Walrusbreath
Grandfathered
There is no opinion about the fact that the ideal of equality did not stem from Marxism, or women making 80% of the pay of men, or the rest of your ridiculous right-wing screed being provably asinine.
Thought police
- Thread starter AlisterCrow
- Start date
Bestworld
MBA
Ok, so you did not read my response, good to know. Keep going through life like that with your blinders attached. Sad really.
Walrusbreath
Grandfathered
Your response was read and was found to be ridiculous, excessively partisan and biased. IOW, intentionally inaccurate.
Basically...lies.
Basically...lies.
Bestworld
MBA
Lies? how? Explain to me.
So you are telling me, that a statistic that is generalizing annual income of male vs female, and does NOT take details into account such as occupation and performed tasks, education, experience etc. which is HIGHLY FUCKING RELEVANT is a valid statistic to bring forth?
Yeah, someone fresh out of school should get paid as much as someone with 7 year experience!
Someone with a less ranking education should get paid the same!
Also, there should be no diversity of income in jobs. Everyone, no matter the job, should get paid the same!
Where is your reality check?
You are either one hell of a troll, or actually just someone who refuses to take in ANY critic and lives in his own bubble.
Walrusbreath
Grandfathered
It has nothing to do with specific occupation, diversity, or time on the job/experience, because it takes it ALL into account. Women or men that have little XP or a lot, on any/all jobs, of whatever race/ethnicity, and so on.
Because the question is whether women make less than men overall. They do, only 80%.
Because the question is whether women make less than men overall. They do, only 80%.
Bestworld
MBA
Now who's telling the lies lmao xdddd
What you presented wasn't an apples = apples approach. You took generalized data and presented it as a statistic to try and prove your claims when clearly all the details are lacking.
Dragpz
Grandfathered
It isn't a secret that men, on average make more than women. But the real question is why they make more than women. And, also why should we really care? Is enforcing parity for the sake of a statistic really worth it in the end? I'm sure there are multitudes of reasons why this discrepancy exists and tons more for why it doesn't really matter.
And the whole "Google" censorship stuff, just don't use Google, plain and simple.
And the whole "Google" censorship stuff, just don't use Google, plain and simple.
Iild
big pwner never small pwn
Gender Pay Gap is a myth in the sense that if 2 people were in the same role at a workplace the woman would make 80% of the man's wages, whereas if you look at the whole country it's possibly true yes
However that's not reason enough to cry out foul-play, it's a fact that women show less interest in business and science careers, that's their fault not equality's fault.
Hiring women to fill a quota required for a workplace is also ridiculous, same with races. Best applicant can go out the window if you're required to hire a minimum of 2 women/people of color.
How comes no women are causing an outcry because garages are exclusively men? or electricians? builders? garbage men?
Talking about white men expecting everything to fall into their laps lmao
However that's not reason enough to cry out foul-play, it's a fact that women show less interest in business and science careers, that's their fault not equality's fault.
Hiring women to fill a quota required for a workplace is also ridiculous, same with races. Best applicant can go out the window if you're required to hire a minimum of 2 women/people of color.
How comes no women are causing an outcry because garages are exclusively men? or electricians? builders? garbage men?
Talking about white men expecting everything to fall into their laps lmao
Ohai
OG
I'm back, its like a train-wreck I can't help it.
At this point he's backed off trying to make any kind of point, and is righteously standing by his claim that the pay gap is 20% when you remove all context from the numbers.
He has no interest in speaking to how to resolve that, because SURPRISE! The next step would require you to actually start working with that 20% number to find the root causes for the disparity. Which... would boil down to education, priority of family, additional hours worked, and job selection, before looking at stuff like socialization regarding salary negotiations or actual sexism. But at least he's technically correct - when you throw a meaningless statistic out - it turns out you're not directly telling any lies!
At this point he's backed off trying to make any kind of point, and is righteously standing by his claim that the pay gap is 20% when you remove all context from the numbers.
He has no interest in speaking to how to resolve that, because SURPRISE! The next step would require you to actually start working with that 20% number to find the root causes for the disparity. Which... would boil down to education, priority of family, additional hours worked, and job selection, before looking at stuff like socialization regarding salary negotiations or actual sexism. But at least he's technically correct - when you throw a meaningless statistic out - it turns out you're not directly telling any lies!
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Idiot
Vitor Belfort '97 hand speed
So, I think the saddest part of all of this, is that we are having to explain how the world works to grown ass adults. Let that sink in. It is quite amusing and depressing at the same time. Oy vey.
Also, Walrusbreath is known as THEE village idiot round these parts. My advice: don't attempt to reason with the guy, he's too set in his ways to budge (if you're to the right of him on the political spectrum, you are a neo-nazi/fascist/racist/Philanthrophising mysogynist patriarchal pig). Typical indoctrinated SJW with blinders on.
Also, Walrusbreath is known as THEE village idiot round these parts. My advice: don't attempt to reason with the guy, he's too set in his ways to budge (if you're to the right of him on the political spectrum, you are a neo-nazi/fascist/racist/Philanthrophising mysogynist patriarchal pig). Typical indoctrinated SJW with blinders on.
