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EU+US 409 Int Trinket VS 359 Str+Mastery Trinket

Discussion in 'Level 80-89' started by Liarea, Feb 19, 2018.

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  1. Liarea

    Liarea Member

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    Hello boys,

    In terms of instance PVE, I was wondering if getting a second 409 int trinket to replace my Alch trinket would be a good idea. I'm a prot paladin, so I obviously don't benefit from the intellect, but the ilvl increase seems like it would make up for the loss of stats.

    I'm currently at 383 ilvl, and the only upgrades I can seem to find at the moment is the 409 int trinket and the 420 epic shield (only up from 417 currently).
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2018
  2. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    Stats dosent matter just ilvl and armortype(5% or what ever % it is on main stats). So get the other trinket and some plate gloves
     
  3. ohti

    ohti Member

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    I mean if you are making an ilvl char personally I would go to 89 (I know, 89) and go ret or hpal cuz like I can't imagine that a level 80 prot pally can do too much in bgs. Also, if you use those cloth gloves you have on in bgs you lose like 5% stats, wear all plate.
     
  4. OP
    Liarea

    Liarea Member

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    I goofed, I was referring to instanced PVE. That was quite the mental typo.
     
  5. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    If its for pve both int trinkets are bad
     
  6. OP
    Liarea

    Liarea Member

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    How so? I'd imagine the ilvl scaling more than makes up for the stat loss for at least one of the trinkets. This is just for instanced PVE, of course.
     
  7. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    Uhm do you know what pve and pvp is? lol xD
    Your item level dosent matter in pve, just your stats.
     
  8. jackfrost

    jackfrost Member

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  9. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    tl;dr
    Where in that link dose it say that having a higher ilvl would make prefor better in pve?

    Also its not tbc anymore where protpaladins would like some sp or sp-rogues could do okey.
     
  10. jackfrost

    jackfrost Member

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    The math / formula and how it works is where it says it.

    I even linked the reddit thread for an easier to read explanation.

    It's not the stats, its the ilevel itself.

    edit: to answer OP, in instanced PVE, the higher ilevel outweighs the stats basically.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2018
  11. Blackberryy

    Blackberryy 70-79 Coordinator Moderator Coordinator

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    You are obviously misinformed. Ilvl plays a huge stat weight in pve, it is the difference between 4K dps and upwards of 20k. Go ahead and put on a set with 10 full ilvls more than average and you tell me what you find. Arguing a point you know nothing about isn’t the best way to do anything
     
  12. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    Did it, got exactly the same numbers. Same highest dmg, same lowest and same avrage.
    First set i used had an avrage ilvl of 33,62 lower then the second set. The only stats that was lower in the first set was 20 sta and 46 armor (which dosent do anything).

    Also tried to add 1 agi, instantly noticed an increas in damage (lowest, highest and avrage). But what you are saying is that getting your avrage ilvl up by 3.125, but lose 33 str and 14 mastry, could increase your damage?

    All testing was done in a dungeon, same type of mob and same level.
    And just to be clear the post first said instanced pvp, not pve.
     
  13. Blackberryy

    Blackberryy 70-79 Coordinator Moderator Coordinator

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    Let me rephrase what I'm saying since you still don't understand. This only works for raids and heroics. Normal dungeons are no longer affected as of 7.3.5
     
  14. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    What made you think i did not understand what you ment?
    You could just have said it dosent work in normal mode. The links the other guy posted was 2-3 years old and obviously says nothing about changes in 7.3.5.
     
  15. Blackberryy

    Blackberryy 70-79 Coordinator Moderator Coordinator

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    My apology’s, before 7.3.5 it was all pve instances content. Now normals have nothing to do with Ilvl. But heroics and raids do
     
  16. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    Its still a pretty stupid design, but i guess it just for beeing bad/ lazzy at statsquishes.
    Will be intressting to see what will happen when 8.0 comes. I mean as it is now 10-man t7 have more stats than hc t10 (atleast some pieces)
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2018
  17. Blackberryy

    Blackberryy 70-79 Coordinator Moderator Coordinator

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    Yeah, they definayely made the gap smaller this patch, but didn't fix it. I'm really excited for another stat squish and the chance to have gear matter in pvp. I also think people misinterpret how the stat squish will go. Just because max levels on alpha are doing those numbers don't mean our numbers won't be far above what blizzard designated to our level since we are twinks.
     
  18. ialalala

    ialalala Veteran

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    Idd, would atleast be nice to be able to choose what secondary stats you want max out in pvp.
    Fyi mistyped in last post, t7 have a bigger statpool than hc t10 ><
     
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  19. jackfrost

    jackfrost Member

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    The problem is you're (apparently) ignoring parts of my quote... the item level of your "test" suggests a character around L60.

    Firstly, as quoted, you won't see a big difference (or any) at that item level from ilevel becase the formula is a very gradual bonus, and it's based off your character level combined with your item level compared to the "expected" item level from that expansion, and in that particular character level, you only get a tiny bonus:

    Code:
    MaxPlayerLevelsByExpansion = {69, 79, 84, 89, 0, 0}
    IntendedItemLevelByExpansion = {65, 115, 200, 346, 0, 0}
    It expects your item level to be above 65 if your character level is 69 or under... if it's above that amount while fighting equivalent level mobs (because there's a different formula for significant differences in character vs mob levels), then you do
    Code:
    AlternateDamageDealtFactor = 1 + 5/3*0.01 * (PlayerEquippedItemLevel - IntendedItemLevel)
    or in your case
    Code:
    AlternateDamageDealtFactor = 1 + 5/3*0.01 * (92 - 65)
    
    which, in your test example would basically be a tiny difference.

    However, for an 80 twink (this forum's bracket), or a 78 twink, the expected item level is VASTLY lower than can be achieved by twinking.

    For example, for a L79 character, it expects an item level of 115 and my L78 twink is item level 308... almost 3x higher than expected, so the formula would be much more beneficial:

    Code:
    AlternateDamageDealtFactor = 1 + 5/3*0.01 * (308 - 115)
    Incorrect, it still works for normal dungeons as of 7.3.5... at least for the damage reduction part (haven't tested the damage done part, but not sure why they'd change one part and not the other).

    Take a L78 twink (just tested it on a ilevel 308 one) into HFR and you can test it yourself. L77-L78 mobs (and L79 bosses) will do between 16 and 45 dmg per hit.

    I'm almost done with this topic, I'll try to test the damage part later though...
     
  20. Blackberryy

    Blackberryy 70-79 Coordinator Moderator Coordinator

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    and youre incorrect, because this is an insane exception since the game now caters to an ilvl ceiling in those 70-79 dungeons far lower than the 308s and 283s you have now. as of 7.3.5 with the scaleing normal toons will not be able to reach an ilvl high enough to break the ceiling in normals since they scale now from 60-80 for these brackets in particular. 79 is a unique exception only because your old ilvl gear being so vastly superior to the ceiling, those armor pieces are the only way an exception to the rule exists. 70-77 level toons will not see an ilvl increas in normal dungeons because they cannot reach the ilvl required. does that help you more?

    also hes talking about the x10 levels, so your 79 comcept isn't even relevent in this discussion, who pves at 79 lol
     

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