, your heal is really strong (Just like other hybrids). With its instant castability though, you're very useful in raids to help keeping the tank up! Fill silent gaps with a heal every now and then on your tank or self, why don't you?

    Gameplay
    When it comes to combat, you feel like you're in Legion for the most part. With a few changes to it that I personally like. These changes are mostly in terms of speed. For some reason, it feels like everything just procs a little more consistently.

    Before, in Legion, your procs would all line up together. A burst of procs! and then nothing for a while. And another burst of procs left right and centre! And nothing again.
    In BfA, this is a little more streamlined. You still get bursts of procs, but the parts where you got nothing before have now been filled up. A few more procs in the silent parts and few less in the bursty parts. Really streamlined it.

    If you enjoyed it in Legion, you'll definitely enjoy it now too.

    Rotation
    Keep Flametongue buff up, cast Stormstrike whenever available. Cast Lava Lash when above 50 Maelstrom, cast Rockbiter at any other time.
    Most of your fun in rotation comes from talents.

    Talents
    Sure, the talents are really good, but at the same time I hate them. Not because of what they are, but because my favourite talents are all in the same rows.
    Lightning Shield is incredibly interesting and fun, but Hot Hand just makes the combat more interactive. Both are in the same line. If I could have both, I'd be in heaven!
    Same for the third row. Searing Assault feels like it should be passive, Hailstorm was my favourite talent to pick, but now Overcharge is in the same line which also makes the rotation more fun. The talents are REALLY fun, but.. The choices are painful If only I could have both!

    Death Knight
    General
    The DK on both Frost and Unholy are currently (as of 21st of June) still in queue for changes and reworks. This means that all of this will change one day or another.

    Gameplay

    Frost isn't bad, you've got what you need to play a full rotation with a very similar feel to Legion, it's just changed pace a little bit. This pace change might be at a lack of haste, but also from the introduction of a GCD on spells that don't feel like they should (Pillar of Frost and Empowered Rune Weapon come to mind).

    Talents
    Your talents are different. I still haven't wrapped my head around the idea on whether they are more fun or not, right now novelty makes it more interesting that it truly is.
    General
    The DK on both Frost and Unholy are currently (as of 21st of June) still in queue for changes and reworks. This means that all of this will change one day or another.

    Gameplay

    Your rotation is fine but you lack a decent filler, something to keep yourself busy with on long fights. What more is that you miss out on almost all of your offensive cooldowns, them being earned on level 74, 75 and 82 as well as your later talents.

    Your rotation in general has nothing inherently wrong with it, it just feels a little incomplete for me personally with its slower pace and lack of filler. Perhaps this is just the thing that attracts you to this spec, instead!

    Talents
    Just like frost, your talents are different. Unlike frost, I do actually feel these talents are better than before.

    Paladin
    General
    It's a very common word from people to hear how you're going back to Cata. Honestly, this is a good thing. Cata was considered the best time for Retribution Paladins, and with the few quality of life changes that I found, I actually see this work out quite well. Are you strong? .. Yeah. You are. I don't know if this will last though.

    Gameplay
    Like I mentioned, you had a few quality of life changes and they are quite good.
    Your main focus lies on generating Holy Power and using it without ever trying to get too much Holy Power. Right now, you can hold up to 6 Holy Power. All your abilities using Holy Power will drain 3 at a time. If you generate more than 6, you effectively lose that Holy Power into nothingness, and you want to avoid that.
    You have a few useful utility tools as well: An expensive heal, a dispell (Poison and Disease), Blessing of Freedom, two Greater Blessings, Lay on Hands, .. You get the picture.

    Rotation
    The start of the fight is the hardest. After that it simplifies down to using your Holy Power generators as effective as possible, and your Holy Power spenders whenever you can. The cooldowns line up nicely enough.
    At the start, I recommend using Wake of Ashes if you play it, spend 3 Holy Power, and then start building a rotation from Blade of Justice, Judgment, Crusader Strike, Holy Power spender, then play with your cooldowns.

    Talents
    Though interesting, they will definitely form to a "This is better" staple and every retri will run the same talent build very shortly. The talents do change your playstyle a little bit, which is always a plus.