Selaya
Guest
wow this escalated
Walrusbreath
Grandfathered
So you think using internet memes like "SJW" because someone points out an obvious situation is valid? It suddenly makes you and your fellow traveler's idiocy true?
Yeah, to total morons who can't stand being challenged on their fallacies, all they can do is mock. That's easier than having any defensible argument.
How about we just pay people the same for the same job performance, period, and not give a shit about their gender, race, etc? Or are "conservative" crazy white guys scared of something - like being outdone by a girl? Or is it a control issue?
Same old big-talking tough guy bullshit but in reality they're fucking cowards.
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Allybeboba
Legend
Bestworld
MBA
I'm gonna start a business and hire only women. Statistically, they earn less, so I should have pretty good profits as opposed to hiring any men. Straight pimpin'. (inb4 Walrus makes a fuss over the joke again)
Thing is, if you look at an EARNINGS gap and view it as a WAGE GAP, then you are literally in the wrong. Really that simple.
Men and women prioritize differently when it comes to education, caereer, workhours, leave of absence (Materinity leave, kids sick days, to start a family etc.), employee-benifits and a lot of other things. Generally speaking. And it is the general people that make up the statistics.
And on top of all that you factor in experience, performing tasks etc. Even within each respective field, there can be sub-categories which are also neglected. "Doctors". A doctor is not just a doctor. Each doctor has their prefered medical field, in which some are paid more. Women tend to go towards the lesser paid fields such family medicine. You cannot generalize and present an earnings gap as a wage gap.
Pretty important that people have different interests as well.
Thing is, if you look at an EARNINGS gap and view it as a WAGE GAP, then you are literally in the wrong. Really that simple.
Men and women prioritize differently when it comes to education, caereer, workhours, leave of absence (Materinity leave, kids sick days, to start a family etc.), employee-benifits and a lot of other things. Generally speaking. And it is the general people that make up the statistics.
And on top of all that you factor in experience, performing tasks etc. Even within each respective field, there can be sub-categories which are also neglected. "Doctors". A doctor is not just a doctor. Each doctor has their prefered medical field, in which some are paid more. Women tend to go towards the lesser paid fields such family medicine. You cannot generalize and present an earnings gap as a wage gap.
Pretty important that people have different interests as well.
Bestworld
MBA
Nah, just indirectly xddd
Dorigon
Alpha and Omega
Welcome to capitalism. You
You ought to make a blog and get all that angst out.
Walrusbreath
Grandfathered
What you meant to say is, "I have no argument so I'll just create more memes."
Walrusbreath
Grandfathered
Bypassing most of your useless bullshit (and your post here is all of that)...when a woman performs at a job it has nothing to do with "prioritizing" anything else. She's now at the same job that a man is and their job duties are the same. Therefore they should get paid the same and same bennies. None of your tangential excuses about maternity, kids, blah blah account for that.
The end.
Iild
big pwner never small pwn
Ohai
OG
I was thinking given what I'd read so far from you, you'd understand that your graph is not in any way representative of the concept of "equal pay for equal work". The graph you linked does not represent equal work. You'd have to be exceedingly stupid, or willfully ignorant to not understand that to start talking about equal pay for equal work, you need to look at like-for-like statistics within individual career paths. Ignoring that many women go into the humanities and teaching, and many men go into STEM or dangerous jobs, and then further ignoring the concept that those jobs pay vastly differing amounts is just mind-blowing. You cannot throw entire genders average salaries at each other and hope to come out with a meaningful number.
Personally, I was hoping you'd remain logically consistent and suggest a flat 10% tax on male citizens with that being paid out to the female workforce. Or perhaps you'd solve it by creating a law that all hourly and salary rates are identical for all jobs regardless of work type. At least at that point all I could say is that you understood what you were talking about, but have a radical outlook on the way jobs should be structured and the way people should be paid.
They are not tangential if you want to talk about equal work. They do account for as much as 75% of the "Gender Pay Gap" figure you're sticking to. You're throwing out a misleading number, and the amount of that 20% that can be attributed to actual real sexism and favoritism is about 3-7%. I am center-left, but I get mildly annoyed when people start throwing figures around that are disingenuous.
Personally, I was hoping you'd remain logically consistent and suggest a flat 10% tax on male citizens with that being paid out to the female workforce. Or perhaps you'd solve it by creating a law that all hourly and salary rates are identical for all jobs regardless of work type. At least at that point all I could say is that you understood what you were talking about, but have a radical outlook on the way jobs should be structured and the way people should be paid.
They are not tangential if you want to talk about equal work. They do account for as much as 75% of the "Gender Pay Gap" figure you're sticking to. You're throwing out a misleading number, and the amount of that 20% that can be attributed to actual real sexism and favoritism is about 3-7%. I am center-left, but I get mildly annoyed when people start throwing figures around that are disingenuous.