    Monk
    General
    This is the first time I enjoyed playing Windwalker. It's mostly similar to Legion, but it was just now that I actually gave it a chance because beta testing. I've never given WW much of a chance before. Now having spent about two hours playing this spec fighting a dummy and doing dungeons, I've come to the conclusion that.. You know, it's actually fun. Not my favourite, but it beats many other specs out there for me, fun wise.

    Gameplay
    Perhaps a bit simple which is where it loses some fun for me, but all in all not too simple. I do advice playing Ascension despite losing a button with it. It speeds up your general gameplay and just makes it more fun.
    The biggest problem I can find is that you only have one ability to generate Chi with and so many to spend it with. Nothing that goes on a short cooldown to generate chi with to add into the rotation.
    Your fun mostly relies on AoE!

    Rotation
    Tiger Palm to generate Chi, spend chi with priorities being: 1) Fists of Fury; 2) Rising Sun Kick; 3) Blackout Kick. Only use blackout kick procs when Rising Sun Kick is on cooldown.
    Always use Storm Earth and Fire when you are ready for it (Fists of Fury ready, and a good amount of Energy)
    AoE is more fun:
    Always change target after every ability to make Spinning Crane Kick much stronger. The more unique targets you use a single-target ability on, the stronger Spinning Crane Kick becomes.

    Talents
    Can't say I'm too impressed with them, but it does give you some choice on more or less buttons which is always nice.

    All findings on gems and enchants have moved over to
    --->
    BiS Enchant & Gems List
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2018
    • Like Like x 8
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. strec021

    strec021 Grandfathered

    Messages:
    102
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Will PVE become even harder?

    Just logged onto the beta and my 70 semi-twinked priest (Brutal Gladiator twink from Wrath) does ~10% of live damage with ~50% of the hp, on enemies with ~25% of the hp of live. I can't even get close to soloing dungeon elites, world mob kill speed seems okay.

    A lot of the dps-cheesing abilities available at 70 on live are gone or in a neutered state.

    Have you done any testing in that realm?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Awze

    Awze Veteran

    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    8
    If you need help as far as anything for understanding anypart of DKs, selecting the new talent choices, or anything, feel free to message me. Interested to see on how they do in BFA seeing block value is part shields now and how us DKs will keep up with others in that aspect!
     
  4. Gixxer66

    Gixxer66 Member

    Messages:
    369
    Likes Received:
    76
    Trophy Points:
    38
    WB Shinela - Couple of bits and pieces. Some set bonuses show as active but don't give any stats, Spellfire and Whitemend appear to fall into this category. The 164 Sunwell gear drops to 90, you might find that some of the lower level epics now give more stats again ..... I havent spent long checking out gear but I'm more than happy to Screenie my mages bank / gear.

    TBC Epic gems are still +10 Primary Stat or +20 Secondary - No longer Correct 23/06/2018 Edit

    Disc in WPvP is hilarious on beta, I managed to die once to a 110 Fire Mage after not respecting him popping all his Cd's, but that was after I had killed him 3 times.

    Not really of interest to 70's but the Blue 308 / 409 / 440 gear is no longer BiS on 80's - the WotLK slotted gear is streets ahead
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
    • Like Like x 1
  5. OP
    Shinela

    Shinela Not your everyday tank Guardians of the 70s

    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    I have mostly been busy with testing tanking and healing so far. To me, soloing dungeon elites is just as easy now as it was back then. Perhaps tanks just didn't suffer as much as other classes did. I'll get to DPS the last, first I'm testing the healers, and it's not easy to test these properly!

    DKs aren't in such a bad spot as I was first expecting. You're quite in an odd spot I have to admit, but you're not doing terrible. In fact, you still beat a monk! .. Who also lacks a shield xD

    But no, DK seems fine so far, but I need to do a lot more testing on them!

    There were always some set bonuses that skipped the meters of being deactivated. I suppose this is only where they're disabling the others but still fail to actually mention it in the tooltip.

    Lower ilvl gear can give more stats, especially when they have more sockets. When I'm done with the healers, I'm going to check on how much ilvl matters now. That will give me a weight on how much ilvl matters compared to gear in general. I'll update you on this later by sure!

    TBC gems for me scale to +10 Primary or +19 Secondary.

    PvP is in a very funny place so I've heard. I will definitely have a look in it later on!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Gixxer66

    Gixxer66 Member

    Messages:
    369
    Likes Received:
    76
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Srry on more thing I should have mentioned - Breath of Enchants give better stats than Gift of enchants on a 70 now
     
  7. OP
    Shinela

    Shinela Not your everyday tank Guardians of the 70s

    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    So I've gathered, but those will be brought up once I start updating my BiS enchant list ^.^

    Thanks though for reminding me!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Dreams

    Dreams saved

    Messages:
    1,672
    Likes Received:
    445
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Glad you're doing this thread!

    Here are the things I'm most interested in knowing:
    • Raiding difficulty compared to live
    • Is the ilvl boost still in effect, and if so, has it been adjusted to fit the new ilvl numbers?
    • I assume the stats on gear has been decreased, but what about gems and enchants?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Awze

    Awze Veteran

    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Yeah hearing that actually makes me a little glad I would hate for them to fall into the bottom tier for tanks.

    Whenever you get the chance, can you test some of these things out (I apologize I know it's a lot I'm just curious to see how they are on the beta)
    the damage on Rune strike, the damage/healing on blooddrinker, how hemostasis does compared to consumption (2nd tier talent), how much anti-magic barrier increases AMS by (with around like real numbers i know the percentage but i don't know how much it'll be on actual wow).

    For tanks, what I'm seeing is that strength is increasing armor for warriors (who have it as a passive ability), DKs (boneshield), and paladins (shield of the righteous). For this I'm curious on how this is actually working. Seeing I have a DK, can you tell me the armor difference with boneshield up and it not up, how much armor and strength you have?

    how are tanks also against magic damage now seeing like damage reduction seems more focused on melee attacks?

    once again sorry that it's a lot rip
     
  10. OP
    Shinela

    Shinela Not your everyday tank Guardians of the 70s

    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    I never focus on numbers in the Beta as they are almost aaaalways going to change. The skills and abilities won't exactly, but numbers definitely do.

    Either way these are your requested numbers as of June 13, 2018; Beta Version 26812;

    Rune Strike: 60% of AP.
    In raw numbers on my DK: 434 damage. Compared to Heart Strike at 175 damage and Death Strike at 604 damage.

    Blooddrinker drains 1280 health from my target, same damage. This is over 3 ticks, each individual one can crit. (Around 430 per tick on non crit)

    Consumption at 5 targets heals myself for 1445 if none of the hits crit.

    Hemostasis at 5 stacks increases Death Strike's potential by 40%. 604/100*140 = 846. This includes healing done. At lowest, you'll heal for 10% of max health, making it 14% here at the lowest. That's 1841 HP, or 525 more than before.
    Now imagine I took 50% of my HP in damage in the last 5 seconds. That means I'll heal for 30% of 50%, + 40% extra making it 42% of 50%. That will make the heal go from 1973 to 2762. A difference of 789 HP.

    Hemostasis can be used 11 times by me per minute if I use it properly. Consumption 1.3 times.

    Though Hemostasis wins in long battle terms, I don't assume you're going to AoE for that long in a row that you'll need a more steady health help. Consumption is the better choice personally, as it heals for a great deal more, especially as more targets gather (Plus you can abuse it on critters). Hemostasis is good if you're pulling a lot of packs in a row, or if you're fighting a big group. Mind you, this was used in optimal cases for Hemostasis too. But it's not that bad. I'd just prefer Consumption personally as it feels like a more worthy CD, and it's better in bigger packs.


    AMS default value: 4814 dmg
    AMS talented value: 6258 dmg


    Armour: I have
    385 armour at 34.25% reduction without Boneshield
    526 armour at 41.58% reduction with Boneshield

    Every 2.57 strength, I gain 1 armour more on Boneshield.
    At 355 strength I get 142 armour.
    At 170 strength I get 68 armour.
    At 351 strength I get 140 armour.

    To test this, I removed random armour pieces:
    At 312 strength I should get:
    355 - 312 = 43 strength less (Comparing strength to above numbers)
    43 / 2.57 = 16.73 armour less (Comparing how much armour I should technically lose)
    142 - 16.73 = 125.27 armour (Expecting how much armour I should have compared to above numbers)
    Round it: 125 armour.
    In game Value: 125 armour.

    Here's the formula on knowing how much Armour you'll get with your current strength:
    40 * Str / 100


    How are tanks against magic damage? Uhm.. More or less the same as before.
    Warrior has ignore pain, but struggles just as much on magic as before. Except spell reflection is a thing now.
    DK struggles more than before. Just like physical damage, a DK will heal back, it will not mitigate, and it has AMS.
    Paladin can talent into being able to block it, however this is currently bugged so I can't tell how it'll work (As block increases armour on the hit, no longer reducing a flat damage %.)
    Monk is powerless now.
    Druid can't mitigate it too well either.
     
  11. Awze

    Awze Veteran

    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    8
    yeah sadly enough they're going to but kind of just wanted a feel of what would be happening with those abilities. regardless of if numbers change I doublt it'll be too drastic of a change.
    huh that's interesting what was your health pool too seeing the numbers are so low?
     
  12. OP
    Shinela

    Shinela Not your everyday tank Guardians of the 70s

    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Raids right now are bugged. A level 110 is barely able to solo Sunwell, and struggles to do so. Kil'jaeden couldn't be beaten by my friend.
    On my 70, I take 6k damage per hit from the first mob, being 40% of my hp. This has been reported.

    ilvl boost is not in effect. I tested this in both dungeons and raids. I'm assuming they failed to scale the item levels, which I reported. If not, then ilvl in general is now a forgotten piece in general.

    Stats have been decreased, gems are more or less the same (10 primary, 19 secondary). Enchants have overall been nerfed too. I'm getting into the exact numbers of those later, when we're closer to the release.
    --- Double Post Merged, Jun 13, 2018, Original Post Date: Jun 13, 2018 ---
    13.5k
     
  13. Dreams

    Dreams saved

    Messages:
    1,672
    Likes Received:
    445
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Huh, it's disappointing and worrying that the beta is that incomplete so close to launch.
     
  14. Chey

    Chey Veteran

    Messages:
    212
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    28
    It looks like tanks will be able to move away from versa builds and main stats for tanks will be superior, given it increases armor etc and at least for Druid I know it increases defensive abilities such as iron fur? Thoughts
     
  15. Dannymcbride

    Dannymcbride Member

    Messages:
    275
    Likes Received:
    179
    Trophy Points:
    43
    "Raids right now are bugged. A level 110 is barely able to solo Sunwell, and struggles to do so. Kil'jaeden couldn't be beaten by my friend.
    On my 70, I take 6k damage per hit from the first mob, being 40% of my hp. This has been reported."

    this why I havnt tested to much more stuff on 70's cause numbers are so off atm. wpvp scalling is terrible atm.
     
  16. Gixxer66

    Gixxer66 Member

    Messages:
    369
    Likes Received:
    76
    Trophy Points:
    38
    It might be off but it sure is a lot of fun on a 60 or a 70 even without any of the bugged items.
     
  17. Dannymcbride

    Dannymcbride Member

    Messages:
    275
    Likes Received:
    179
    Trophy Points:
    43
    yeah I have a blast on my 70 on BETA atm :) so much fun on him, but its not goin to stay this way and if anyone trys to pull numbers thinking its going to stay that way they are mistaken.
     
  18. Zoke

    Zoke Member

    Messages:
    207
    Likes Received:
    37
    Trophy Points:
    78
    id help with the dps part, but all of the things im interested in are unfortunately best left until live.

    have you checked out the enchants yet? scaling and any new ones are what im most interested in atm.
     
  19. Razqt

    Razqt yo whats good

    Messages:
    1,398
    Likes Received:
    408
    Trophy Points:
    133
    looks like leatherworking leg enchants are getting nerfed, i copied my 70 rogue and the enchant gave 12 agility 8 crit, however in the leatherworking tooltip it says 10 agility 5 crit, dunno if its correct etc but could be something
     
  20. Blackberryy

    Blackberryy 70-79 Coordinator Moderator 70-79 Coordinator

    Messages:
    778
    Likes Received:
    312
    Trophy Points:
    123
    This is because you have the older enchant already placed onto your legs. And the new one is not as good as it’s grandfathered counterpart and all enchants were nerfed
     

Users Who Have Read This Thread (Total: 0)

Share This Page